How to make a dealership excellent?

In reply to mguar:

Maybe I have been lucky but my experience has been exactly the oposite of what you are trying to say. I have never bought a new car and unless I hit the Lotto never will.

My current DD is an 03 9-5 Aero, we got it in 2006 with @ 90K on it. We paid cash for the car for 1/4 of what it cost new. It now has almost 170K on it and aside from tires and brake pads I have had to but a grand total of $8 into it for stuff that has broken.

Again this may not be the norm but in my car buying experience this is generally the way things work out.

Hal wrote: We are going to get her a new car in the next month or so. I have $40K in the budget for it. We won't be getting a new Buick!

You need to let the Buick dealer know that.

I work at a dealership in the service department. I get customers in all the time who complain about the salesmen and I have to defend them, kinda. If I want the customer to keep returning to the dealership for not only service, but future car purchase I do need to clear things up between the customer and salesman. The one thing that agrivates me more than anything is the salesman's lack of basic knowledge about the vehicle and complete lack of informing the customer of routine maintenance needs. I know that sounds stupid, but if you inform the customer of their major services and present it in a way that the services will keep the vehicle running, help save money in the long run, etc., then it makes everyone's life easier. You have no idea how many times I show a customer the 30k recommendations and they flip out and say, "My salesman didn't tell me I needed to do any of this crap!" Then we're back to defending them again... Just let your customers know that everyone there is employed solely to help them and keep their vehicle in tip top condition. Introduce them to the service advisors. Walk them through the shop and show them how well staffed and equipped you are. Introduce them to one or 2 techs (if your techs are people friendly at all, most aren't). That's just how I see things from where I sit...

ls1fiero - There are a number of us from Atlanta. Let us know if you would be interested in having anyone stop by, chat with your sales staff, take a test drive, then get back to you with their impressions.

mguar wrote: Higher interest costs, budget for maintenance that is not needed the 1st 1/2 of new car ownership and Not being able to " buy" your own used car free of profit and inflation..

If you change the assumptions to paying cash for the car, a 36,000 or 50,000 mile warranty instead of 100,000, the owner can do some basic maintenance, and comprehensive insurance that covers replacement value of the car, my experience has been that new cars don't work out as well for me as they have for you. Take my current BMW, which I have owned since 2009 - call it 3 years even.

Initial purchase: $7500
New Koni shocks: About $750
Replacing a wheel bearing: $200 including machine work
Replacement radiator: $200 including coolant
New cooling fan: $250
Tires: $700
2 alignments, because the first wasn't done right: $250
Other misc repairs: $600 or so Total: $10450

So, about $3500 a year so far, and that's not even subtracting out the current value. And I've put about 70,000 miles on it in those 3 years. A new 328 convertible (to make this apples to apples, even though I probably won't be buying a convertible next time) would run $47600 or more according to BMW's website. If I could keep it on the road 20 years with no maintenance costs, that would be $2380 a year - but at the rate I'm going, that also means not needing any repairs or tires for 460,000+ miles. If we assume no repairs for 4 years and the same repair costs as my current 328, that would work out to $3200 a year and imply that the two options more or less break even.

That's surprising; I would have though the difference would be a lot bigger. An interesting though experiment, but given the concerns I've seen on BMW forums about breaking expensive parts on the newer ones, I have to wonder how realistic a $1,000 annual maintenance cost assumption is, particularly if one is trying to put nearly half a million miles on the car!

On the other hand, if we subtract out the current market value of my car - call it around $4500 - I'm at $2000 a year. Still a bit surprised the numbers worked out anywhere near close.

It sound the the recurring themes here are:
1. Be honest and honorable
2. Know your product and your inventory
3. Don't play games
4. Give great service after the sale

Type Q wrote: It sound the the recurring themes here are: 1. Be honest and honorable 2. Know your product and your inventory 3. Don't play games 4. Give great service after the sale

Yeah, what he said...

Another thing not seen by the "public" is making sure your staff is happy. Make sure they're comfortable where they are. Make sure they're getting their paychecks. Make sure you don't have any "Dealership Bullies" trying to steal sales or anything like that. You'd be surprised what you don't see going on. Happy staff = more $$$

ProDarwin wrote: -If you sell used cars, don't sell broken used cars. I've checked out many used cars on a dealer lot and they have the check engine light on. I'll ask what the issue is and they just shrug. "I dunno." You dumb asses, you have the tools to check that in 2 minutes. Maybe its the berkeleying gas cap is loose and you can tighten it down. Wouldn't that make the car easier to sell?

This x a billion! Don't tell me with a straight face that your car passed your (new & used dealer) 87-point inspection when the CEL and ABS lights are on and it won't stop to save it's life.

Don't tell me the car has never been hit when it has 1 old and 1 new headlight, a nice and shiny fender and door next to a scratched up hood, and different emblems side-to-side.

Don't tell me that your truck has passed through the shop and is 100% "good to go" when the engine catches berkeleying fire on the test drive. Don't tell me it's all okay 10 minutes later after cleatus put it out with an extinguisher and poked around a little bit.

Stealthtercel wrote: My sister wanted a specific model of new car with a manual transmission. She called around to a few dealers.

This, also, x a lot. I have wasted more time going to see a car and find out it's an auto (or the wrong model/trim, or not with the options I asked about, etc, etc) then I care to admit. I hate that! If I ask if a car has a manual transmission with a clutch pedal, don't say "yes" and then be surprised when I cuss you out after a 3 hour drive when it's an auto-freaking-matic.

Also, when I call and ask "Does car A have cloth or leather?" don't tell me you can find out and call me back. It takes 30 seconds to walk out the damn door and look inside the car.

Matt, I'm not following your math...

Your car depreciation + repairs have cost you $6K in 3 years - or 2K/year The $47,600 2013 328i will depreciate ~35-40% in 3 years (average depreciation numbers per the Google). That's $16K, or ~$5300 a year, assuming zero maintenance costs.

Seems like a big difference to me.

ProDarwin wrote: Matt, I'm not following your math... Your car depreciation + repairs have cost you $6K in 3 years - or 2K/year The $47,600 2013 328i will depreciate ~35-40% in 3 years (average depreciation numbers per the Google). That's $16K, or ~$5300 a year, assuming zero maintenance costs. Seems like a big difference to me.

Yes, but I wasn't going for keeping it 3 years - I was following mgaur's post about buying new and driving it into the ground. So the math was based on the 3 years I've kept a used car vs trying to keep a new 328 on the road for 20 years.

Javelin wrote: Don't tell me that your truck has passed through the shop and is 100% "good to go" when the engine catches *berkeleying fire* on the test drive. Don't tell me it's all okay 10 minutes later after cleatus put it out with an extinguisher and poked around a little bit.

You win.

BoxheadTim wrote:

Javelin wrote: Don't tell me that your truck has passed through the shop and is 100% "good to go" when the engine catches *berkeleying fire* on the test drive. Don't tell me it's all okay 10 minutes later after cleatus put it out with an extinguisher and poked around a little bit.

You win.

Gage Auto Sales in Milwaukie, OR. Red 96 Nissan King Cab 4x4. ~2005. Read some their reviews online (written by real people and not their sales people, which seems to be really common for all dealers...).

In reply to mguar:

Uh huh, and how hard is it for the inventory manager to put some basic info about the car (you know, stuff like what MAKE and MODEL it is along with TRANSMISSION) into their online database? Which takes about 1 second to look up for the sales guy.

This is 2012, it's inexcusable to have no/poor knowledge about your inventory, period.

mguar wrote: In reply to Conquest351: What you say really makes sense except the salesman should do it.. Seriously his job is to get a signed deal. That's what he needs to focus on, not the operators manual or what tire pressures to run. It's a really tough job to achieve that.. But he needs to take the customer back and introduce him to the service manager. The service manager needs to know enough about people skills to know when to stop providing the customer with details.. Most people have a limited ability to assimilate information.. With some it's how do I operate the car, others it's how does the voice commands work, and others will still be excited when you've finished covering the last page of the owners manual..

You're right, it's not their job to tell them about everything, BUT, completely failing to mention that the new 6.7 Powerstroke takes DEF at every oil change and costs $8-$9 a gallon really pisses me off when they come in for their 1st oil change. The first one is free, so they don't pay, but they see the price so they know what to expect in the future. When they freak the hell out, that's when I get mad at the salesman neglecting to inform the customer.

I worked in dealerships for 6 years - Then onto a marketing manager @ GM . Even went to Northwood University in Michigan and took automotive marketing.

Good luck getting the system to change.

The only way you would ever see a positive change is if the dealerships were corporate owned with staff in position that didn't pay them percentage of profits..

Run like any other store that just retail goods.

Not a single idea in 3 pages isn't something I haven't heard before. Be it in a meeting @ GM or in a dealership lunchroom. You want to change the way you do business...don' concentrate your efforts on the surface, concentrate on the source.

In reply to mguar:

If your dealership doesn't have online ads, you are lying. Even the most backwoods, old school lot has craigslist ads. EVERY new car dealer has an inventory online.

But hey, you're obviously right, so I will concede.

Javelin wrote: In reply to mguar: If your dealership doesn't have online ads, you are lying. Even the most backwoods, old school lot has craigslist ads. EVERY new car dealer has an inventory online. But hey, you're obviously right, so I will concede.

The internet doesn't exist. I lost track when last week he said he had a job, had a Trailblazer instead of this 1996 whatever truck he's talking about now that he's taking halfway across the country for a job interview for... i don't know? Just said last week he got a new job.

I'm confused.

But he's the only person i've ever seen in my life work out that a new car is cheaper than a used one, so we're all doing it wrong. Ugh.

mguar wrote: In reply to Rusted_Busted_Spit: Do me a favor will you? Just do this privately.. Calculate what you will spend on a car for the next 20 years. Ignore stuff like gas oil changes etc. those will pretty much be the same new or used) Add whatever you have spent on fixing cars over the last 20 years.. (if you don't have 20 years do 10 years and multiply by 2 or 5 years and multiply times 4etc..) Yes to be fair you need to count those aftermarket wheels or whatever upgrades you added (since you could buy a new car with all those toys on already) However do adjust for inflation.. use 10,000 miles a year for simplicity. Now take say $20,000 and divide by 20 years.. or $1000 a year plus the last decade of maintenance.

I got $42. Does this mean i win or lose?

mguar wrote: In reply to Javelin: Yes they certainly do list SOME cars on line.. Not all the information is on their ads.. (if it was you could just buy it on line couldn't you?) You stated it would only take a salesman 30 seconds to check on a car but I just explained why it takes longer..

And Mr Javelin just explained why it shouldn't take an act of berkeleying congress to have such information available. It comes down to LAZY EMPLOYEES. Just like having a few simple photos of the car in the "ad". If you aren't listing some information, I should be able to see with my eyes what it has and what it doesn't have.

Oh and if you think anyone in their freaking mind is going to keep a car 20 years, I have your freshly pressed and bleached straight jacket right here waiting on you.

This is a very interesting question because the snap answer is, well, most of this topic. The problem is that we are the 1%. 99% of the people want an appliance, know nothing about cars, and don't care. My ex-family owned motorcycle/powersports stores. You would think the bulk of that business would be passionate guys. Nope. Most of the customers were ones where you could maximize your profit and sell your inventory because they really didn't care.

OK, so how to answer your question? I would think about starting a separate area. When GM wanted to target a group, they built a brand (Saturn) and required all of the stores to be stand-alone. Fiat tried to differentiate, and Toyota wouldn't let Toy and Lex co-mingle. Add to this the concept of something like Ford SVT. If you want enthusiasts, differentiate a small slice of the business. If it is successful, you'll know it. If it isn't, you can go back to business as usual.

Create a name for your special enthusiast/performance group. Get visible in the local community and forums (if you want to sell parts over the internet). Make it clear that there is a niche part of the dealership that caters to the niche enthusiasts, and publicize the specific people to contact to get the enthusiast treatment. Then make sure that your employees are passionate, knowledgeable and non-BSing. Host shop or detail days, tire changing discounts, offer to install performance parts, etc. and be able to do dealer searches (or stock) manual trans cars.

Will it work? I don't know. I'm skeptical. I think that the sad fact is that the 99% will rule the day, and dealerships will continue the model that is successful to the chagrin of the enthusiasts.

In reply to mguar:

But here is the problem, it's this pesky thing called LIFE that gets in the way. No one can predict that they will need a school bus to cart the family around or if a Miata will suffice. So even by your own admission, there isn't "one" car that can fit all, unless you got some crystal ball predicting the future.

BTW, I'll stick to my used piles of E36 M3. One big glaring advantage, my buy-in doesn't require my first born like it does now. My latest used vehicle, 1995 Dakota, has cost a radiator, hoses, and a water pump that required immediate replacement, $250. Then there is the ball joints, spindles, and lowering blocks, $400. All in 6 yrs or ownership..... But I'll gloss over the fact I need a new ignition lock cylinder (screwdriver just works fine), heater core (it's berkeleying summer out now), AC compressor (windows work fine even here in HELL), clutch fan (I don't stop at lights and idle for minutes on end), and it's a damn anemic 3.9L V6 (the 5.7 Hemi I have on the stand sounds like a winner)....

So inflation is a good thing now because you make "profit"? Seriously thats just economical illiteracy at its best. It's like inflation doesn't = devaluation in his deluded world.

mguar wrote: So knowing that why not hang onto those vehicles?

Because AADD makes my hoard difficult to control.

The responses on all ends of this thing are so well thought out and spoken with passion. Of course we all have different perspectives. That's why the question was posed. I am highly appreciative for each post and of the fact that we can respect the differing opinions of others here.