HPDE With A 2005 Matrix XRS? - Good or a Recipe For Disaster

Hello All,

I am looking to replace our trusty (and rusty) 2002 Focus sedan with a slightly newer vehicle that will haul both the kids and our 30lb Beagle better.

My wife likes the Toyota Matrix, and I found a nice looking 2005 XRS model at a local dealer. One of the things on my wish list is that I would like to be able to participate in the occasional HPDE track day, or Open Track Day with it. I know the GRM nuked a couple of Camry engines on the track, but I was wondering if the 2ZZ-GE engine from the XRS suffered the same kind of issues associated with track use?

Also, is there much of an aftermarket for mild upgrades to the Matrix's (i.e. coil-overs, brakes, sway bars, etc.)? Is there any thing that I should know about before going to the dealer to possibly negotiate?

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Thanks in advance!

Martin

The point of a track day is to drive your vehicle within it's capabilities. Limit your runs, give things time to cool down. Hey, it's not a race.

Anything can be raced, even turtles...

I would leave everything alone except for the oil pan (and maybe the precats, don't remember if the 2zz has that problem too). Install this before you get too crazy with it as that engine series (1zz and 2zz) like to starve bearings in long corners: http://www.monkeywrenchracing.com/product_info.php?products_id=799

In reply to iceracer:

Oh absolutely, this is going to be a DD for us (secondary DD, but still DD), so I will not be looking to push the limits too far, but I want to make sure that there are no critical flaws in the general design before I take it to a track. I guess I am looking to see if it will starve for oil in a longer sweeper, the cooling system is undersized, or if hard cornering will cause a stress crack in a subframe mount, or shear a sway bar mount, etc.

I have a 1991 Miata that I am selling. I used to slalom it, but the venue stopped hosting slaloms, and there were a few small things that needed repair/upgrades on the Miata that I wasn't willing to do before taking it on a full sized track (like a foam-ectomy to pass the broomstick test, and the brakes would need upgrading most likely). My next car I would like to be able to do 1-5 track days a year with.

In reply to singleslammer:

Awesome, thank you. That is exactly the kind of info I need to make an educated decision.

Martin

You should be fine running around in HPDE1 with all season tires.

Its when you start running stickier tires in higher run groups that you start compounding problems and spending cubic dollars to make a non sports car into a track toy.

Believe me, i have been tracking a Chevy Malibu for 4 years and have just spent a bunch of money to keep it from destroying itself running sticky tires.

If this is your DD i would say start with better brake pads that wont have terrible noise on the street. Run some extra camber, I was running around 2 degrees front and 1.4 back when i was on all seasons. Make sure tire pressure is high enough to not roll onto the tires sidewalls, and add somewhere between 1/4 - 1/3 of a quart of oil above full to help keep everything cool and lubed.

At least thats what worked for me.

The 2ZZ oil starvation problem definitely needs to be addressed before ANY track work. Shame that the solution is an expensive Moroso pan, but them's the breaks. Do a brake fluid flush and swap out to some performance pads beforehand as well and you should be fine. Oh, and avoid the money shift - lots of guys grenade their engines and transmissions by going from third to second at redline because the gates are so close together.

Monkeywrenchracing.com is the best performance source for all the 1ZZ/2ZZ cars it seems.

My experience with zz motors on track has been that if the oil level is maintained at the full level, they're fine, even with developed suspension and slicks. Precats iirc are a 1zz thing, but headers make power on zzs anyway, use it as an excuse to buy a nice header or better yet a tubo manifold

Track that bitch, she'll be fine.

The GF has a 1zz xr and she has been showing interest in doing more.

Btw does anyone know if a pre cat test pipe will through a CEl? Hers is blowing the manifold gasket

I don't think it would be an issue as long as you address the oil starvation issue..

As many have said oil starvation on track is the most prevalent issue with the 2ZZ. The #4 crank bearing tends to go. The Moroso pan is the expensive fix for this. A modified 1ZZ pan is the cheaper fix along with an oil pick-up lowering mod. The 1ZZ pan has internal baffles The 2ZZ pan is just a tub with no baffles. Make sure your oil is full (maybe even slightly over full) before any tracking. DDPR is a slightly cheaper alternative to MWR for parts and knowledge on 1ZZ and 2ZZ performance.

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Aside from the great advice given, they can fit decent sized tires, but do need more spring or bar in the rear.

I know the very similar Toyota RunX/Allex makes a decent track car.

Oil pan baffle and accusump are must haves. I had a friend that raced SSC with a Corolla XRS, and he went through about an engine a race, even baffled. At Road Atlanta he went through two engines in one weekend if I remember correctly. The higher CG made motor problems much worse than the equivalent Celica. Towards the end of the season, he got allowance for the accusump. I would not do it unless you are prepared to deal with the oil starvation issues.

Mr_Clutch42 wrote: <img src="

This. Those are very minor things to fix on your miata. Much cheaper and easier than the required mods on a Matrix.

Thank you to all for the information. I had a good chuckle at the LotR image above .

Yes, I agree that fixing the Miata is the easiest, except for one major issue: I'm selling it (Wanna buy it?). I am not using it anymore, and it is taking up a lot of garage space (actually, all of it, since I only have a single car garage). The plan is to sell the Miata, and my current DD (a 2002 Focus sedan), and buy something in a hatch style that can be somewhat fun on occasion. I need a new DD that will seat (simultaneously) 2 adults, 2 kids and a dog. Budget is a huge concern for the purchase, and some of the cars at the top of the list are still out of my price range (Mazdaspeed3, Focus ST, VW GTI, etc.)

I thought about a Honda Fit, Mazda2 and Fiesta, but there is just not quite enough room in the back for the dog to be really comfortable.

Thanks again for all the info. You have given me some good info to go and make some better cost estimates.

What about a MINI Cooper Clubman S? I know some people on here pick them apart, but mine was incredibly reliable for the 4 years that I owned it. I did brakes a total of once, and replaced the timing chain tensioner and thermostat housing as preventative maintenance. That's it.

In reply to racerdave600:

I didn't even think of them. They are not overly popular in our area, so I don't see many, but there is one local advertised. It looked ok, but when I showed my wife she immediately dismissed it becasue it is only a two door. She has a bit of a bad back and putting kids in car seats would be too much of a reach for her to do it comfortably. Thanks for the idea though! Maybe later when the kids are older and out of car seats...

The Clubmans are technically a 3 door, so there is a side access, but it's not as good as the others for sure. It is probably the best driver however. I looked at a 2010 Clubman S JCW the other day for 15k, it was very tempting.

Buy a Mazda Protege5 and be done with it!

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Well within your budget, corners really well out of the box, room for the kids and dog.

Mazdaspeed springs (.75" drop), quality struts, bronze shifter bushings on the B&M short-shifter, Brembo blanks and good pads really wake it up on the drivability/enjoyment front if you feel like modifying it.