Aeromoto wrote:jstein77 wrote:These Factory Five things are an affront to real hot rodding, as are any of the other plastic street rods kits. Steel is real. Plastic is for tampon applicators.Hot rodding is not dead, just modernized!
This guy's as bad as I am, hes just kiddin and gettin everybody all excited....
plance1 wrote:Aeromoto wrote:This guy's as bad as I am, hes just kiddin and gettin everybody all excited....jstein77 wrote:These Factory Five things are an affront to real hot rodding, as are any of the other plastic street rods kits. Steel is real. Plastic is for tampon applicators.
All I can say is, as a Billetproof show staff member, there's nothing finer than turning these plastic things away at the gate and then hearing their owners piss and moan as they speed away in a huff.
Ok, now youre the one who is kidding, right lol?
Hahaha. Maybe, maybe not. I usually try to avoid working the gate, anyway. But hey, rules are rules- no plastic, no billet 
Dude, your crackin me up. Or maybe vice versa.... these factory five cars are fiberglass, no?
yes it is fiberglass, just like their cobra kits
Thats what I thought....so tell me, when was the last time u checked the "faq" portion of your website?
Strike_Zero wrote: I had a convo with my Pops friend when I had my 04 GTO. He poo-pooed the modern GTO; "my 68 GTO would run circles around it", "It don't have dual exhaust", "where are the damn hood scoops, e'erybody knows Goats come with hood scoops", "my 68 would take your imports lunch money", "for what you paid for that furrin car, you coulda had the real thing"I took him for a spin in the furrin GTO. When we got back, my Pop asked him what he thought . . . . he left mumbling expletives and couldn't believe you could get that much car for (at the time) $17K. Pop told me his friend paid nearly $50K for his 68 GTO I would love a nice hot rod or muscle car . . . but have your seen the price of complete basket cases. "I got this 67 Camaro in the barn that straight. It needs floors, truck pan, and interior . . . I'll let it go for $7K"
My FIL and I had a similar conversation about my ms3 and his 67. We swapped cars for laughs. The GTO drove like a UPS truck, but was piles of fun. FIL's wig flipped when he grabbed rubber in 2nd on the ms3 and I told him the AC was on. He has a lot more respect for modern imports now. He however, can still do a better burnout than I can, and i'd argue that the GTO sounds better than my car.
plance1 wrote: Thats what I thought....so tell me, when was the last time u checked the "faq" portion of your website?
Ha! No, never, really. We just basically keep it to what is H.A.M.B. friendly. The show's owner leaves discretion up to us.
plance1 wrote: Thats what I thought....so tell me, when was the last time u checked the "faq" portion of your website?
Wow. When was the last time you did?
phaze1todd wrote:plance1 wrote: Thats what I thought....so tell me, when was the last time u checked the "faq" portion of your website?Wow. When was the last time you did?
I never heard of it so I once I realized the guy wasn't kidding I checked it out to see what the reverse snobbery was all about. So, to answer your question, about an hour ago. Here's what the rules say for this little clique:
•1964 and prior TRADITIONAL style rods and customs ONLY •No visible billet anything! Especially wheels! •No digital gauges •No IFS on fenderless cars •No trailer queens •No mag wheel styles made after the 60's •No high tech styled, pastel heart beat graphic, tweed interior, fenderless IFS sporting hot rods •Traditional looking choppers and bobbers ONLY! (No modern West Coast Choppers, OCC style bikes)
Nope, not seeing anything that would exclude a factory five hotrod here, maybe the wheels bother you? I dont know, seems like if the wheels are bullit aluminum then you just show up with a different set of wheels? Does that make a factory five car "cool enough" for ya lol?
Seriously, looking down the page a little further:
I have a fiberglass body car, can I bring it to the show? Yes.
Anywhoooooo....if you think someone who puts together a car from a kit, especially a factory five, is not a hot rodder then you've clearly lost your mind. But really though, I think Billit aluminum and digital gauges, pastel graphics, blah, blah, blah all died a natural death back in the 80's so exactly what are you "kool kats" rebelling against here? I see a bunch of guys dressed up like fonze prancing around talking about the upcoming shark jump...
To answer your question, I guess we would be rebelling against people who don't get it, kinda like you. The factory five contraption is certainly not a "hot rod", and it would not be allowed in, even with proper wheels, because it does not fit the flavor of the show, which is clearly traditional hot rodding. It would be considered a "street rod", and even that is pushing it. The two have little to do with one another. It wasn't too long ago that the factory five wouldn't even be allowed at an NSRA event, until they relaxed their standards in the name of the all mighty dollar.. Basically, a fiberglass rod would be allowed in if at first glance, it was not imediately evident that it was plastic, but a cookie-cutter cruise night "Streetbeast" style kit will get turned away, and with good reason because once again, it doesn't fit the definition of a traditional hot rod.
The H.A.M.B. appears to be the HOA of hotrodding. Sounds like buckets of fun.
ReverendDexter wrote:mndsm wrote: The REAL question is, why do all the domestic rodders hate imports so much.I've wondered this myself. The import guys are doing the exact same thing as the old-school hot rodders were, they just have a 50-year newer starting point. One thing I can say for the import guys, at least most of them actually DRIVE their damn cars.
This might be a little late but here's my worthless .02$. From my perspective, as a guy in his 20s, it's too flash for me and probably the "traditional" hot rod guys.
I grew up at the point in time where the import scene was starting to blow up and getting its bad reputation from a certain set of movies due to the posers that think it's gospel. I found the most visible elements of the import scene tend to be pretty substanceless. Just look at all the 300hp civics on craigslist with the body kits, big wheels, hellaflush stances, and pepboys wings that just "need a tune". Or go find an article in an import mag that talks about the never released, never photographed super ultra NSX that can lap the ring in record time was only sold to 4 people (Honda kept one because it's that awesome) but it's rumored to look like the NSX this guy did up with 1 of 0 special parts ordered from a grey market dealer on the back street of Hiroshima that survived the atomic weapon because it was protected by the souls of 30 angry ronin that were sent off die on the hillside as part of a proxy war while battling a little known brother of an emperor. (Ok I made up part of that but if I ever meet the author of the NSX article I'll stab him in the ear with a ballpoint pen.) You see what I mean about flash with no substance?
The aforementioned group is unfortunately the loudest group in the import scene. The guys and shops that actually do good work aren't as visible as all the loud exhaust wielding can't do fiberglass repair to their cracked never painted body kitted car jerks out there. At least not to the general public.
So the point is that the traditional guys don't want to be associated with them even if it is very similar to what they did around my age due to that reputation. Hell I don't want to be lumped in with them and I love me some Japanese cars.
Mitchell wrote: The H.A.M.B. appears to be the HOA of hotrodding. Sounds like buckets of fun.
I used to hang out there.....still have an account, but rarely use it. There are some REALLY talented fabricators there (e.g. John Kelly from GhiaSpecialties hangs out there), but the attitude gets old.
HAMBers share the DIY/low buck attitude of most GRMers, but that takes a back seat to being period correct. (GRMers will stuff an LSx into anything, since it is a cheap way to build things that peel your eyelids back when you hit the loud pedal. HAMBers would not do that, since LSx plants didn't exist back in the day.)
My datsun replica would get turned away from HAMB/Billetproof events......the appliances I'm cutting up are not old enough, the 1982 drivetrain is not old enough, etc. :)
plance1 wrote:phaze1todd wrote:I never heard of it so I once I realized the guy wasn't kidding I checked it out to see what the reverse snobbery was all about. So, to answer your question, about an hour ago. Here's what the rules say for this little clique: •1964 and prior TRADITIONAL style rods and customs ONLY •No visible billet anything! Especially wheels! •No digital gauges •No IFS on fenderless cars •No trailer queens •No mag wheel styles made after the 60's •No high tech styled, pastel heart beat graphic, tweed interior, fenderless IFS sporting hot rods •Traditional looking choppers and bobbers ONLY! (No modern West Coast Choppers, OCC style bikes) Nope, not seeing anything that would exclude a factory five hotrod here, maybe the wheels bother you? I dont know, seems like if the wheels are bullit aluminum then you just show up with a different set of wheels? Does that make a factory five car "cool enough" for ya lol? Seriously, looking down the page a little further: I have a fiberglass body car, can I bring it to the show? Yes. Anywhoooooo....if you think someone who puts together a car from a kit, especially a factory five, is not a hot rodder then you've clearly lost your mind. But really though, I think Billit aluminum and digital gauges, pastel graphics, blah, blah, blah all died a natural death back in the 80's so exactly what are you "kool kats" rebelling against here? I see a bunch of guys dressed up like fonze prancing around talking about the upcoming shark jump...plance1 wrote: Thats what I thought....so tell me, when was the last time u checked the "faq" portion of your website?Wow. When was the last time you did?
Billetproof FAQ said: What is "traditional" style? If you dont know what a 50's and 60's styled hot rod or custom is, refer to the rules at the top of the page for the roughest of guidelines. Other than that, look through pictures of past shows on this website to get a taste of the style. You can also refer to hot rodding magazines from the 50's and 60's. They are full of 50's and 60's styled hot rods and customs.
Billetproof FAQ said: No IFS on fenderless cars
Billetproof FAQ said: No high tech styled, pastel heart beat graphic, tweed interior, FENDERLESS IFS SPORTING HOT RODS.
While the HAMB police do seem to have appointed themselves the high priests of the Hot Rod world, I tend to go back to when the word was a derogatory term used by "Responsible" adults to describe what "Stupid" kids were doing to their cars in defiance of "Common Sense".
Damn kids modifying their cars to go fast and/or piss off the establishment has always been my definition of a Hot Rod. To that end, all the rice and modified Brit tin fits the role.
The crap spouted by the HAMB mentality is just an inferiority complex of a bunch of old people who need to feel special. Examle would be turning a tupperware hot rod away at the gate and bragging how great it feels to send a lesser human being packing cause he aint good enough for "Our Kind". Wonder if the gate attendans wear white sheets at their post
Mitchell wrote: The H.A.M.B. appears to be the HOA of hotrodding. Sounds like buckets of fun.
You get a clicky-heart for that one. Or, perhaps more appropriately, "T-buckets of fun".
Here's the thing, folks. I'm 35 years old, which puts me smack in between the 2 camps- I'm too old to "get" the import/tuner scene, and too young to "appreciate" the real roots of hot rodding. I was at a fab shop the other day for work, and the owner tells me he's a car buff. He's about 20 years older than I am. I mention that I'm into cars, too, and he says, "Well, I'm into OLD cars." I then proceed to march him out to the parking lot and show him the 1967 Volvo Amazon that I drove to his shop that day. So then he opens up and starts telling me about his '70 Mustang, Roadrunner, etc.
THEN he takes me over to his computer, and brings up a picture of his most recent toy- a 1983 Subaru Brat. 24,000 miles, all original. I'm weird, so I was actually more interested in hearing about that car than the 60's muscle car iron. But I appreciate then both.
Hot rodding, and car culture in general, is really a big tent. This isn't politics, folks. Some people here are Democrats, some are Republicans, some probably vote Green, Libertarian, or whatever. A lot of us probably don't vote at all. But the one thing we DO agree on is that cars are cool. Cars rock. I heard someone say once that the thing that you spend the most time with, the thing you think about constantly, is the thing you truly love. I'd wager for most of us, that thing is cars. I don't mean to be all "can't we all just get along?" but I've found that I learn a lot and have made a lot of great friends by being open to new stuff. I chat with some guys about Honda, others about RX-7's, and other guys about big blocks. And some guys just want to talk oil-burners. Hey., we're all car guys.
And car guys need to stick together. That goes double for the car gals. ;-)
plance1 wrote: I see a bunch of guys dressed up like fonze prancing around talking about the upcoming shark jump...
That needs to go in Say What
The problem with "traditional" hot rods is that you can no longer build them easily and or for cheep. Hell a rusted out shell of a T bucket will still fetch thousands of $$$$. Hot Rods in the classic sense have for the most part become a hobby for older folks that have the money and or the time to put one together. That is why the younger generation is not in to them.
I also see both sides of the argument here regarding Hot Rods. I think if you put the word "classic" in front of "hot rod" it better describes the cars with Flatheads or small blocks that are all metal cares with suspension and what not from the 50's and 60's. Those are "classic Hot Rods" When I I was a kid my father always referred to a Hot Rod as anything that had been modified by its owner to make ti go faster. It has become a generic term for a fast car. Similar to what we now call a xerox copier. I had a kid say to me "are not all copiers xerox copiers". I laughed. Hot Rod has become a generic term.
Rob_Mopar wrote:plance1 wrote: I see a bunch of guys dressed up like fonze prancing around talking about the upcoming shark jump...That needs to go in Say What
It is true though. It's like a rennasance fair for greasers. Everyone is in costume - fonzie jackets and poodleskirts abound.
By my understanding, the Hot Rod was born in the post-war period when kids took the unwanted pre-war cars of the 30's (read cheap) and fixed them up on their limited budgets. That WWII car gap doesn't exist today, so there is no way to really do it today. Plus:
They removed fenders to loose weight. Federal crash standards will not allow that today.
They chopped and channeled cars because kids spent time in garages, not online.
They swapped out 4cyl for Flathead V-8s. Emissions regs makes that pretty hard to do today.
They had boneyards full of unwanted stuff like Lincoln front ends. Today we recycle.
So the traditional Hot Rod is only a high-dollar proposition today, but I would argue that the spirit lives on. Kids get after school jobs to afford to buy a K&N intake from E-Bay for their Mustang. Or they figure out how to do an engine swap on their 240SX to go drifting. Or enter the GRM Challenge or Lemons!
Hot rodding is still alive. They just switched to cars that can turn.
Hot rodding is still alive, but it doesn't involve Hot Rods. The latter has petrified into a certain set of rules and looks and a very specific style - Aeromoto is illustrating this very well. It'll die out because of it as the practitioners die off. There's no new blood coming in because new blood tends to be interested in doing things differently (like the 1950's rodders did before they got old) and there's no interest or room for different. Guys like me who live and breathe performance cars get turned off and bored. We wander off and don't come back.
The latest Hot Rod magazine illustrates this well. There's an article about a '32 Ford that was a real wild child back in the 50's and 60's. It ended up parted out in a garage and got to the point where the owner's wife couldn't sell the car for $1500 because all the "real" hot rod snobs told her it couldn't be real, it was too cheap. One guy stumbled on it and "restored" it. The article starts off bragging about 2000 ARP fasteners that were cut down to length and polished at both ends as part of the build. If you're polishing the end of your bolts, you know you're not building a car. When this thing was new, it was fast and it was driven. Now it's a total over-the-top trailer queen that's mostly a fabrication showcase. It would be welcome at Aeromoto's show but you'll never see it anywhere else.
Pro Touring, on the other hand. That's got life. Interesting things are being built without concern about what is "correct". There's some great fabrication - but also some rough and ready stuff that's cool because of the thought behind it. The cars are driven HARD and for more than a quarter mile at a time. And because of all this, it's pulling in new gearheads. It's where all the original spirit of the lakebeds has ended up, not fossilized at the greaser renaissance fair.
Wow! You guys seem to be authorities on the hot rod hobby. I'm 41, but the majority of the car owners i see at our events are in there 20s and 30s, but what to do I know?
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