Integra Bottoming out

Info

1995 GSR

Koni Sports

H&R Sport Springs

Measurement from top center of wheel arch to center of wheel: 12 Inches (Factory is 14 according to internet)

I went ahead and had a local shop install my konis and a bushing kit. They told me that the spring perch was on the highest available. I get the car back and it bottoms out constantly. I did not measure the ride height before dropping it off. I did tell them to replace bumpstops, balljoints, etc as needed. I jack up the car and there are no bump stops on the front, didn't bother to check the back, a set of bump stops on the way from amazon. Also in the front, I notice their are rub marks from the tire hitting the inner fender. Were not there before koni install.

My question is, since I did not change the springs, and the Konis are on the highest perch, could this all be a result of not having bump stops?

Also, I would prefer some springs with less of a drop. Any honda guys out there know of a springs that provides slightly higher spring rates than H&R sports with also a higher height?

Should I just go back to my OEM springs with 160k miles on them? Or would it be wise to order a set of Integra Type R springs?

Thanks for the help everyone.

Just researched Integra type R springs. Looks like the rears are not drop in so those are out.

Eibach pro kits.

Also something sounds installed wrong. Post pics.

I'll post pictures next time I can get the car up in the air.

Can't speak for integras, but myself and every other Honda person I know does the Koni/GroundControl coilover combo. You can get it in any rate at any height for cheap.

In reply to accordionfolder: Yeah, if I decide I need to replace the springs I will pony up the cash for ground controls. All civics and integras from 90~ to 2000~ are pretty much the same underneath anyways, right?

Jarod wrote: All civics and integras from 90~ to 2000~ are pretty much the same underneath anyways, right?

Mostly. The CRX and Type-R had different rear control arms, so they require different type of strut mount. If you stick to the 92-95 Civic and 94-01 Integra (non-R) parts you should be golden.

For what it's worth I'm running Koni sports with the H&R OE-Sport springs on my 99 GSR and I have no issues with bottoming. I'm using some aftermarket KYB bumpstop-n-dustboot pieces with them, but it's rare occurrence to hit them. The OE-Sport was as close to the Type-R springs as I could find (0.75in drop, reasonable rates). Honestly though, it looks like the front is lower than the advertised drop. It looks great, but it's a tad low. That said, I don't have any rubbing so there's that.

Ebay coil over kit, get one that doesnt have the numbers labeled on it with a gap in the threads and then buy some decent brand springs in rates that make sense. Setup your bump stops correctly. And you should be good to go with a nice budget setup.

In reply to Matt B:

Unfortunately the H&R Sports came with the car. I would have gotten OE sports if I were choosing. I do still have the stock springs, but am hesitant to throw those back on, but may anyways when I put the bump stops on I ordered.

What is your wheel well to wheel center measurements with the OE sports?

No problem - I'll measure this afternoon when I get home.

Bump stops. that is what they are for.

In reply to iceracer: I am aware, apparently the mechanic I went to is not.

Be carful if you are bottoming out the Koni's you will trash the valving in them and they will be junk very quickly. There are a set of rubber things (aka bump stops)that go around the piston rod on the Koni's that you have to order separately that will prevent this along with plastic rings that look like fender washers with a cut in them. I think they were About $12 each but this was 5 years back. How do I know this? I called Koni and had a very lengthy discussion with Lee in the motorsports division @ Koni and he clued me in to this. the following is a summery I posted over at CC a while back about this.

Dean said: Now the tech On Konis that I got from all this. It turns out that it is critical that bump stops be used with these units especially if the car has been lowered (as mine has). When you lower the car you move the "working area" of the strut lower into the tube moving the static position of the piston closer to the bottom of the strut. In my case about 1 1/2" inches. This reduces the effective compression travel that the strut has before it bottoms. Koni Sport struts (and I assume shocks) are made so that if you bottom out the piston with any kind of force you will destroy the valving on the bottom of the piston. This is due to it crashing in to the bottom of the tube. If this happens it is game over for your strut. The bump stops prevent this from happening. They will stop the strut from compression all the way. Additionally I was told that it is very important to install with the bump stops the plastic "C" spacer between the strut housing and the bump stop. This gives a place for dirt that is wiped off the rod a place to go and keep it from getting compressed into the top seal of the strut.

In reply to dean1484: Thanks for the heads up. I have been getting better at dodging the bumps and pot holes on my way to work, but realistically will not be able to do anything till this weekend.

With that info do you think extended top hats would be a good idea?

I dont know. You need to measure all your E36 M3. Put in the 36mm bump stops and remove the springs and see how close the tire can get to metal when you jack up that corner and turn the wheel about. If you're more than 1/4" away from metal than extended top hats would help you get more wheel travel. If you're already at 1/4" or less clearance extended top hats are just going to make you bottom the tire into the chassis more.

Judging by the rub marks on my inner fender I am guessing it will just increase the likely hood of bottoming out.

On the other hand I would like to get the Konis into their optimal range of travel. So my thinking was extended top hats with stacked bump stops or bump stops + spacers keeping the tires from contacting, but also placing the shocks in their optimal range of travel.

Or just be thankful the car came with the factory springs and put those back on. I really feel like part of the roadloaf crowd with all these questions.

Thats not how this works. All you get by going to unnecessary extended top hats is a loss of droop travel.

In reply to Leafy: Please do not take this the wrong way, I don't mind getting educated.

My understanding: If I lower the car by two inches, the shock is now compressed by the same amount while at rest. The bottom shock mount raises in relation to the top hat by the amount the car is lowered. By moving the top hat, and thus the top mounting point up by the same amount you are now regaining the shocks full length of travel.

I am trying to see how there is a loss of droop travel.

Jarod wrote: In reply to Leafy: Please do not take this the wrong way, I don't mind getting educated. My understanding: If I lower the car by two inches, the shock is now compressed by the same amount while at rest. The bottom shock mount raises in relation to the top hat by the amount the car is lowered. By moving the top hat, and thus the top mounting point up by the same amount you are now regaining the shocks full length of travel. I am trying to see how there is a loss of droop travel.

Your bump travel isnt limited by the shock or the mount. Its limited by the tire hitting the chassis. You could run 4" extended top hats and it wont gain you any more bump travel than what you have now, you'll just loose 4" of droop travel. And the shocks have no optimal stroke range, they are not position dependent.

In reply to Leafy: I see what you are saying, I was under the impression that the shock have an optimal stroke range, which lead me down a rabbit hole. I plan to do all the measurements this weekend.

Thanks for the help everyone. I will update as things are discovered, worked on, or solved.

The shocks work the same through out there entire range up until they bottom out and then you trash the valving of the shock. In short try to set the car up so that at maximum suspension compression the shock is not bottoming out or another way to look at it is to have the suspension bottom out and not the shock. Make cense?

Measurement from the fender lip to wheel centerline is 12.5ish inches in the front. Sorry for the delay.

Thanks for the measurement Matt. I would love that extra .5 inch. That is the plan dean, I think I am going to use some strategically placed playdough and get some measurements of suspension clearances this weekend.