Jeep

Try driving a Miata up the Court House/Capitol steps. Jeeps ne; wranglers and previous models are a fun vehicle. Not vey practical though.

Yeah, I know it's not a real Jeep, but...

Independent front suspension and coilovers?

I'm still looking for a decent motor for my '94 XJ beater. I don't much care for driving them on the road but nothing beats a beater jeep for getting some canoes, beer, and muddy dogs down a four wheeler trail at 50mph. I "get it" but certainly wouldn't want one as a daily unless I lived down some crazy backwoods logging trail or something.

skruffy wrote: I'm still looking for a decent motor for my '94 XJ beater. .......

the Cummins 3.9L/4BT

skruffy wrote: unless I lived down some crazy backwoods logging trail or something.

Yes, when I retire, that will be a reality

EricM wrote:

skruffy wrote: I'm still looking for a decent motor for my '94 XJ beater. .......

the Cummins 3.9L/4BT

skruffy wrote: unless I lived down some crazy backwoods logging trail or something.

Yes, when I retire, that will be a reality

Living like this on 100+ acres in appalachia is my lotto dream life.

A 4BT in an LJ is my dream vehicle for this.

EricM wrote:

skruffy wrote: I'm still looking for a decent motor for my '94 XJ beater. .......

the Cummins 3.9L/4BT

That'd be great but not fitting the beater status of this vehicle. I just need another 4.0 with less rods sticking out of the block in various directions...

Keith wrote: It's funny, when I lived in Ottawa I thought every lifted/modified Jeep was driven by a poseur. Now that I live in Marlboro Country (seriously, the Marlboro Man has a ranch near here, and no he did not die of lung cancer), any Jeep that isn't modified is a poseur. I mean, why buy one if you won't use it? And you can't use 'em stock. Not unless it's just for posing. It's important for Jeep for the Wrangler to perform well for the sorority girl demographic, which means it's got to have some road manners. But it's like trying to make an Aston Martin better at towing - it's just not what the fundamental vehicle is designed to do, and criticizing the car for that isn't really fair. As a car, the Wrangler is pretty poor.

Exactly! People, Jeep is not making you buy a Wrangler! If they wanted to please the posers who stay on paved roads it would destroy its excellent off road capability. If you aren't going off road and if you're too fragile to handle a stiff riding truck then maybe you should be buying a Subaru wagon or Dodge Caravan.

Consumer Reports (a joke of a publication) makes this mistake every year. They HATE the Wrangler, it is always in their top 10 worst. Funny thing though, I've never seen them criticize a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord for breaking into pieces off road...huh...what is the point of a car if it can't go off road? Useless...

saw a stock unlimited with the top off and all four doors off driving down westheimer yesterday. that looked weird.

and i knew CR was a crap publication when the first magazine i picked up from them compared four compact pickups, one v6 4x4 extended cab, a 4cyl 2wd reg cab, a v6 reg cab flareside, and a something else.

they then compared each of the trucks handling, cargo carrying, etc. i could tell they had no interest in a fair or honest comparison since they didnt even bother to source trucks for the same purpose. i think i was 13 at the time, and i could tell they probably had no idea what the scientific method was.

skruffy wrote: Independent front suspension and coilovers?

http://tinyurl.com/35pwcul

not a jeep.

skruffy wrote:

EricM wrote:

skruffy wrote: I'm still looking for a decent motor for my '94 XJ beater. .......

the Cummins 3.9L/4BT

That'd be great but not fitting the beater status of this vehicle. I just need another 4.0 with less rods sticking out of the block in various directions...

my buddy is putting a 4bt in a chero. He had to conver to 9in rear and D44 front with leaf springs all the way around now.... And install a front half subframe of 3x2 1/4 wall tubing doable silly on my estimation.. People who love the idea of a 4bt have never driven a 4bt equipped vehicle. That sucker shakes like hell and makes daily driving hell.. Look at how many cruisers from Profitts are for sale at any given time...

This is a great thread! It illustrates the diversity in use and tastes in automobiles.
I've had four different pickups, two Wranglers including the Rubicon, S2000s and a variety of other SUVs and cars and one thing is very clear to me. Every car/vehicle is a compromise. Some just compromise less than others. The S2000 is a pain to travel long distances in just like the Wrangler which is no less comfortable on the highway. Both are excellent at what they were designed for. The Rubicon was by FAR the best off road vehicle I have ever had and it's disappointing that purists from the street and track can't appreciate the value of the Jeep when it is in it's element. David, take the thing off road an get it dirty!

If Jeeps are all about off roading with no real concern for on-road manners, why does every version since the YJ get softer and softer?

In reply to pres589:

The TJ is a much better car on and off road than the YJ. It has better articulation and better traction on rough terrain than the YJ, especially without lockers.

pres589 wrote: If Jeeps are all about off roading with no real concern for on-road manners, why does every version since the YJ get softer and softer?

Define softer.

Yes, they get better interiors with each generation, but they also get better off road with every generation.

Coil springs good! Leaf springs bad!

Keith wrote: Coil springs good! Leaf springs bad!

Coil springs have rear steer issues. My leafs don't. :)

pres589 wrote: If Jeeps are all about off roading with no real concern for on-road manners, why does every version since the YJ get softer and softer?

pres, you said it yourself on page 1.

"People hate their real lives, they like to pretend instead, this car is proof."

Not a flame, dude...I agree with you. The question to me is whether or not the thing can still do the job, even with the fancy seats/power cupholders/heated headliner that all the marketing berkeleyers insist a vehicle must have to be a "success" in the `Murrican marketplace.

You guys really should get it dirty (and NOT at the beach, my forester could do that). Seriously, it fits with the GRM values as much as a miata does. The miata is built for a purpose, to carve corners and dodge cones, and it does this at the expense of other wimpy virtues. The Jeep was built to climb over and go through just about anything, and it does thie at the expense of other wimpy virtues. And just like the miata it offers an incredible bang for the buck.
Now, when you answer the call of your readers and do this you need to get with an off-road club for a few reasons. 1st is because without someone who is experienced and knows what the vehicle can do pushing you, I guarantee you will not approach the limits of what a Jeep can do. Trust me, they have more balls than you do (the Jeeps that is). The 2nd reason is because you will get stuck if you are pushing the limits and again, you need experience with you.
Think about this, how would you feel if a magazine tested the miata and complained about the ride and lack of a trunk but never got it out on an auto-X course to measure what it can do.
The fact that this thread is almost on it's 4th page shows your readers are interested...

The only way to appreciate a Jeep at the beach is pulling out stuck cars for $20 a pop. Then you really appreciate having a Jeep at the beach.

(EDIT)

I'd also like to note that the Jeep you have pictured with the review is a Rubicon, not a Sahara. Different beasts.

I do feel you entirely on the cheapness. For $31,000, there should be a lot more expensive feeling bits. That same money can buy me plenty of other capable vehicles that don't abuse me as much come Monday. An FJ Cruiser prices out about the same for a mid-line vehicle with similar options.

I admit that I am in the market for a Jeep, but after looking at new ones, I find the TJ and YJ to be much more appealing.

DrBoost wrote: The 2nd reason is because you will get stuck if you are pushing the limits and again, you need experience with you.

That's the nice thing about off-roading in flat, muddy areas. Around here, when you get past the limits you tend to roll over or fall off a cliff - or, if you're lucky, both in quick succession! I've never put Basil (my Land Rover) on his side, but I've been there to help right a few, umm, "wrongs" when others managed to pull off a move that was 11/10ths.

But yes, with a good spotter you'll be amazed at where a 4wd can go.

In reply to Keith:

Nice Land Rover. I keep lusting over a Defender if only I had the money.

DrBoost wrote: You guys really should get it dirty (and NOT at the beach, my forester could do that). Seriously, it fits with the GRM values as much as a miata does. The miata is built for a purpose, to carve corners and dodge cones, and it does this at the expense of other wimpy virtues. The Jeep was built to climb over and go through just about anything, and it does thie at the expense of other wimpy virtues. And just like the miata it offers an incredible bang for the buck. Now, when you answer the call of your readers and do this you need to get with an off-road club for a few reasons. 1st is because without someone who is experienced and knows what the vehicle can do pushing you, I guarantee you will not approach the limits of what a Jeep can do. Trust me, they have more balls than you do (the Jeeps that is). The 2nd reason is because you will get stuck if you are pushing the limits and again, you need experience with you. This about this, how would you feel if a magazine tested the miata and complained about the ride and lack of a trunk but never got it out on an auto-X course to measure what it can do. The fact that this thread is almost on it's 4th page shows your readers are interested...

This.

Joe Gearin wrote: and miatame---- no need to burn...... how the Jeep performs on-road is at least as important as how it performs off pavement. (where will it spend more time?) I'm sure we will have both sides of the argument represented.

OK I just realized David's review is online. What did I say about burning the issue? How do I burn an online article?

OK Sorry David, I love ya, but you are way wrong on this.

"The Jeep Wrangler received the new TJ platform starting with the 2007 model." - WRONG, it is the JK, TJ was previous.

"I’d have to go with the Subaru Forester instead." - You just lost a LOT of credit here. That's like saying I'd take a Honda Accord Wagon over a Miata because you can't store anything in a Miata.

Come on dude, bring something else to the table. Did you used to work for CR?

"I have seen the spare tire covers: It’s a Jeep thing; you wouldn’t understand. I guess I just don’t. "

No, you don't. I have never owned a Jeep, but I did have a 90/91 Explorer Spot (2 door version) that I managed to get into places that required a Jeep to retrieve me a couple times.

If I hadn't had engine problems with it I would probably still have it. To me true off-roading is as much fun as Auto-X, etc.

A Jeep mag wouldnt get a miata either, but I do think a Jeep is grassroots and even will see actual grass roots from time to time. You need to bond with a jeep to appreciated it. Hit some mud, dirt, rocks, or some snow and suddenly its like you have some rowdy friends that are blast to party with but they like to punch you in the shoulder. Thats kinda how living with a jeep day to day can be, you have to take the annoying "hello" punches to party like they do.