Just an idea: Classics that won't depreciate

skeze wrote: I say Corvettes tend to do well in regards to what you intend to do with your cars...a particular one in my mind is a C4 Grand Sport...you know the blue ones with black wheels and striped fenders, I've seen white ones like that but don't know if they are the real deal...Corvettes seem to always hold their value for some reason.

The beauty of Corvettes is that the car has a broad appeal and there is a ready market for them. I think a well-bought Corvette 20 or more years old should return at least what you paid for it when you decide to sell. Any repair costs you can compare to depreciation on a newer car. I think the comparison will favor the vintage Corvette.

I have sold 27 cars this year on the side, and have made money on all but 2. (Fortunatly I have a dealer license in addition to my real job.)

You definately make your money when you buy the car, selling it is the easy part. The hardest part is finding the deal. Often times I am able to capitalize on the average person's inability to sell something effectivly. Find something that needs a little work, not a restoration. You make your money with simple things that are simple to fix / clean / paint.

I'm going to preface this by saying that I've only made money on one car I've sold. I bought a '92 Ford Mustang LX notchback SSP coupe from the $2007 classifieds and sold it for $4750. I believe that there were a few reasons for why this car made money and the others didn't:

• SSP collector crowd (I had a bunch of the history, officer's name who drove the car, pictures of it in service, etc.)
• '92 was the last year of the forged piston Fox bodys
• color (black)
• notchbacks are the most sought-after Fox Mustang
• It was very stock looking (only changes were Ponys and a 1.5" cowl hood that you would barely notice)

I knew a lot about the Fox body Mustangs, and at the time I bought the car also owned a '92 GT. As others have said, really knowing the model you're considering inside and out will help you to better assess condition and value. I'm usually on the classifieds in model-specific forums, so that helps to get a handle on true market value.

Here's my list when picking out a car and trying not to take a bath on it:

• stock (or as close to stock as possible)
• no rust (rust would be your #1 enemy in a deal like this)
• very good or excellent body condition
• very good or excellent paint
• service records or other evidence of good maintenance (so you don't spend a fortune in time/money getting caught up on deferred maintenance)

In the case of the SSP car, I fixed a few things that made the car much easier to drive (Maximum Motorsports clutch cable, quadrant, and firewall adjuster) and also fixed a leak from the air pump (emissions equipment). I also brought the car back as close to stock as possible (aftermarket shifter replaced with a stock one, removed the front strut tower brace, removed the K-member brace). A solid detail job really helped the car look great in pictures...

I think it's possible, getting a fair deal to start goes a long way to not taking a bath. Having the ability to patiently wait for the right buyer is another key component.

Just to be sure, that a car or anything in this world is worth only what the market is willing to pay for it. Timing is everything and generally trying to time the market is a losing proposition.

I don't know if it's a way to really make money, but it's pretty much our standard mode of operation. So far the key has been: don't be too marque specific, troll classified ads until you find something that you "just can't lose on". Usually these cars will be somewhat neglected, dirty, and rare/desirable enough to find a buyer when you dispose of it.
We've had luck with an E36 M3, a E34 520i that needed a headgasket (purchased for $300, added a gasket and a LOT of cleaning, sold a year later for $2k), and likely a Subaru (STI swapped) Impreza that we paid $3500 for. Clean/fix, drive and enjoy, and sell for about what you have in it (or sometimes more, depending on the deal you got originally).

We're STRONGLY considering this process with an aircooled Porsche, with the caveat that we'd get a good one, and enjoy it's lack of depreciation for a few years. I don't expect to make money on something like that, but it sure is nice having a vehicle for only the cost of maintenance and insurance....

I've only made money on one classic. It was a 1957 Chevy Handyman. Bought for $11K. I drove it for three years and sold it for $15k. The only work done to it was a good buffing and a change of wheels and tires and a radiator shroud. Fun car but drove like a truck. Bought off craigslist locally and sold on craigslist to a guy in Alabama. There's a picture of it in my garage.

As far a making money off cars. I used to buy non-running junkers fix and clean them drive them for six months and sell them for a profit. Harder with classics. It's easy to double your money on a $500 car. Not so easy on a $15k one.

tuna55 wrote: My parents bought a '67 350 hp 327 Corvette coupe in 2002 for 20K and it's now worth 60-65K. It's insured for agreed upon value, and still better than pretty much any mutual fund through that time period. That ship has sailed, but there will be others. I had a thread about this, but I can't find it. I was settled on an Esprit, a NSX or a 911 SC/Carrera or 993.

The C2 hasn't appreciated much if any since 2002. If your folks scored one for 20K that is now worth 60k they were EXTREMELY lucky. A '67 with the hotter 327 was bringing 20K ten years prior to you parent's purchase.

NSX

a401cj wrote:

tuna55 wrote: My parents bought a '67 350 hp 327 Corvette coupe in 2002 for 20K and it's now worth 60-65K. It's insured for agreed upon value, and still better than pretty much any mutual fund through that time period. That ship has sailed, but there will be others. I had a thread about this, but I can't find it. I was settled on an Esprit, a NSX or a 911 SC/Carrera or 993.

The C2 hasn't appreciated much if any since 2002. If your folks scored one for 20K that is now worth 60k they were EXTREMELY lucky. A '67 with the hotter 327 was bringing 20K ten years prior to you parent's purchase.

Wrong dude, they publish magazines covering this exact thing, with model year, options and condition modifiers. They had some years where the quoted increase was in the 20 some odd percent. They got one at roughly the going price.

Everyone seems to be ignoring the fact that you have to pay to keep the car somewhere. Yeah your garage is free... but not really. You could be paying less property tax on a house without the garage that you now can't use..

mr2peak wrote: Everyone seems to be ignoring the fact that you have to pay to keep the car somewhere. Yeah your garage is free... but not really. You could be paying less property tax on a house without the garage that you now can't use..

House without a garage? You sure you're on the right forum?

lol just saying that the cost of the storage space for your "investment" must also be figured into the cost.

If you buy in at $15,000, spend $5000 to store it for 10 years then sell it for $20,000 you break even.

mr2peak wrote: lol just saying that the cost of the storage space for your "investment" must also be figured into the cost. If you buy in at $15,000, spend $5000 to store it for 10 years then sell it for $20,000 you break even.

Park it inside, need the garage? Move it outside. Uhmm... where is the extra cost in that?

tuna55 wrote:

a401cj wrote:

tuna55 wrote: My parents bought a '67 350 hp 327 Corvette coupe in 2002 for 20K and it's now worth 60-65K. It's insured for agreed upon value, and still better than pretty much any mutual fund through that time period. That ship has sailed, but there will be others. I had a thread about this, but I can't find it. I was settled on an Esprit, a NSX or a 911 SC/Carrera or 993.

The C2 hasn't appreciated much if any since 2002. If your folks scored one for 20K that is now worth 60k they were EXTREMELY lucky. A '67 with the hotter 327 was bringing 20K ten years prior to you parent's purchase.

Wrong dude, they publish magazines covering this exact thing, with model year, options and condition modifiers. They had some years where the quoted increase was in the 20 some odd percent. They got one at roughly the going price.

I know they do. Hemmings and Keith Martin's for two. I hope you aren't going by the price "guides" in some of the Vette mags. They are way way off. I'm not saying your folks' Vette isn't worth 60k today, I'm just saying it was likely worth a whole lot more than 20k back in 2002.

In any case I might be a little jealous. The '67 is the bee's knees of all Vettes and I always felt that the hot small block would have been the engine to have instead of the heavy-ass 427.

a401cj wrote:

tuna55 wrote:

a401cj wrote:

tuna55 wrote: My parents bought a '67 350 hp 327 Corvette coupe in 2002 for 20K and it's now worth 60-65K. It's insured for agreed upon value, and still better than pretty much any mutual fund through that time period. That ship has sailed, but there will be others. I had a thread about this, but I can't find it. I was settled on an Esprit, a NSX or a 911 SC/Carrera or 993.

The C2 hasn't appreciated much if any since 2002. If your folks scored one for 20K that is now worth 60k they were EXTREMELY lucky. A '67 with the hotter 327 was bringing 20K ten years prior to you parent's purchase.

Wrong dude, they publish magazines covering this exact thing, with model year, options and condition modifiers. They had some years where the quoted increase was in the 20 some odd percent. They got one at roughly the going price.

I know they do. Hemmings and Keith Martin's for two. I hope you aren't going by the price "guides" in some of the Vette mags. They are way way off. I'm not saying your folks' Vette isn't worth 60k today, I'm just saying it was likely worth a whole lot more than 20k back in 2002. In any case I might be a little jealous. The '67 is the bee's knees of all Vettes and I always felt that the hot small block would have been the engine to have instead of the heavy-ass 427.

They bought it clean at a major auction - I am pretty sure that's what it was worth then.