Just how bad can a 986 Boxster put you in the poor house?

After selling the E28 last month I'm committed to a roadster for my next "fun" car; I love the S2000 but prices have entered the stratosphere and I refuse to own one that's been wrecked or messed with. The NC MX-5 is a contender but prices are unusually high right now and I feel like I'd have to throw $5k at one to make it into the car I really want. Meanwhile a 986 Boxster S is "turn key" in the sense that there's nothing I feel like I'd need to do to modify one and prices have remained fairly flat recently; I've also never had a P-car, and I need to scratch that itch at some point in my life, so the Boxster is getting a very serious look.

After being in and out of the poor house with BMWs in the last decade I am 100% aware of the "buy the owner, not the car" mantra. I would probably be looking at '00-02 cars (not a huge fan of the facelift); I'm aware of the big-ticket IMS issue, the AOS, and the need for regular water pump replacement. The 996 thread currently active on the board makes it sound like the M96 cars in general can be an expensive maintenance catastrophe; I've heard of big commitments like the cam chain tensioners and a few other things but I guess I'm not sure just how afraid I should be of a well-maintained car that has had the IMS done.

As someone generally experienced with German cars I don't need to be told that the potential for hurt and general part costs with a Boxster are going to be higher than a Miata, but just how bad are we talking here? I am going to take the P-car plunge at some point one way or another (it's a car guy bucket list item) but after the project insanity that my E28 turned into I want something I'll generally have to mess with less for a while.

You're doomed.

Coming from BMW's my entire life and then dabbling in 996's, the Porsche tax is extreme and the early watercooled PCar engines are like buying into the BMW's V8s (of which I have done as well).

Chassis, brakes, steering are phenomenal but you have to really want a project to justify one and have cash to distribute on a regular basis for parts orders to get it up to snuff. 

I always do this and then end up selling once it is COMPLETELY gone through and ready for years of reliable abuse because I am some sort of masochist and get bored on a regular basis if I don't have an exciting parts buying hobby. Wish I wouldn't have sold some of them but whatever. 

If you are buying cheap (a project) and have $4-5k to play with to make it right, do it. If you are buying it perfect, sorted, and setup (and paying top dollar) then do it. If neither, you should stick with BMWs IMO. 

This is more for the peanut gallery than the OP; does it make more sense to buy a 987 for ~$20k and 80k or less miles than ~$10k for a 986?

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

I approve this question as relevant, as I've also considered "stepping up" for a 987 if they really fix as many problems as the internet makes it sound like they do.

(I must admit I am weirdly partial to the runny egg headlights and general styling of the 986/996 but I am also sick in the head.)

I have two friends who have bought low to mid range Boxsters with the same thoughts.  One blew the motor and the other had unfixable clutch issues even after pro help along with plenty of other problems.   One was replaced with an AMG Mercedes and the other with an E46 M3 and both have been significantly more reliable, which is saying something.   On this very forum the ratio of boxsters that work well v ones that are maddeningly broken seems about 50:50.   

I'd say it depends on your intentions for it and how perfect you want it to be.

Honestly if you just want a fun street car I'd recommend you at least try out a base car. They're not the fastest thing but IMO they're fast enough to be fun on the street, and needing to give it a lot of throttle to keep up with traffic just means you get to hear the sweet flat six noises that much more. The engines are more robust and much cheaper and easier to find replacements for.

Otherwise, if you buy well and treat it well, it really shouldn't be too bad. If you get unlucky and get a "bad" one or need it to be in absolutely 100% perfect condition at all times, yeah it's going to get expensive fast, but IMO that's really not too different from BMW land.

For my anecdotal evidence, I bought a base '99 with 130k miles that had lived a not great life and had no real maintenance records. The water pump was visibly newer than the rest of the engine but the coolant looked like it had been in there a while. It needed a set of wheel bearings and a few other small items upon my purchase, but once that was taken care of I beat the crap out of it for two years with no reliability issues until I finally smoked the clutch at a track day (the clutches aren't the most robust things...getting 140k of even normal driving out of them is an accomplishment sometimes). $500 of new clutch and a good used flywheel and a weekend of work later and it was good as new and the now functional dual mas flywheel solved the issue that I thought was the engine mounts needing to be replaced. There's a few weird high dollar items but most of the maintenance stuff is reasonably priced, as long as you don't insist on the parts arriving in a box that has "porsche" written on it.

Sonic said:

I have two friends who have bought low to mid range Boxsters with the same thoughts.  One blew the motor and the other had unfixable clutch issues even after pro help along with plenty of other problems.   One was replaced with an AMG Mercedes and the other with an E46 M3 and both have been significantly more reliable, which is saying something.   On this very forum the ratio of boxsters that work well v ones that are maddeningly broken seems about 50:50.   

I don't think the ratio is that bad on decent vs. super-busted Boxsters.  It would be interesting to conduct a poll of the forum to find out.

My anecdotal experience with my high-mileage 00 986 S:

I bought mine 3 years ago for $7,200 needing a ton of work (suspension was completely shot, bushings, ball joints, struts, all of it, and tires were bald) and also having had a ton done and documented (dealership IMS replacement/upgrade, clutch, and lower-mileage transaxle) with a clean title and dirty Carfax (clearly had paint work done on both quarter panels). I immediately replaced the struts with Konis and all the other suspension parts with new (but affordable) stuff (thanks GRM advertiser FCP Euro!) and put RE71R's on it. I was now all-in on a Boxster S 6-Speed for less than $10K that was fully sorted. 

In the three years since it's been to more autocross events than I can remember, often with 4 drivers, including an SCCA National Tour (9th/15 in Spec ND2, I mean CS) and ProSolo, and has more recently been turned into a track rat running Time Trials. It's been street driven the whole time with across the state road trips and coastal tours peppered in. It's never stranded me or required anything crazy for work.

I would recommend shopping for a driver car. Something with over 100K miles on it that's had regular use (and maintenance!) with a documented IMS upgrade. Then enjoy to your heart's content.

I see too many super low mile garage queens getting sold with really poor maintenance and they generally run like crap. These cars don't like to sit.

Interesting you'd spend 5k to get the NC to your liking. I bought my 33k example for 7500. I've put 2,000 in wheels and tires. And then about another grand in simple suspension. Koni strt, progress springs, roadster sport bars. The Ecu tune was 350. Short throw was 300. 
 

my Nc came with header and exhaust and intake. 

pointofdeparture said:

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

I approve this question as relevant, as I've also considered "stepping up" for a 987 if they really fix as many problems as the internet makes it sound like they do.

(I must admit I am weirdly partial to the runny egg headlights and general styling of the 986/996 but I am also sick in the head.)

And I'm really not hot on the 986/996 front clip, especially the headlights.  Seeing a 993 and a 996 next to each other makes me want to weep.  It does seem like the 987 was a nice evolution on the 986 both mechanically and cosmetically with nicer interiors and generally better reliability.

In reply to Vajingo :

Right now it's tough to find any NC under 100k miles for less than 10 grand, and I don't want to settle for a Sport in a color I don't like, so probably $12-15k to start.

With all the mods you did, CARB legal header/exhaust, and roll bar, that's five grand, so $17-20k into a NC Miata which would be fun and dead nuts reliable. But that's also pushing 987 Boxster money...

In reply to pointofdeparture :

OK. I just didn't know what you wanted to do with the car for five grand. I've seen it too many times, there is a right and wrong way to blow five grand on these cars

In reply to Vajingo :

Yep, I've done all the research, and there is a very real chance I will end up with a NC and all the must-have bolt-ons. Last year was just the time to buy, prices are silly right now.

In reply to pointofdeparture :

Agreed. I bought Yuki in February of 2020. Prices skyrocketed about six mo later. There are still some "deals" to be had, If you don't mind getting greasy. A blown engine nc1 should fetch about 5k or less. 

I'm torn. I love my car, but it keeps throwing curveballs at me. But I'm also convinced that a lot of it is my own doing. At this point, I'm wishing I'd just taken it to a shop for the clutch/IMS, written one big painful check, and been on my way. But no, I always think I'll figure it out, how hard can it be, I've done a ton of wrenching, etc.

In reply to Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) :

Yeah I'm not afraid to half engine out a supercharged Audi and even I would only consider dealer installed IMS upgrades. In my mind these cars are literally worthless without it.

I wouldn't be afraid of a well kept Boxster.  As with any German car, I'd stay far, far away from any neglected example or one that doesn't have a documented service history.  I don't find Porsche parts pricing to be really any more than any other German car.  Just don't shop at the dealers and you're fine.  Even then some dealer parts are shockingly cheap.  I bought inner rear fender liners from Sunset Porsche for $37 each...

pointofdeparture said:

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

I approve this question as relevant, as I've also considered "stepping up" for a 987 if they really fix as many problems as the internet makes it sound like they do.

(I must admit I am weirdly partial to the runny egg headlights and general styling of the 986/996 but I am also sick in the head.)

I don't think the M97 is a huge step up from the M96 in terms of reliability.  I'd be looking for a 9A1 powered car, personally.  I realize that is a lot more $$$, but it is about the same cost as a 986/987 plus one major mechanical event.  Or look for a higher-mileage car that gets flogged a lot, but with good maintenance records. 

Tyler H (Forum Supporter) said:

pointofdeparture said:

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

I approve this question as relevant, as I've also considered "stepping up" for a 987 if they really fix as many problems as the internet makes it sound like they do.

(I must admit I am weirdly partial to the runny egg headlights and general styling of the 986/996 but I am also sick in the head.)

I don't think the M97 is a huge step up from the M96 in terms of reliability.  I'd be looking for a 9A1 powered car, personally.  I realize that is a lot more $$$, but it is about the same cost as a 986/987 plus one major mechanical event.  Or look for a higher-mileage car that gets flogged a lot, but with good maintenance records. 

Right. If you're ponying up for the good one...get the actual good one (987.2 or 981). Not the one that's slightly more robust but still failure prone and needs an engine out service to upgrade, and has other reliability issues. Or stick with the 986 and get either the cheapest medium-high mileage base car you can find (remember high miles = driven regularly, which is good for ims bearing life) or a nice one that's had the bearing replaced.

I think the big appeal of the 986 is that even these days with used car prices increasing, you can still pretty easily find a nice 986 for $10K or less that has the IMS bearing already fixed and is in good shape, probably with some maintenance records as well.  It is a 20 year old car though, so as always factor in a few extra bucks to replace some bushings and maintenance parts.

dps214 was spot on when he said you can save a lot on maintenance by just not getting Porsche parts - and to further clarify, you can get German-made parts, extremely high quality parts, even parts made by companies that make OEM equipment for Porsche for reasonable prices.  But if you buy genuine Porsche parts, the price will be double, triple, or more. 

In reply to pointofdeparture :

Are we the same person? I have a nice driver Euro E28 in the garage pretty much sorted to do what I want with it and completely content with it. Having said that if something bad happens to it and Hagerty pays out a first gen Boxster (maybe S) is at the top of the list to replace it.

Someone mentioned the base car as an option and I'll second that. The sounds that car makes from the drivers seat as you head towards redline are very nice but speeds aren't there to get you into serious trouble. Test drive some different cars including newer ones and see what tickles your fancy!

I bought one, I kinda wish I hadn't though.  It's (slightly) more broken than I thought it was and not really exciting enough to be worth the potential hassle.  I haven't even driven it since I bought it a month ago.  I'm going to attempt to get it working properly at least, and I don't really care about it at all so I'm just going to use it for a while while not intentionally making it worse and hopefully sell it before it explodes.  As long as it doesn't catch on fire or otherwise fail spectacularly enough to injure anyone I will have no complaints.  I'd imagine the Bilstien PSS9 coilovers and eibach swaybars will be enough to get a little money back if nothing else.

From what I have seen in recent months on miata.net/miataturbo.net and 986forum.com there are still deals to be had out there. I am really enjoying my base 1999 986. The NC always felt like the least special Miata, but the NC3 with the suspension package and a few minor mods would easily be just as capable as my Boxster- while being newer, cheaper to maintain and operate with better reliability. You may not which one is right for sure until you drive them back to back. I am usually a somewhat picky buyer, just be even pickier when it comes to the Boxster and you should be fine.

After a lot of thought on this I am pretty much where I started...

I would not be afraid of a perfect unicorn car with a stack of paperwork from a previous owner, but there are also a lot of these owned by people that don't seem to know or care about a whole lot. Things like the incomprehensible and failure prone coolant tank design don't give me a lot of confidence in the 986 as a whole either.

The base 987.2 really seems like a lot more money in the ~$25k range but they are also totally bulletproof by comparison and it seems like some bad luck with a 986 could easily put you into that territory as far as total investment.

Maybe until I can afford a 987.2 I will go for a higher-mile S2000 or a cheap NC and live with that for a while.