Learn me: early-mid 2000’s tow rigs

I just did a 4-day factory Ford training on the 6.0, 6.4, and 6.7. After all that plus my background experience with 7.3s, it really seems like 6.0 is the sweet spot. I've ridden in some minorly modded ones that I liked. The Super Duty is my favorite of the 1 ton trucks of that era because it's like legos and can be updated with newer parts to look more modern inside and out fairly easily, plus i like the basic shape of it a lot. 

Ive also had good highway races with modified 6.7 trucks in my old GS450h and 911  and gotten a STOCK 6.7 dually to spin all 4 back tires in 2nd gear. But the power comes with a lot of added complexity and cost compared to the 6.0, which is mostly old-school and a lot less 'crammed together' in an engine bay.

jfryjfry said:

In reply to codrus :

What do you think of your truck??

It gets the job done.  I'm not really a "truck guy", so I basically only drive it when I'm towing the trailer or for occasional trips to Home Depot.  I bought it with 140K, it needed a bunch of front end steering work in order to not suck.  That's very common with GMT800s, the steering boxes wear out by 100K and there aren't any new ones available, they're all remans.  The QC on the remans is terrible, so it's not unusual to get a replacement that's worse than the one you took out.  I have since learned of https://redheadsteeringgears.com who are supposed do a better job with the remans, next time I need one I'll check with them.

With the TPD enclosed trailer in the photo I'm getting like 8.5 mpg, which isn't great.  It's a heavy trailer (something like 7500 pounds loaded), and it's tall so there's more drag, but everyone says it should be more than that.  I haven't figured out why yet, though.

Mine has the leather interior, the driver's seat was shot so I recovered it and also found a replacement steering wheel from a truck recycler that was in better condition.

I've already said a bunch, but I'll narrow down my opinion.

Here is my list in order of first choice to last based on your budget and needs.  One of my favorites of all time is the P-pump 12v Cummins, but only if it's in an F250 so it won't show up on this list.

LBZ
LLY (very close second, almost tied for first since they are so similar)
LB7 with injectors done (but most of these are a bit long in the tooth)
6.0L bulletproofed
LMM (only this far down because of MPG, otherwise it rocks)
6.4L or 6.7L stroke
6.7L Cummins, but unfortunately it comes in a truck that I personally don't like

I know it's not "mid 2000s", but the 2010 Dodge redesign may have sorted a number of your complaints about those trucks. My FIL has a 2006 3500 dually and I have a 2010 2500. I've driven cross country in both and the difference in ride quality and ergonomics is dramatic. The 6.7 is a sleepier feeling engine in stock form but the whole truck is much quieter and more comfortable. The Fox shocks I stuck underneath a few months ago improved the ride even further. It helps that it's a 2500 instead of a 3500 - I installed airbags to beef up the rear when it's loaded.

This is just FYI based on the reasons why you don't like Dodges - it may be worth looking at the 2010+ trucks.

Very valid assertion.  I think the newest one I experienced was 05-06.  I will look at them, but I have a feeling it will be 15 years before I can afford one 

That's a valid concern. They do keep their value. I'm okay with that!

Curtis et al:

i found a 2007 Chevy 2500hd that meets my major criteria. 

I want 4wd and this is 2 but since I would never go off-roading with it, I’m willing to compromise. 

The question I have is it’s a 6.0 gas motor. 

How are these motors and trannys for towing?

i hate to say it but I am particularly interested because it is the nice newer gm (we had a 2008 Tahoe and I rather liked the cloth interior) and it is that silver-blue color that I have really come to like a lot. 

6.0 is good for towing but terrible gas mileage. I've only towed a couple times with a borrowed 2009 2500hd but it was fine even with a 9000lb trailer which is more than I ever tow with my 5.3 1500. 

Evan has it spot on.  Plenty of power, but poopy mpgs.  My BIL has an 05 2500 with the 6.0L and he gets 14 empty and 8-9 towing 8000 lbs.  Compare that to our LB7 that gets 20 empty and 15 towing the same.

The 4L85E will do well.  Keep a close eye on shift points in and out of OD.  I recommend backing off the accelerator a bit and manually pulling down to D before the ECM does it on its own at WOT.

This seems like a good place to ask for advice.  I tow my Mazda and gear (3000ish lbs) inside an '04 Haulmark 24' enclosed (3000ish lbs) using an '06 Dodge 3500 5.7 gas dually.  I first tried towing the trailer with my '07 1500 Yukon but that was a bit scary, even with proper tongue weight (no equalizer bars though), thus the dually which is great since the trailer never moves it.  I'm considering replacing those two vehicles with an '08 and up Suburban/Yukon XL 2500; research tells me those years have the upgraded 6.0 gas engine/trans.  The 6.0 will likely have similar power and mileage to the Dodge (only 8ish MPG towing), but I wonder if the trailer will move the 2500 SUV around the road a lot, like it did the 1500?  I'm hoping the 2500 would be similar to cruising in the dually since the trailer is not that large (yes I could always add bars to the hitch).  Any insight is much appreciated! 

The 2500 Suburban should be fine pulling your trailer. I pulled a couple 28 ft enclosed trailers with my 2003 Burb, it did it quite well with no drama. One was 8600 lbs and the other 9800 lbs. Although I do have the 8.1L, but the 6.0 will work for your trailer. GM recommends that you use a WD hitch with trailers over 6000 lbs, I do and it helps out quite a bit.

In reply to Clark18 : how was the balance on the trailer?  60% of the weight towards the hitch? 40% towards the back?  50-50 or tail heavy will cause the trailer to sway.  

Next check the trailer alignment.  Just put a pair of strings on 2 pairs of jack Stand’s  stretch out the string lightly brushing both rear tires and out past the hitch.  

Now measure the distance from the string to the hitch.  It’s not uncommon to be off a tiny little bit but some trailers are crazy off! More than a 1/4 inch difference between one side and the other. In effect turning the trailer when going straight.  

I am in a similar boat with two boys getting bigger in a ‘98 12 valve dodge quad cab. One boy will probably be 6’5”, the other 6’2”. I have decided that unless something drastic happens they are just going to have to deal with it. The Dodge doesn’t seem to get a lot of love but my experience has been great. No rattles still, interior nice, 270k miles. One really good transmission rebuild at 120k not local/cheap. I figure the boys being huge is a temporary issue. In a few more years they will be gone and the truck will be back to the perfect size. Jcamper

In reply to frenchyd :

I was hitch-heavy, even heavier made it better but the trailer still moved the 1500 around a fair amount. I'm hoping a 2500 will tow my 24' more like my dually... doesn't sway no matter the speed/conditions.

In reply to Jcamper :

the Dodges get a bad transmission rap.I'm not 100% why, but its a common thing from talking to all the dodge guys i know - and that's for trucks going back 15 years or more. I have a large family and i had a few Dodge minivans - Achilles heel to those was the transmission as well...i replaced 3, something about a pin walking out, a design flaw. For the most part i like the Dodge truck, i rented a new one a few months ago when i was on business. The "displacement on demand" system on the 1500 took a bit to get used to though, but fit and finish was quite nice. I found myself going for a drive instead of going back to the hotel! But like i mentioned earlier, i got an 07 LMM 3500 Dmax express extended van to tow the race car with and i'm converting it to have a living space...and it has a new trans lol!

Matt said:

In reply to Jcamper :

the Dodges get a bad transmission rap.I'm not 100% why, but its a common thing from talking to all the dodge guys i know - and that's for trucks going back 15 years or more. 

I give them a bad rap because I ran transmission repair shops for 7 years.  Small diameter clutches, weak input shafts and drums... they just never did the R&D.  They kept taking the A518 and beefing it up.  They called it different things like 46RE, 47RE, but it was more or less an old 727 torqflite with OD and heavier parts.  It just wasn't a good baseline.  They could have avoided the whole thing by making a real transmission for it but they never did.  Things seem to be improving at Ram, but I'm out of the business so I wouldn't really know.

I do recall a disproportionate amount of the Dodges frying transmissions because they thought it was wise to put a useless check ball valve in the cooler line.  They get clogged and temps spike.  Any dodge that had one, we cut it off or drilled it out.

The one thing I do remember was the parts cost.  Not only did Dodge transmissions tend to fry more parts when they went, the parts themselves were at least 50-60% more expensive.  I could buy a rebuild kit with converter for a 4L80E for under $200.  That number is more like $350 for the Dodge.  Input drum for a 4L60E was something like $33, but for a 47RE more like $180.