Learn Me: My Daughter Totalled the berkeleying Car...

I guess if there's a bright side at least she's hitting smaller objects.

Woody wrote: I remember seeing some kind of PSA commercial when I was a kid where they described the safe following distance as a two second space cushion. They counted, "One thousand and one. One thousand and two." It made an impression on me. I've known this since I was seven years old and it boggles my mind that the concept is so hard for other people to understand. Especially other people who live in my house.

I usually leave a 3 second space cushion, just because you never know if anyone or anything is going to dart out into traffic.

Woody, that's Driver Ed Training, don't try it on the LIX or just about anywhere else.

Have you tried the 2 second rule lately? At least around here that means another car will fit in the space and will try.

Woody wrote: I remember seeing some kind of PSA commercial when I was a kid where they described the safe following distance as a two second space cushion. They passed a sign and counted, "One thousand and one. One thousand and two." It made an impression on me. I've known this since I was seven years old, and it boggles my mind that the concept is so hard for other people to understand. Especially other people who live in my house.

Same here, although I'll admit in traffic I don't always follow it (re: wlkelly3's comment...). The joys of living in a congested area. However, I do make sure I can see through the car in front of me (and preferably a few in front of that), which is one of the nice things about driving a minivan... I'm usually starting to slow before the car in front of me does.

Bummer about the car, but at least she's OK.

I'm of the "her car, her problem," mindset.

My daughter smashed her first car taking a off ramp too fast. Bent axle, broken wheels, destroyed tires, shifted front sub-frame. I did almost nothing to help her get it fixed. I let her foot the bill for all the repairs. I also let her deal with the shop that repaired the axle, track down and buy the new wheels and tires, the works. Her fault, her problem. $1500 later she had her car back. She's almost too careful now, but she remembers the $1500 lesson.

If she has a second accident through stupidity, she loses use of my cars and comes off my insurance. The third, and she's definitely on her own. I'll pat her back and say sorry, but beyond that, not my problem.

hitting the wildlife would have done a lot of damage too, but it would have been no fault. Friend of mine just got a possum in his Mercedes.. the bumper alone is over a grand.. and they still have not gotten it into the shop to see if there us any other damage..

Woody wrote: Nobody seems to listen to the only driver in the house who hasn't hit anything in the last 25 years, aside from the occasional cone on an autocross course.

How many seconds is a SUV worth on a lap time?

mad_machine wrote: hitting the wildlife would have done a lot of damage too, but it would have been no fault. Friend of mine just got a possum in his Mercedes.. the bumper alone is over a grand.. and they still have not gotten it into the shop to see if there us any other damage..

one of my friends is a retired claims adjuster … his advice is NEVER try to dodge the wildlife (caveat: unless you are 100+% sure you can make it) because if you end up in the ditch, = your fault … if you hit the wildlife = not your fault

Sorry to hear that, but I'm glad your daughter is OK. Mistakes that we can walk away from (now matter how frustrating) are OK in my book.

Few people leave a reasonable distance between their car and the one in front of it. I try to leave a good distance, but ultimately if no one in front of you is leaving the right distance, it makes it tougher.

As cars become more capable, I think people don't realize how close to the ragged edge they are. I've followed some people on back roads on the way into work, and I don't think they realize they're at 9/10s. At that point, it won't take much to cause an issue (sand on the road, car stopped up ahead, cyclist, deer, etc.). If we go back to drum brakes, maybe everyone will leave a safe distance!!!

wbjones wrote:

mad_machine wrote: hitting the wildlife would have done a lot of damage too, but it would have been no fault. Friend of mine just got a possum in his Mercedes.. the bumper alone is over a grand.. and they still have not gotten it into the shop to see if there us any other damage..

one of my friends is a retired claims adjuster … his advice is NEVER try to dodge the wildlife (caveat: unless you are 100+% sure you can make it) because if you end up in the ditch, = your fault … if you hit the wildlife = not your fault

Add to that the point that animals, while they can do significant damage to an auto, are squishy and soft compared with telephone poles, trees, rocks and drainage culverts. ALL of which will win against your car.

dj06482 wrote: As cars become more capable, I think people don't realize how close to the ragged edge they are. I've followed some people on back roads on the way into work, and I don't think they realize they're at 9/10s. At that point, it won't take much to cause an issue (sand on the road, car stopped up ahead, cyclist, deer, etc.). If we go back to drum brakes, maybe everyone will leave a safe distance!!!

More capable and with traction, stability, and other "controls" seemingly impervious to the laws of physics. Like you said, cars are very capable, much more capable than their drivers, and when you finally do get in over your and your car's head, all you can do is hang on and hope for the best.

Years and years ago, friend of mine went from a 73 Impala, who's handling and braking were marginal at best, to a new to him 89 Cougar. Where he had been a very cautious driver in the Impala, I watched him not slow till the very last second at stop signs and corners as the Cougar was that much more capable... It was a scary transformation to watch, as my buddy was a marginal driver to begin with (he has trashed and totaled every car he has owned in 20 some years of driving)

I feel your pain brother. Upgraded my daughter from a 96 Bonneville to a 07 Civic Coupe after the 3800 in the Bonneville finally gave up the ghost. She promptly ran over a median and pushed the subframe back a good 4 inches (less than a month after I bought the car) I should have seen it coming as I had put the Bonneville back together twice due to "Youthful exuberance" which was the reason for putting her in an H-body beater in the first place. Cheap, easy to fix and not much lost if it gets wrapped around a tree. Well, after I had a few months to think about it (it took that long to sort the insurance payments out between auto and GAP on the loan) I bought her another car, this time an 07 Fit, with the stipulation that if she breaks this one she's on her own. Thank god she will be out of university soon

logdog wrote:

Woody wrote: Nobody seems to listen to the only driver in the house who hasn't hit anything in the last 25 years, aside from the occasional cone on an autocross course.

How many seconds is a SUV worth on a lap time?

Off course.

In reply to wlkelley3:

I don't think I've ever been able to leave 2 seconds between cars.

I blame NASCAR. We watch those in car cameras as they do 175mph+ just inches away from each other so we all drive like that around the Chicago area. I am surprised how many folks ride my bumper as I'm doing 80mph down Interstate 294 (normal speed for most).

Woody wrote: I remember seeing some kind of PSA commercial when I was a kid where they described the safe following distance as a two second space cushion. They passed a sign and counted, "One thousand and one. One thousand and two." It made an impression on me. I've known this since I was seven years old, and it boggles my mind that the concept is so hard for other people to understand. Especially other people who live in my house.

The real problem is when laws are not enforced most people ignore them. If police started pulling over groups of vehicles for following too close people would start driving more safely.

I live in a small village and because stop signs and lights are no longer enforced people run them routinely to the point of having to brake because of someone breaking the law is now considered normal.

2 seconds eh? Judging by the fact that nothing has gone seriously wrong due to my driving in all 17 years of it, i would say anyone i catch in normal driving is just not going fast enough.

Now call it a 2 second LEAD rule, and i'm all for it. I would rather not submit to a driving style that is basically a race to the bottom (of the speedo) feedback loop. I am less worried about 3rd world traffic enforcement, actually. I'd way rather smash into other random people than have any kind of encounter with law enforcement. Seems less risky in general.

I've been driving since 1965 … the 2 sec rule was how I learned … thankfully where I live, the traffic isn't bad enough that you need to ride the bumper of the car in front

for that matter our Interstates are, for the most part, flowing enough that cruise control is on pretty much all the time, and if someone rolls up behind me and just parks it there, I'll drop the cruise 1 mph at a time until they realize what shiny happy people they are, and pull out to pass, then I'll speed back up to my normal speed, the tailgaters ALWAYS disappear off in the distance … though it is funny how often I catch back up to them when they've settled in behind someone else … it's like they can't drive without someone directly in front of them

wlkelley3 wrote: Have you tried the 2 second rule lately? At least around here that means another car will fit in the space and will try.

And unless you can give us a really good reason why it is important that they don't get in front of you I see this as part of the problem.

I use to think like that. Then one day I asked my self just that question. Is there a good reason why it is so important that I don't let people get in front of me? I could not find one. That was the day that I realized I was part of the problem. I had aggressive driving tendency's and I was just another shinny happy person. No better than all the other's on the road. People need to relax out there. Who cares if someone gets in front of you. Is it some kind of race? Am I that much of a self absorbed a-hole that I should never let anyone in front of me? Does it really need to be a competition and a source of friction and angst when some one wants to get in front of me? Really made me think!

Try this. Leave 10 minutes early. Relax. Stop for a cup of coffee or tea or what ever your favorite beverage is. Spend a little time looking around at the other people and be nice. Let the other people in that feel it is important that they get in front of you. I have actually come to WANT those types in front of me. Let them move on down the road and get away from me. You will get to your destination much more relaxed and in a much better mood.

Seriously, if any one has a real reason why it is important to not let some one in front of you I would like to hear it.

Sorry she's crash prone, glad that it was minor.

wbjones wrote: I've been driving since 1965 … the 2 sec rule was how I learned … thankfully where I live, the traffic isn't bad enough that you need to ride the bumper of the car in front for that matter our Interstates are, for the most part, flowing enough that cruise control is on pretty much all the time, and if someone rolls up behind me and just parks it there, I'll drop the cruise 1 mph at a time until they realize what shiny happy people they are, and pull out to pass, then I'll speed back up to my normal speed, the tailgaters ALWAYS disappear off in the distance … though it is funny how often I catch back up to them when they've settled in behind someone else … it's like they can't drive without someone directly in front of them

Yes they have to tailgate, they know no other way to drive. Where I live there are usually miles between vehicles on the interstates, yet there they are, risking my life. I stopped slowing down, and started to just move into the left lane. They either slow down or speed up, I imagine they are very confused.

In reply to dean1484:

Its not usually a matter of tailgating but that however far I lay back someone will fit into the gap. Like nature, urban traffic also abhors a vacuum.

Wall-e wrote: In reply to dean1484: Its not usually a matter of tailgating but that however far I lay back someone will fit into the gap. Like nature, urban traffic also abhors a vacuum.

As someone else who lives in a dense urban area, this is sadly the truth 99% of the time. I'll let someone in and back off to create my gap...and then someone else noses in. Back off to create my gap again...and then someone else takes the spot. This happens ad infinitum until you just say "berk it" and realize you are on the road in order to get to work and not be the doorman for everyone else on the road.

berkeley! Glad shes ok.