Making an L body handle - Shelby Charger content

Well that only took 2 years. After punting trying to make the 2011 Challenge I have the best intentions of dragging THIS out of the weeds and bringing it this year. I still have to install the new shift linkage and get a warm start issue chased down but other than that I'm guessing she will be able to run.

Here's the issue, she seriously needs some help in the handling department. When I had her running and driving (briefly) she seemed a bit of a wallowy pig. She probably needs struts at the least but I'd really like to get her lower and much stiffer. I have scoured the Turbomopar and turbododge sites and it seems that while lowering springs are available, they really don't lower the car that much from stock. I'd really like to get some coilovers on there and pick my spring rates as a 350/300 or 400/350 setup seems to be the choice for an autocross configuration. Springs are fairly cheap (and in budget) but the Ground Control coilover setups are a little more than I want to spend.

Here's the rub, how to do this on the cheap? I don't plan on keeping this car and I really don't want to throw a lot of money at it. She will not be anywhere near a top contender at the Challenge and she has enough minor rust issues to not really be worth a resto. At the end of the day she would make a good base for a track car, drivetrain donor swap, dedicated autocrosser or drag racer.

So I guess I'm asking 2 questions. 1) Do I change anything about the suspension to make her handle better for the Challenge (springs ,struts, coilovers) or just leave her as is and RWYB?

2)If I am going to make a change, what would be my best bang for the buck?

oh, and 2A (paging Pat)) Is there a happy medium setup for both autocross and drag or should there be a different setup to help it hook better on the drag strip?

Additional info on current setup: 2.5L block with original 2.2 head and GLHS intercooler setup. As far as I know she has stock turbo and injectors. Stock 525 tranny (no LSD), well used autocross tires and drag slicks. Nitrous setup if I get around to installing it. Stripped interior (all stock plastic was flaking into oblivion so I trashed it). Oh yeah and she has a flaking/peeling/rusty paint(sic) scheme that I actually kinda like the look of.

Oh, and a final question. Has anyone ever pulled the rear glass from one of these and replaced with Lexan? That back hatch has got to weigh 90+ pounds.

It basically is a K car still..... I would think most of those ideas carry over.

But to just put it into perspective, just OE replacement stuff will be the biggest bang for the buck here.

I thought this was about door handles lol.

Check boostedmopar.com faq there is an article about using talon agx struts on a l.

On a side note I so wanted to buy that car but don't have the cash or ability to get out home from FL.

Ranger50 wrote: It basically is a K car still..... I would think most of those ideas carry over.

No, the Omni/Horizon/Charger/024/Turismo were L-bodies, as the title says. The chassis pre-dates the K-cars by several years and I believe was originally a joint venture with Renault. I think you are thinking of the Daytona.

I would say the most important would be to replace all the worn out bushings, and get good tires. Beyond that, better struts should make a huge improvement. I actually have one mopar performance l-body rear shock that was never used you could have for $10, I think the other one is gone forever but if I ever found it you could have that one too. I don't think they handled that bad stock when they were new, but worn out they are pretty bad.

In reply to moparman76_69:

Couldn't find the thread you were looking for in their Suspension FAQ section. Can you post the link? I see the one on the GC setup which may work a cheap Ebay setup as well. Not sure if I like how the guy set the rear but it may be fine.

In reply to Travis_K:

Yeah, as soon as I get it into the shop I plan to do a complete analysis of the bushings and see if they are critical. Guessing they are. Best place for replacement? RockAuto? What about to change to poly?

Also, thanks for the shock offer. Any idea where to get a partner for it? I don't think they are still manufactured.

I would change to poly just for the ease of reinstallation. If it's going to be geared toward performance, definitely.

polybushings makes bushings for the front and rear.

http://boostedmopar.com/forums/showthread.php?3100-Mitsubishi-struts-on-an-L-body

I think QA1 still makes the current version of those shocks, an exact match to the one I have is unlikely though. I would not recommend changing the bushings at the rear of the front control arms to poly because it will cause the suspension to bind, and also probably crack the welds on the kframe, for the rest either poly or rubber is probably fine. If you get control arms from a caravan they have welded on reinforcements too. If it was mine I would probably just do tires and bushings (and strut mounts, ball joints, etc if needed), then see how it works. Then after that figure out a way to use better front struts. One possibility is to get mk2 vw strut tubes and inserts, and either cut the top part of the MK2 strut tube off and weld it to a gutted l-body strut, or remove the part at the bottom that bolts to the knuckle from both and weld the l-body one to the VW strut tube. Then you can use bilstien HD inserts (anywhere from about $7.50 each at the junkyard to $99 each new). I have measured them and the length is close enough it would work. I never tried it though because I couldnt keep my charger running right and I sold it.

To me, it depends how cheap you want to go. If you want to be much lower and stiff, i would buy Koni Strts for a 1g neon for the front, convert them to use cheap coilover sleeves, and run an $80 set of ebay neon camber plates, which will bolt into your strut towers with the drilling of one hole. You wont have adjustability in the struts but it will be low, stiff, well damped (assuming a reasonable spring rate), and give you some neg camber.

If you dont really want to spend ANY money i would try to get some stock SRT4 neon take-offs and bolt those in. It won't be as low but it will be much stiffer and properly damped assuming the struts arent already worn out. IF they are worn out you can get KYB GR2 for a PT cruiser or 2g neon (they dont list GR2 for srt4 even though it's the same strut design) for ~$60/each and hope for the best. If you cant get SRT4 springs you can use front springs from an intrepid or 300m and cut to suit. They fit on the neon strut perches properly other than length.

The VW damper stuff is pretty damn easy. About the only thing you have to do is mill the spindle where it slips into the strut yoke to narrow it for the VW stuff. other than that i think it's 100% bolt in.

MK1 rabbit/924/early 944 struts can fit on the front. Look for take-offs from Spec944/ITS racers.

Adjustable spring perches are cheap if you poke around, Hondas are a good source. Sell the springs off and buy some from a circle track supplier in the proper rate and length.

CRX front lowering springs work great for the stock rear.

The rear shocks might be adaptable from a generic shock with a different top mount solution, this would also allow better spring rate selection.

The Front Sway bars suck and bind like crazy on the K's and L's. Poke around the round track racers and find a bar that is adjustable and can be mounted to the front frame rails away from the control arms. Early 924s again can have good bars that would work for this, but likely won't be stiff enough. Then attach them to the control arms with some tabs.

The rear sway bar can be improved in a similar way or you can add a simple bar of flat steel to the trailing arm cross bar with some hose clamps. Add more clamps or more bars to make it stiffer. Costs a few bucks to dial in some oversteer.

Cheap lowering . Cut one coil from each spring.

Toe out the rear for better rotation on corner entry. about 1/4" total if you are brave. You can use shim stock at the spindle mounts.

I have a Charger that is heavily modified and I have a couple of suggestions. First, I would get a book that deals with front wheel drive like Don Alexander's book: http://www.amazon.com/Performance-Handling-Handle-Techniques-1990s/dp/0879384182 The first suggestion he has for stock FWD cars is to loosen or disconnect the front sway bar to get the ass-end to rotate. Push is the biggest problem our cars have and that is the easiest solution. Another easy, and cheap idea is to source some Honda CRX (around 250 lb/in) front springs, buy an adjustable spring perch and install on the rear struts. Front toe should be set at 1/8-1/4" out and the rears should be slightly toed-in. Without camber plates you should be able to get 11/2 to 2 degrees of negative camber. Depending on what kind of tires you have, the rear pressures should have 5 pounds more pressure, again, like all the other ideas is to enable the TTO, trailing throttle oversteer, and take away the push. The cars handle pretty well and once you have the TTO, you are able to get on the throttle early in the corner, pulling the car around the corner.

And installing the Lexan window is quite easy and will save a ton of weight. The window will have to be braced from the inside as the forces down on it at speed are considerable. I used 1/8" and it has survived 20 years. Don't forget to elongate the holes when mounting to allow for temperate expansion. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=643711832327460&set=a.643710542327589.1073741841.122188127813169&type=1&theater

Great looking car. I'm interested to know more about the setup on that car. Is there a thread about it somewhere here, or do you have a link to any such thing?

Wow. Lots of great info here. Thank you all for the suggestions. I will revisit my budget and the local pick-n-pull with some notes and see what I can come up with. I'll start a build thread and let you know how it progresses.

Brock2, thanks for that setup info and the rear window confirmation. I can't wait to get that weight out of the car.l

Stiffening the rear suspension helps a lot.

Tom_Spangler wrote:

Ranger50 wrote: It basically is a K car still..... I would think most of those ideas carry over.

No, the Omni/Horizon/Charger/024/Turismo were L-bodies, as the title says. The chassis pre-dates the K-cars by several years and I believe was originally a joint venture with Renault. I think you are thinking of the Daytona.

I think it was Volkswagen rather than Renault. The very first Omni's had VW engines.

The l body was a unique platform. There was a simca horizon that was a similar body style in Europe but the American omni/horizon were larger with a mac strut front and trailing arm rear.

If the vw/porsche fronts can be uses that sounds like a good idea to me, that should be the easiest application to find used bilstiens or konis for too. Also, the mopar performance rear shocks are just generic circle track/hotrod shocks you can get from summit, so that type of thing should work fine on the back.

In reply to jstein77:

It wasn't Renault, it was SIMCA which later became Chrylser Europe. The first Omni's and Horizon's had 1.7 VW engines (with 2-bbl carbs) or Peugot 1.6L pushrod motors. That was due to the 2.2 not being ready yet and because AMC had a working relationship with VW/Audi (from when they bought 2.0L engines for the Gremlin/Pacer).

Actually knew a local guy that built a 1.7L powered Horizon with VW performance parts (1.8 GTi engine, 020 5-speed, etc.) gave my Uncle's 2.2 GLH a run for its money as they were both prepped for SP autocross.

Virgo, I built the car for the 1995 One Lap of America. I used Shane Lewis' old IMSA International Sedan Shelby Shadow as the donor car for most of the parts. The engine, freshly rebuilt, is a Turbo II upgraded Garrett, forged pistons, etc, the trans is a 555 with a one-off LSD and a 410 gear. Intercooler and oil cooler installed both sides of the Blackstone Racing radiator. The front suspension uses the Shadow knuckles with Alcon calipers, Porterfield rotors, custom coil-overs front with Bilstein inserts, splined end 1.125" hollow sway bar and 600 lb/in springs. The rear is the Shelby Koni upgrade with the same spring-perch set-up I mentioned above with 500 lb/in springs and a 38" 1.125" inch solid sway bar with Daytona rear disks. Strut bars front and rear, and camber plates. The car is about 6" lower and 8" wider than stock on 225/50/16's. The car is about 2400 lbs right now with the 3/4 cage.

Vigo/Virgo, sorry. And the early Rabbit sway bars will work in the Chargers but again, I would touch the front bar until you have too much oversteer, if that can happen. ;-)