As another guy coming from BMX bikes in the '80s, I rode flat pedals way too long, probably through about seven years on the mountain bike. From time to time, I tried toe clips, which always kind of sucked on a trail. When I finally decided to switch to pushing a bigger single gear all the time (1998?), the leverage advantage of the clipless pedal really flipped a light on. The second thing is that with faster riding on trails with loose rocks, a pair of Vans will eventually net you a broken toe, or something close (along with pieces of alloy pedals breaking off), hence the value of proper clip-in bike shoes with board-stiff soles.
Weirdest point: I began crashing way less when I switched to clipless pedals. I still crash, because that's what happens when you're on two wheels, but there is a psychological advantage to clipless pedals that most are not aware of: commitment.
Recommended pedal: Crank Brothers Egg Beater (I have three sets.)
I can't do flat pedals. I tried. My feet wander off and I have some bad clipless habits. I would 100% smash my toes in a lighter skate type shoe, and did. Really need Five Tens or something mountain specific with toe box protection and a good pedal with metal traction pins and nice concavity.
I had Beaters on my cross bike and had an awful time with them. I may not have shimmed the cleat far enough off the sole and engaging was just not easy. The small contact area was also disagreeable to someone of my size. I also had a couple accidental releases when the bottom would strike a rock and release the pedal because of the opposed design. They had a batch a couple years ago with terrible bearings/bushings that would just fall apart and slide off the spindle. They did clear mud awesome though. I've been an SPD guy for years now, they just work.
The Fookers (raceface ripoff) should treat you well but like others have said get some proper shoes. FiveTen used to be the answer but apparently they have gone downhill in quality/performance.
I personally use clipless pedals, flats just don't work for me. I've tried a bunch of them and came back to Shimano SPD. They're a quality pedal from the entry level model to the top of the line with many options and styles to choose from and they seem to last forever (I've still got my original set going strong from 12 years ago). My only experience with Crankbrothers was an entry level set of egg beaters, the quality at that time didn't seem great and they can be hard on some shoes (had them ruin the sole of some Louis Garneau shoes).
I'm a fan of Hardtail Party as well but I sometimes get annoyed with him as someone built the opposite of him (he has short legs, long torso, I'm long legs/short torso) so he is always complaining about longer seat tubes and things like that. I feel like his ideal frameset wouldn't have enough seat tube for me to even use in the XL size with my legs and a long dropper so I feel he is a bit short sighted in that sense. He does get some interesting bikes and brands though.
fatallightning said:
I can't do flat pedals. I tried. My feet wander off and I have some bad clipless habits. I would 100% smash my toes in a lighter skate type shoe, and did. Really need Five Tens or something mountain specific with toe box protection and a good pedal with metal traction pins and nice concavity.
I had Beaters on my cross bike and had an awful time with them. I may not have shimmed the cleat far enough off the sole and engaging was just not easy. The small contact area was also disagreeable to someone of my size. I also had a couple accidental releases when the bottom would strike a rock and release the pedal because of the opposed design. They had a batch a couple years ago with terrible bearings/bushings that would just fall apart and slide off the spindle. They did clear mud awesome though. I've been an SPD guy for years now, they just work.
Well, that all sounds familiar!
rustomatic said:
As another guy coming from BMX bikes in the '80s, I rode flat pedals way too long, probably through about seven years on the mountain bike. From time to time, I tried toe clips, which always kind of sucked on a trail. When I finally decided to switch to pushing a bigger single gear all the time (1998?), the leverage advantage of the clipless pedal really flipped a light on. The second thing is that with faster riding on trails with loose rocks, a pair of Vans will eventually net you a broken toe, or something close (along with pieces of alloy pedals breaking off), hence the value of proper clip-in bike shoes with board-stiff soles.
Weirdest point: I began crashing way less when I switched to clipless pedals. I still crash, because that's what happens when you're on two wheels, but there is a psychological advantage to clipless pedals that most are not aware of: commitment.
Recommended pedal: Crank Brothers Egg Beater (I have three sets.)
IMO it is personally preference as long as you aren't racing XC or dropbar bikes. I don't like clipless. I hate the feeling of being tied to the bike. It is zero fun to me. I can't think of the last time I slipped a pedal on a downhill. With heels down, good pedals and shoes, you aren't coming off. The only time I slip pedals is if I am in way to low a gear and go to pedal hard. Plus if you are riding somewhere where you need to do some hike a bike, they suck a lot less to hike in. Flats have changed massively since 1998
On my more versatile bikes I use the shimano pedals that are flat on one side and SPD clip on the other. Honestly SPD clips are too small to me leading to hot spots. I'd never use them on a road bike.
84FSP
UberDork
8/3/22 4:29 p.m.
I may go clipless on my next bike for sure. The bmx racing solution involves peril but works.
I went clipless when I was 16 or 17, it cut down on knee pain a lot to be able to lock my feet into one position. And it is so easy to unclip compared to "feet belts". Never had an issue with unclipping, a quick thrash to the side and you're out. (This with Wellgo copies of Shimano M737s)
I could not imagine riding a bike with platform pedals, anymore...
I can't imagine riding flat pedals. I had an early experience hitting something on a downhill hard enough to pop both feet off the pedals and my butt off the seat - not comfortable at speed. I've been clipped in since about 1986. Besides, having your feet able to do more than just push down opens up a lot of options for bike handling. Spiky pedals to the shins have always sucked.
I'm a big Crank Brothers fan because they're always the right way up so they're quick and easy to clip into. I used to use their road bike pedals, but I went to the "Mallet" series a few years back because you can use them unclipped for a moment and they're a little more comfortable with the load spread more. I could also ride them with normal shoes but why bother? I have no problem hiking in my shoes but that's because I chose shoes that I could hike in :) I can't think of the last time I had a problem because I couldn't unclip.
In reply to 93gsxturbo :
I had a Heckler. Wonderful bike. My only complaint was that it instilled false confidence in me, ending up with a very painful fall when even it couldn't save me from my lack of talent.
Road bike I ride clipless but I don't have the confidence on the mtb trails to go clipless so still riding flats there. I am sure if I got out on the mtb trails more I would go back to clipless there also.
Keith Tanner said:
I can't imagine riding clipless.... I've been clipped in since about 1986. Besides, having your feet able to do more than just push down opens up a lot of options for bike handling. Spiky pedals to the shins have always sucked.
Based on the rest of your post, I think that you are misunderstanding the word "clipless", which admittedly is counterintuitive.
https://www.cycle-sos.co.uk/clip-vs-clipless-pedals-for-commuting/
You're right, my bad. I shall edit one word for clarity. I do know what clipless pedals are because I've had lots of bikes with old school toe clips and even rode with cleats on the road for a while. I forgot that the old bear traps were called flats now.
In reply to No Time :
I'm 14, and have literaly the exact same bike LOL
In reply to MrStickShift :
How do you like it?
I still need to get ot REI to pick it up.
I used to get massive pedal bites from my Chester's but haven't since I got a pair of shoes. I have the bontrager 510 clone. My son has ride concepts and they were cheaper but work as well. I will probably go back to clipless but not until my kids get older. Too much stopping and starting now.
Surprised to read so much dissent on dropper posts. I don't have one myself but 90% of my riding buddies do (I can only think of one other person, in fact). It's not just about not flying over the bars on super technical stuff, dropping your body a few inches pay dividends on everything fast, twisty, and downhill. Almost everyone I ride with has a light XC bike (I have a Supercaliber XX1, which replaced a 19lb S-WORKS hardtail) and they use the posts constantly. Getting the seat out of the way makes it easier to position your body where you want it and weight/unweight into and out of corners.
Keith Tanner said:
I can't imagine riding flat pedals. I had an early experience hitting something on a downhill hard enough to pop both feet off the pedals and my butt off the seat - not comfortable at speed. I've been clipped in since about 1986. Besides, having your feet able to do more than just push down opens up a lot of options for bike handling. Spiky pedals to the shins have always sucked.
I mean if you are sitting on a downhill there is a problem. 
If you haven't tried flat since 1986 a lot has changed. I am not saying to change from clipless but it is kind of hard to judge flats if you haven't riden modern flat pedals with modern shoes. I am not sure I agree about the bike handling thing.
WTF is a clutched derailleur?
also, Time ATAC or whatever are the modern equivalent is what i'd choose for pedals. i've used them for about 20 years now.
mfennell said:
Surprised to read so much dissent on dropper posts. I don't have one myself but 90% of my riding buddies do (I can only think of one other person, in fact). It's not just about not flying over the bars on super technical stuff, dropping your body a few inches pay dividends on everything fast, twisty, and downhill. Almost everyone I ride with has a light XC bike (I have a Supercaliber XX1, which replaced a 19lb S-WORKS hardtail) and they use the posts constantly. Getting the seat out of the way makes it easier to position your body where you want it and weight/unweight into and out of corners.
I've noticed it's mainly from riders who spend a lot of time in the high posting era and have learned to ride around it. I started on a mountain bike in 97, and the geo on those bikes was silly in retrospect for any kind of technical riding.
It's not just descending for me, a little lower lets me pedal through chop and roots without getting bucked off the saddle. Makes hopping logs and smaller obstacles way easier when your saddle isn't smashing your taint. On flat corners it helps drop the bike in and load up the side knobs.
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) said:
WTF is a clutched derailleur?
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/product-news/need-clutch-rear-derailleur-380721
Basically the derailleur has a clutch in it to keep the chain tight helping to prevent the chain from coming of and from slapping around so much.
That shot is exactly the kind of thing I had in mind as I was typing. About a year ago, I started watching some technique videos on YT and have been trying to rewire my riding brain a little.
It's funny that you mention coming of age back then (I started in '94 with a GT Karakoram). On a ride a while back when I still had my S-WORKS hardtail, I told a friend that he should pass me. We were going through a rolling, twisting lightly technical section. Lots of little step ups/downs. Traction management at a premium. "No way dude, I love watching you ride. Total old school hardtail." Best compliment ever.
93EXCivic said:
Keith Tanner said:
I can't imagine riding flat pedals. I had an early experience hitting something on a downhill hard enough to pop both feet off the pedals and my butt off the seat - not comfortable at speed. I've been clipped in since about 1986. Besides, having your feet able to do more than just push down opens up a lot of options for bike handling. Spiky pedals to the shins have always sucked.
I mean if you are sitting on a downhill there is a problem. If you haven't tried flat since 1986 a lot has changed. I am not saying to change from clipless but it is kind of hard to judge flats if you haven't riden modern flat pedals with modern shoes. I am not sure I agree about the bike handling thing.
Hey, it was in the 80s. I don't recall if I was sitting or what, but the experience of being off the bike other than my hands was not reassuring and was easily solved.
My wife's Trek came with "modern" flat pedals. They didn't seem all that technologically advanced to me, they're a pedal with spikes in it. Neither do her shoes. She likes them because she's not comfortable being clipped in. I'm very comfortable being clipped in, so I fail to see what advantage losing the clips would bring. I can certainly see some disadvantages in power delivery. There's a reason the Tour de France guys haven't gone to flats :) And yes, I do think the ability to pull up on the pedals as well as push down is an advantage in bike handling as well.
I've said before, I'm a XC rider. I don't huck, I'm not interested in big crazy drops where I might have to be sitting on the back tire with one foot fending off a rock or something. I like trails with natural flow and I'm not afraid of climbing. Our local trails have a lot of elevation change. I would call my preferred trails "technical" but the definition of that word has shifted as illustrated by fatallightning's use of the term. My equipment choices reflect this.
I really like this thread--clearly lots of you guys do, too. Sorry to the OP, but you clearly sparked an MB fire that exists within these pages. Good job!
Here's some blather that combines the dropper post thing with the clipless pedals:
I have crappy knees, partly because I began crashing a BMX bike off jumps at age five; things have improved little. Anywho, a little while after I started riding clipless in the late '90s, I learned about pedal float, which is basically how much your heel can pivot when you are clipped in. This lead me to Speedplay Frogs (a bike shop owner friend used them), which I wound up riding for a long, long time, as they really helped me avoid some quantities of knee pain (not real bad, just occasionally nagging). Float is a thing and these days, the Egg Beaters take care of it pretty well . . .
So to tie in the dropper post thing, another thing I figured out a long time ago regarding knee pain avoidance is the need to keep a very consistent leg extension distance when riding. In other words, you base your seat height on how much extension you'd like out of your seated pedal stroke--most go lower than me, and some roadies will actually fully extend their feet. I aim for just over flat with the foot.
A dropper post, at least in my five or so years of experience with one on a bike I could only make myself ride once a month, will degrade over time and turn into a (sagging) suspension element. As such, it constantly changes the distance your leg travels. This is especially annoying on climbs, and it aggravates the knees, just like a lack of pedal float.
Yeah, old guy TLDR . . .
