NC MIATA in a nut shell...

Thanks keith for your additioanl input....although I still think the NB Miata in a dark colro si the best looking Miata.

But the early cars in blue (smurf or montego) are fabulous.....

Keith Tanner wrote: If track day is part of the equation, then PRHT is not. It's an unfortunate state of affairs. But there's no roll protection possible with that top unless you concoct a removable setup.

What is wrong with this for the casual track day? I know many organization allow you to run soft tops with factory roll hoops like Boxsters and NC's

Keith Tanner wrote: I guess it depends what we mean by "mild power". Honestly, a Targa Package is a really nice setup. I know that sounds like a full-on ad, but I'm also in the position where, if I don't think it's good enough, I can do something about it. Almost every part in the Targa Package is an FM exclusive, so that means each part is one that we worked on until we said "yup, that's what we wanted".

Eek. $7,650 sounds and is big, but I agree it's a lot for the money. It starts to look better when you consider an 09 NC + Targa package Vs a used 986/987S

Keith Tanner wrote: But if you want to drop the cost a bit and you have a pre-2012 car, get the FM Stage 2 suspension, a fun sounding exhaust and slippery tires. That would probably be pretty entertaining. Very comfy to drive (I've done back to back 1000 mile solo days in them) and fun. A 2013 Club Edition with a set of sway bars is also a pretty compelling argument. It's the first new Miata in some time that had me actually thinking that just maybe it would be a good addition to the garage.

I’m not sure exactly what the club edition is that you can’t get on the GT. Sorry, but I like leather seats, fart warmers and automatic climate control. What makes the Club a club package that you can’t get otherwise?

P.S. Keith, is there a build or project log of the Targa NC like you have for your NA Targa car. I don't see it on the FM site?

In reply to Adrian_Thompson:

Looking at the Mazda site, the Club gets you the Sport Package as standard equipment whereas it's an option (requires Premium package as well) on the already more expensive GT.

Then, for guys that do have NC Miata money, some may actually be buying C5 Corvettes, Boxsters, S2000's, WRX's, and other higher powered performance cars.

You nailed it. For similar money id buy 3 of those 4 before the NC. I LIKE the NC a lot! But for what they cost, there's a whole raft of cars i'd rather have.

Vigo wrote:

Then, for guys that do have NC Miata money, some may actually be buying C5 Corvettes, Boxsters, S2000's, WRX's, and other higher powered performance cars.

You nailed it. For similar money id buy 3 of those 4 before the NC. I LIKE the NC a lot! But for what they cost, there's a whole raft of cars i'd rather have.

...and this indeed is the question I am trying to answer for myself right now!

1966stang wrote:

Vigo wrote:

Then, for guys that do have NC Miata money, some may actually be buying C5 Corvettes, Boxsters, S2000's, WRX's, and other higher powered performance cars.

You nailed it. For similar money id buy 3 of those 4 before the NC. I LIKE the NC a lot! But for what they cost, there's a whole raft of cars i'd rather have.

...and this indeed is the question I am trying to answer for myself right now!

I'm thinking 3 years down the line for a new DD. At that time a real possibility would be:
New/almost new S550 Mustang GT Convertible
Early S197 Shelby GT500 Convertible
987 Boxster S or even Cayman
LAte NC with Targa package thrown at it

All different cars, but all performance soft tops (Cayman excepted) But it's a real world scenario that's playing out in my mind frequently.

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

1966stang wrote:

Vigo wrote:

Then, for guys that do have NC Miata money, some may actually be buying C5 Corvettes, Boxsters, S2000's, WRX's, and other higher powered performance cars.

You nailed it. For similar money id buy 3 of those 4 before the NC. I LIKE the NC a lot! But for what they cost, there's a whole raft of cars i'd rather have.

...and this indeed is the question I am trying to answer for myself right now!

I'm thinking 3 years down the line for a new DD. At that time a real possibility would be: New/almost new S550 Mustang GT Convertible Early S197 Shelby GT500 Convertible 987 Boxster S or even Cayman LAte NC with Targa package thrown at it All different cars, but all performance soft tops (Cayman excepted) But it's a real world scenario that's playing out in my mind frequently.

I could see this, but my thoughts are lighter, angrier car. I would like an S2k, BRZ, et al perhaps more than the Mustang. YMMV.

1966stang wrote: I could see this, but my thoughts are lighter, angrier car. I would like an S2k, BRZ, et al perhaps more than the Mustang. YMMV.

My mileage would vary :) I want light angry toys, but for DD's I want fast and angry with luxury and convenience, leather, automatic climate control, fart warms, Bluetooth, stability control and enough airbags to cushion a fall from orbit.

Adrian_Thompson wrote: What is wrong with this for the casual track day? I know many organization allow you to run soft tops with factory roll hoops like Boxsters and NC's

What's the point of a roll bar if your helmet sticks up above it?

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

1966stang wrote: I could see this, but my thoughts are lighter, angrier car. I would like an S2k, BRZ, et al perhaps more than the Mustang. YMMV.

My mileage would vary :) I want light angry toys, but for DD's I want fast and angry with luxury and convenience, leather, automatic climate control, fart warms, Bluetooth, stability control and enough airbags to cushion a fall from orbit.

Oddly enough as I approach 50....the older I get, the more I want a DD that feels like a motorcycle. I still need heat for an Ohio winter, though.

z31maniac wrote:

Adrian_Thompson wrote: What is wrong with this for the casual track day? I know many organization allow you to run soft tops with factory roll hoops like Boxsters and NC's

What's the point of a roll bar if your helmet sticks up above it?

Really, I would rather ahve a dedicated track car with a full cage. Bad things happen to cars on race tracks. I also would rather bend up a $2500 RX-7 than a 25K NC Miata. Just call me cheap.

....my philosophy si don't race it unless you can write it off. And I really can't afford to write off a 25K car.

I have a problem with the "don't take it on the track if you're not willing to write it off" philosophy, but that's a different discussion. A $2500 RX7 and a $25k NC aren't a direct comparison at all, either - you're not picking realistic prices for either. Anyhow...

One thing an NC Miata has over the Corvette/Boxster/WRX choices is cost of consumables. Even down to the price of a replacement engine should it come to that, which it likely will in the second two choices

The roll bar on the PRHT is super-low. No taller than stock, or the roof won't go up. Go sit in a stock NC and see if your head is under the bar. I'll bet it isn't. Also, note the lack of rear bracing, again due to the limitations imposed by the top.

We don't have a build diary for the Targa NC because it was just our normal development NC that got pressed into service. It was built over a long period as we developed one part and then another.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

Since my first question got buried in page 2, why wouldn't the PRHT just be considered a hard top car in a track situation? I would think the connection points for that top would be stronger than a typical hard top over a convertible/

My favorite Miata by far is the early 1.6 cars. I've had 1.8s and a couple of NBs, but just like the 1.6 versions. But...I drove a '13 Club and loved it. It's everything the early NC isn't. No, it's not as sweet and go-kartish as the earlier cars, but it still was a nice drive. It was a difficult choice not to pick it when I bought a new car last year. In the end, it came down to wanting a coupe instead.

That leads me to my next question, and I probably need Keith to answer. Couldn't you just put a roll bar in the hard top models and then pull a fuse or something on the top? I mean I would probably never drive it with the roof off anyway. Is there an actual issue even with the top up?

Keith Tanner wrote: I have a problem with the "don't take it on the track if you're not willing to write it off" philosophy, but that's a different discussion. A $2500 RX7 and a $25k NC aren't a direct comparison at all, either - you're not picking realistic prices for either. Anyhow... One thing an NC Miata has over the Corvette/Boxster/WRX choices is cost of consumables. Even down to the price of a replacement engine should it come to that, which it likely will in the second two choices The roll bar on the PRHT is super-low. No taller than stock, or the roof won't go up. Go sit in a stock NC and see if your head is under the bar. I'll bet it isn't. Also, note the lack of rear bracing, again due to the limitations imposed by the top. We don't have a build diary for the Targa NC because it was just our normal development NC that got pressed into service. It was built over a long period as we developed one part and then another.

Agree with the cost of consumables. Why do you have a problem with the don't take it to the track if you can't afford to write it off philosophy?

Not gonna get into that here.

It's possible some track organizations might consider the hinged, articulated folding fiberglass roof equivalent to a fixed roof. Good luck, I suspect most won't.

If you have decided that you will never put the top down, then grab your helmet and make sure you can wear it with the top up. Then make a custom bar that fits under that erected top. Hint: much easier to get a removable hard top and a Blackbird Fabwerx bar off the shelf. After all, if you're not going to retract the top, you don't need all that extra stuff to retract it.