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perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/27/12 11:53 p.m.

We have been running our V8 Miata on track for some time now and have found the Hoosier R6 275-35 R15 (HR6) to be the tire of choice for our car on both 9” and 10” rim widths. There is really only one major negative issue with the HR6 275 tire and that is cost at $288 each.

I have therefore been looking for some time for an alternative tire that would perform as well as the R6, provide similar longevity and be of similar size and at a price point that was more in line. After reviewing every tire manufacturer site, racing sites, call asking around and reviewing and testing the alternatives, I have finally now found an alternative.

American Racer makes a tire for Formula and Modified cars in the 23.5-10-R15 (http://www.americanraceronline.com/Asphalt-Track/modified.html). These tires are available in 2 compounds (similar to the Hoosier A6 and R6). The specifics on the American Racer (AR) tire when compared to the Hoosier R6 (HR6) are as follows:

AR 23.5/10.0-15, width 10”, section 11”’ diameter 23.8”, Circ. 75” Cost $115 Two compounds available M28 (soft) 131 (Medium)

HR6 275/35 R15, width 10.1”, section 10.8”, diameter 23”, Circ. 72.2”, Cost $288 Two compounds available A6 (soft) R6 (Medium)

So after reviewing all the details, making a few calls, I ordered 2 sets of the AR tires in the 131 compound from Day Motor Sports (www.daymotorsports.com). Shipping was significantly cheaper as Day Motor Sports will ship up to 24 tires on a pallet for a flat fee (in my case $100) vs. the shipping price per tire when I have order the HR6 tires at as much as $18 each.

Upon receiving the AR tires we took numerous measurements, reviewed the sidewall stiffness and then mounted and test fitted on the car. While the circ. is approx. 3” larger on the AR vs. the HR6 we had already mounted a body kit and flared fenders to fit the R6 so no further modifications were necessary.

We then scheduled a two-day testing session and loaded up the car on the trailer and filled the tirerack with the HR6 and the AR tires.
Hoosier tires recommend the R6 tire be heat cycled and then laid up for up to a week to gain the best performance. In contrast the AR recommended initial heat cycle process is not as onerous. AR recommends the following process. Run a few laps to get the new tires up to temp (we were looking for 180 – 190 degrees F). This should be done with an initial lap at a slow pace, then increasing lap speed in subsequent laps so that at lap 4-5 we were running the car at about 80% pace.

We then pulled into the hot pit and checked tire temps. When certain we had reached the targeted heat range we immediately returned to the pits raised the car and pulled the air out of the tires. The tires were then allowed to cool (out of the sun). This allows the cords in the tire to shrink and bond together and also makes the tire more resistant to graining.

The initial feel of the AR tire when being heat cycled was not as crisp at initial turn-in as compared to the HR6, however overall grip levels were very similar. We next mounted a se of the HR6 tires on the car and set out to establish a lap time baseline.

We then remounted the heat cycled AR tires and ran 8 or so laps (heat race length) and reviewed tire pressures and temps at the end of the session. The first AR tires session lap times were just off (almost a full second slower) the HR6 lap times. We found that my initial guess on tire pressures in the AR’s was too high. Once the tires cooled off we lowered our air pressures and set out for another 8 lap session. These lap times were in line with the HR6 tire lap times. Driver feedback was also positive, as the initial sloppy turn in feel was gone and overall grip levels gave the driver a heightened level of confidence when compared to the HR6.

We then made a few chassis and further pressure adjustments and topped off the tank and then set out on a long run on the AR tires. We were able to match the lap times of the HR6 tires for almost 20 laps before running out of fuel. Temps were now close to even across the tire surface and handling degradation from 1st lap to last lap was in line or a little better than the HR6.

So after 4 heat cycles (initial heat cycle, 2 short lap sessions and one long lapping session) the tires were showing even wear, no flat spots, and have many more laps left in them. Time will tell just how many sessions / heat cycles we can get out of these tires before they heat cycle out, so far no noticeable heat cycle degradation has been identified.

So if you are looking for a reasonably priced low profile 275 15” track tire available in auto cross (soft) and road race compounds, this may very well be an alternative for you too.

Mark

petegossett
petegossett UltraDork
5/28/12 12:05 a.m.

That's the right diameter for my Europa, and I'd like to squeeze something that wide on there. Thanks for the info!!!

perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/28/12 12:12 a.m.

This was a great find for sure hope you have as much luck with them as we have had.

Mark

Ian F
Ian F UberDork
5/28/12 8:15 a.m.

Nice write up.

The main downside for autox may be the Hoosier is a DOT labeled tire whereas the AR tire is not. Still, it does look like a nice low cost alternative for a race tire class that can run it. I wonder if loosecannon knows about it. His car uses the same size.

Knurled
Knurled Dork
5/28/12 8:23 a.m.

Checking the site, they do have DOT labeled tires, too.

And they have 235/60-13s, as well as tires in the 15" wide by 24" tall range. Color me curious.

T.J.
T.J. PowerDork
5/28/12 9:15 a.m.

I heard about AR tires not too long ago. Apparently they also make 10" slicks (not 10" wide, 10" wheel diameter) for Mini applications.

Duke
Duke PowerDork
5/28/12 10:16 a.m.
Knurled wrote: Checking the site, they do have DOT labeled tires, too. And they have 235/60-13s, as well as tires in the 15" wide by 24" tall range. Color me curious.

Yeah, I'd be looking for something that would approximate a 225/45/15 and fit on an 8" or 9" wheel. I'll have to look! The only thing that worries me is the $100 pallet load, because I'd only need 4 tires.

belteshazzar
belteshazzar UltraDork
5/28/12 10:37 a.m.

hell of a review. thank you.

Rad_Capz
Rad_Capz Reader
5/28/12 10:47 a.m.

Excellent post, do you know the weight of the car?

JohnyHachi6
JohnyHachi6 Reader
5/28/12 10:50 a.m.

Yeah, I wonder about their DOT tires as well. Too bad they're only in 13's and 15's, but they look like they could be promising, AND they have a distributor here in Atlanta - nice!

fast_eddie_72
fast_eddie_72 SuperDork
5/28/12 11:04 a.m.
Knurled wrote: Checking the site, they do have DOT labeled tires, too. And they have 235/60-13s, as well as tires in the 15" wide by 24" tall range. Color me curious.

That's interesting. Hummm. I run the 275/35 Hoosiers on the Celica. I'll have to do some measuring.

perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/28/12 12:37 p.m.

The weight of my car without driver and 1/2 tank of fuel is 2281 lbs.

Mark

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UberDork
5/28/12 1:15 p.m.

Been thinking about these for a friend after seeing a hillclimber running them. Nice to see that they have comparable performance. Keep us posted on the durability please!

Curmudgeon
Curmudgeon MegaDork
5/28/12 1:50 p.m.

That would certainly help with the ol' race tire horrible disaster, er, budget. Thanks!

perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/28/12 3:48 p.m.
Apexcarver wrote: Keep us posted on the durability please!

We will be shortly running in 95 plus degrees ambient, and associated high track temps. This will certainly check the durability. I will post what we find.

Mark

petegossett
petegossett UltraDork
5/28/12 5:28 p.m.

Does anyone have a link to their site or a distributor? Google only finds tire dealers in Arkansas.

perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/28/12 5:44 p.m.

In the initial post day motor sports link is a distributor. There is also a link to American Racer above.

bmw88rider
bmw88rider New Reader
5/28/12 6:58 p.m.

Ahh. American racer. Used their dirt track tires for years on my friends hobby stock circle track car. Good tires for that. We never tired them for pavement because we never ran pavement.

They make a "street" performance tire for the pure stock classes. It may be an alternative for rally cross too. I know they worked well for dirt track racing.

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Reader
5/28/12 7:07 p.m.

They make a 21.5x10x13 slick which is perfect for my a-mod,anyone know how soft their compound is compared to a R25b?.

Curmudgeon
Curmudgeon MegaDork
5/28/12 7:36 p.m.

I dropped them an Email with that exact question about that exact size. Hope to hear tomorrow.

Vigo
Vigo SuperDork
5/28/12 8:13 p.m.

Judging by how they look on those wheels im guessing they wouldnt work too well on a 7.5" wide wheel?

Id TRY to run 15x9 on my aries if i could FIND any that had the right offset.

perryrace
perryrace New Reader
5/28/12 8:45 p.m.

I had a similar offset issue and went to diamond racing wheels. They will make any offset you want in a steel wheel for about $90 each. The money you would then save on tire would pay for the rims in short order, well that is what I have found anyway.

Mark

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Reader
5/28/12 9:58 p.m.
Curmudgeon wrote: I dropped them an Email with that exact question about that exact size. Hope to hear tomorrow.

With my email they are going to wonder why the sudden interest.

kevlarcorolla
kevlarcorolla Reader
5/30/12 8:01 p.m.

Recieved an e-mail back regarding the tire,the softest compound is currently only available in the dirt tracker but if a minimum of 65 tires are ordered(same size) they will make the slick in the softest compound-for about $112 canadian. So who wants to start flooding them with requests for these to use in a market they've never considered?.

Curmudgeon
Curmudgeon MegaDork
5/31/12 8:40 a.m.

I spoke with the SE distributor, the softest they make is a 26 durometer. From what I see, the R25B Hoosier is around 50 and so is the A6. No, the durometer is no guarantee that the tire will perform the same but in the interest of being reasonably close for comparison, it's a start.

I need to do a little more digging but it looks like they have a ~45 durometer asphalt slick in the size I need for about $110 US. It's not DOT approved so won't be legal for all AX etc classes. But they do have some DOT race tires as well.

I'd still like to get a little more durometer info on Hankook C71's etc. if anyone has that info. Here's the thread I started on that subject: http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/i-humbly-beseech-impart-your-durometer-smarts-to-me/50198/page1/

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