Recommend me pads for mixed street/track car

The other thread on brake questions reminded me that I have to choose some performance pads for my 'rolla. The car gets both street and track use, it's OK if the brakes squeal or need a few stops to heat up, but I don't want something that's going to be uselessly under-temp all the time on the street. Right now I'm using cheapo metallic pads that don't get gooey but are probably devouring my rotors.

Here's what Hawk has available for the AE92 GTS:

HB191E.590 Disc Brake Pad; Blue 9012 w/0.590 Thickness;

HB191N.590 Disc Brake Pad; HP Plus w/0.590 Thickness;

HB401F.587 Disc Brake Pad; HPS Performance Street w/0.587 Thickness;

HB191F.590 Disc Brake Pad; HPS Performance Street w/0.590 Thickness;

HB191S.590 Disc Brake Pad; HT-10 w/0.590 Thickness;

770242 Premium OES; Disc Brake Pads;

770325 Premium OES; Disc Brake Pads;

Carbotech.

Here are the compounds that Carbotech has available:

1521

AX6

XP8

XP10

XP12

XP16

XP20

RP2

I daily the Carbotech AX6 in my STi, very nice manners for a capable pad... excellent autocross response and life, but for a track day I would replace the fronts with XP10... then switch back. In a lighter car the XP8 would likely be fine.

I like the Carbotech over the Hawk on a street driven car if only for the dust... the Hawks dust a dark, sticky, corrosive (when wet) mess that is very tough to clean. The Carbotech dust comes off with a spray of the carwash wand...

as always of course, YMMV

Hmm alright so Carbotech XP8 sounds good...the car's gonna be about 2200lbs.

GameboyRMH wrote: Hmm alright so Carbotech XP8 sounds good...the car's gonna be about 2200lbs.

If you aren't going to track it, you probably don't even need that aggressive.

It's mostly street and autocross with a few laps here and there, but I'm thinking of caging up the car next year and getting back into weekend track days. I'll have a brake vent system in by then.

Hawk HPS is my default pad for mixed-use cars, but I don't push it that hard at track days, so YMMV. I've also used Porterfield R4S in the past with good results.

I was alays happy with my HPS or HPplus pads.

porterfield R4 or R4S.

Can I piggyback on your thread?

I found out my front brakes on the miata are currently rocking 1.8 brakes and hawk blues. Well... I plan on only doing maybe 2 track days a year but I do an autocross once a month so the bite on these is awful. So I need to swap them out and save the hawk blues for some serious track time.

Also all the guys on the miata forums are saying I need a lot more rear bias and should run an aggressive pad in the rear. I really don't want to drop 100+ just for a set of 2 pads right now even though they are suggesting something like HPS front and HP+ rear

Do you guys have any thoughts?

When we endurance raced a Ford Focus SVT we used XP10's on the front and XP8's on the rear. They were great for braking ability and gave good wear. But I would not want to use them on the street as they had to have some heat in them to work well.

Jaynen wrote: Can I piggyback on your thread? I found out my front brakes on the miata are currently rocking 1.8 brakes and hawk blues. Well... I plan on only doing maybe 2 track days a year but I do an autocross once a month so the bite on these is awful. So I need to swap them out and save the hawk blues for some serious track time. Also all the guys on the miata forums are saying I need a lot more rear bias and should run an aggressive pad in the rear. I really don't want to drop 100+ just for a set of 2 pads right now even though they are suggesting something like HPS front and HP+ rear Do you guys have any thoughts?

Proportioning valve?

z31maniac wrote:

Jaynen wrote: Can I piggyback on your thread? I found out my front brakes on the miata are currently rocking 1.8 brakes and hawk blues. Well... I plan on only doing maybe 2 track days a year but I do an autocross once a month so the bite on these is awful. So I need to swap them out and save the hawk blues for some serious track time. Also all the guys on the miata forums are saying I need a lot more rear bias and should run an aggressive pad in the rear. I really don't want to drop 100+ just for a set of 2 pads right now even though they are suggesting something like HPS front and HP+ rear Do you guys have any thoughts?

Proportioning valve?

+1 for proportioning valve. If you run mismatched pads the brake bias will change dynamically as the heat in the pads changes. If you use a proportioning valve with the same pads you don't have that problem. Mismatched pads are only good for working around rules that don't allow proportioning valves.

GameboyRMH wrote: It's mostly street and autocross with a few laps here and there, but I'm thinking of caging up the car next year and getting back into weekend track days. I'll have a brake vent system in by then.

my recommendation would be the XP8 if you're going to track it... the AX6 is a great pad for DD and a-x ( says he who a-x's with his DTC60's or the XP 10's )

Even with a proportioning valve the miata is front biased and I need to replace the pads. I am more worried about pad choice than bias currently

Jaynen wrote: Even with a proportioning valve the miata is front biased

We meant adjustable proportioning valve AKA brake bias controller that would let you adjust the bias.

HP+ should serve you well if you can live with the dust.

Here's another option - EBC Redstuff pads. They are ceramic based and produce much less dust than others.

It really depends on how much track work you are going to do. If you do a lot, the Reds will stop but will also wear faster than a race pad like the Yellowstuff.

I am using the Reds on my Solstice and they are way better than stock for even spririted driving - much better intitial grip, and no fade.

Look at EBC SELECTOR

I have EBC Yellows on the Super Coupe. Braking is very good cold and outstanding hot. They do squeal a little when they are hot at low speeds. They are dusty. I love them so far.

GameboyRMH wrote:

Jaynen wrote: Even with a proportioning valve the miata is front biased

We meant *adjustable* proportioning valve AKA brake bias controller that would let you adjust the bias.

An adjustable proportioning valve only reduces the amount of rear braking. This will not help a front biased set up, that would require a adjustable pedal box with two master cylinders

Oh yeah, I loves me some Porterfields R4S

So what are the best weekend/autocross cheap pads I can throw on just to get those HPblues off? I am not that worried about my front bias due to better brakes on the front right now.

I could go 1.8 rear brakes also or a more aggressive pad but I wont do a proportioning valve its not worth it to me right now.

The only thing I am really having issue with is the lack of bite on the cold brakes

aussiesmg wrote:

GameboyRMH wrote:

Jaynen wrote: Even with a proportioning valve the miata is front biased

We meant *adjustable* proportioning valve AKA brake bias controller that would let you adjust the bias.

An adjustable proportioning valve only reduces the amount of rear braking. This will not help a front biased set up, that would require a adjustable pedal box with two master cylinders

Depends, that's true for the type that goes between your stock proportioning valve and the rear brakes, but if you get one that replaces the stock one like this "combination proportioning valve" here:

http://www.hrpworld.com/index.cfm?tpc=Wilwood-Brake-Proportioning-Valves&form_prod_id=5235&action=product

That will let you set more rear bias than stock.

I had Carbotech pads and shoes on all four corners of the mazda. Thrashed them through 24 auto-x and 6 lapping days in one season. Never felt fade.

Replaced the front pads with Hawks the next season. I plan on switching back to Carbotechs. The hawks had great stopping power but had a different pedal feel.