bravenrace wrote: In reply to ReverendDexter: Power is a feature. Handling is a characteristic. It generally costs more to produce a higher powered engine, but it doesn't necessarily cost more to make a car handle a certain way. It's more a matter of tuning.
I disagree. It takes a lot of engineering to make a really good handling car that is still road usable.
ReverendDexter wrote:bravenrace wrote: In reply to 93EXCivic: That makes it more appealing to you, not worth more money. What I'm talking about is content vs price, not things that are a matter of preference.Wait, how does power count as "content" but handling is only a matter of preference? Is this simply because power is easily quantifiable, or... ?
Yeah, that and it works for his argument. Lol. I think you are all getting to worked up comparing cars you are not even looking at.
93EXCivic wrote: The FRS has a computer screen display, keyless entry, power door locks, power windows, A/C, power mirrors, cruise control, 8 speakers, 6 airbags, ABS, VSC, and whole bunch of other things I don't understand. What else do you want in a car? Built in ass-wiping function? Personally I am hoping the release a stripper model without most of that E36 M3 so I can buy that.
I want to agree with this, but I don't. The amount of money they'd knock off the price to remove all that crap would be trivial; I bet you'd still pay at least 90% of what they're asking for the fully contented model and that's if they didn't pull a Porsche and charge more for taking stuff out.
In reply to ReverendDexter:
In Japan they offer a stripped out version for cheaper then the normal model, Toyota FT86 RC (or something like that).
bravenrace wrote:Bobzilla wrote:If it was $20k, I very likely would own one right now.rotard wrote: I think the FRS would be a great car at $20k. I think there are better choices for me at current prices.This x1000. I think the base FRS/BRZ at $20k would be a good deal. At $25-35k there's way too much competition and better deals.
I as much said this about a year or so ago....
The stripper model was shown in one of these posts... none painted facia, and 16" steel wheels...
IT was supposed to be the $20k car
I'd rather get one that comes with a stripper than one that wipes my ass.
93EXCivic wrote: In reply to ReverendDexter: In Japan they offer a stripped out version for cheaper then the normal model, Toyota FT86 RC (or something like that).
IIRC, that one also had a 1.5 or 1.6L instead of the 2.0.
ReverendDexter wrote:93EXCivic wrote: In reply to ReverendDexter: In Japan they offer a stripped out version for cheaper then the normal model, Toyota FT86 RC (or something like that).IIRC, that one also had a 1.5 or 1.6L instead of the 2.0.
Completely wrong, the 2.0 is the only engine available in any FR-S/BRZ/FT-86 in the entire world. It has 16" wheels. You were probably thinking of that.
The JDM "RC" stripper model comes in at about $22k USD. It took a year of the Genesis for Hyundai to offer the R-spec, I'm not holding my breath for the RC but it's not impossible. That being said, this one doesn't even have a radio, bumper paint, or a glovebox from the looks of it...probably not a good fit for most of the US market.
In reply to SlickDizzy:
Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.
93EXCivic wrote: In reply to SlickDizzy: Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.
Well, Scion did offer the tC "spec package," which was basically the same thing but on the top-heavy, ho-hum, "why would anyone race one of these" tC. Of course, I'm sure that they'll use the tC spec's low sales to justify not bringing the RC...
93EXCivic wrote: In reply to SlickDizzy: Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.
Say what? That would just be a regular FRS with unpainted bumpers and steelies. That doesn't make any damn sense at all. 
Javelin wrote:93EXCivic wrote: In reply to SlickDizzy: Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.Say what? That would just be a regular FRS with unpainted bumpers and steelies. That doesn't make any damn sense at all.
I like a basic radio instead of a computer, delete a bunch of the non required electric stuff.
93EXCivic wrote:Javelin wrote:I like a basic radio instead of a computer, delete a bunch of the non required electric stuff.93EXCivic wrote: In reply to SlickDizzy: Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.Say what? That would just be a regular FRS with unpainted bumpers and steelies. That doesn't make any damn sense at all.
The thing is, the FR-S anyways (BRZ has nav, IIRC) comes with a basic-as-basic-can-be radio with a CD player and maybe MP3 function if I remember right. Nothing else. There isn't much other power stuff to get rid of. Power windows & locks maybe. I think that's it, and those would likely not offer any real weight savings. That is why the RC deletes the radio entirely, along with the dash trim & glovebox...I think the windows & door locks have to remain for JP federal safety standards, and re-engineering a manual system just for the base model obviously wouldn't save any money. So pretty much the only choice they have is to straight-up remove crap.
93EXCivic wrote: What else do you want in a car? Built in ass-wiping function?
SWMBO thinks the ass-wiping function is required if I get to drive and she has to be a passenger...
In reply to SlickDizzy:
I thought they all came with nav systems. Well then j/k I don't want to live with a non A/C car again.
SlickDizzy wrote: Well, Scion did offer the tC "spec package," which was basically the same thing but on the top-heavy, ho-hum, "why would anyone race one of these" tC. Of course, I'm sure that they'll use the tC spec's low sales to justify not bringing the RC...
And therein is the biggest problem with the dealer's gouging the public. It affects sales numbers along with speed of sales and that affects what is offered as well as whether certain models even survive or if other models by other manufacturers see the light of day. The manufacturer looks at the sales figures/time period PERIOD.
If, after all the hub bub, the sales figures seem lackluster in any way there is no telling what options or other models never appear.
In reply to carguy123:
Huh? The tC is generally sold via Scions no markup thing. The FRS is the first time I have heard of Scions marking up cars.
The Subie dealer down the street from me sold both of the ones they got within 9 days of them hitting the floor.
I have no idea what they went for, but man... I LOVED the seats in that thing and I'd love to put them into my Forester if they'd fit.
One of you go to carsdirect and get a quote E-mailed to you from local Scion dealers and find out - it's the only way to know, and, if you're interested, it's time well spent.
"Guys, guys, just wait a small fraction of your life until demand comes back to earth and prices will fall into line."
My local Scion dealer (Rohrich Scion) has been trying to sell me an automatic equipped car via email for two weeks. Says it would be at sticker price, plus taxes tags and a "doc" fee. I keep telling them that I don't want to even look at an automatic but they're persistent.
Javelin wrote:93EXCivic wrote: In reply to SlickDizzy: Yeah I am hoping they offer it with the option of A/C and radio but I would be very surprised if something like the RC is offered at all.Say what? That would just be a regular FRS with unpainted bumpers and steelies. That doesn't make any damn sense at all.
For us, probably not, but for the "tuner crowd" who would likely install a body kit and aftermarket wheels the moment they got the car home, maybe it does.
I know I'd change the wheels and I'd put the TRD body kit on it if I had the money...looks much more like the concept with that kit.
I would consider a Toyobaru FR-Z @ around $25K.
For $35K, it better have a freaking V8 under the hood. At this point in time, I'm glad I bought a Mustang 5.0 instead of waiting for this "hachiroku" successor.
I think the point about scarcity is a very valid one that is going over a lot of people's heads.
Argue features vs value vs GRM entitlement, but the bottom line is that most dealerships will get half a dozen of these cars per month, and they're trying to maximize their profit.
They don't give a damn if you don't want to pay it. They'll wait a week and someone else will. As long as that keeps happening, prices will stay inflated.
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