So, a car hit my house...

Stories like this are why so many people hate insurance companies and dread making a claim. Im no help but my boss who once hit a house said his insurance company settled it within a month. (He lives 2 houses from the one he hit and is still friends with the owner).

In reply to dropstep:

These are the stories that make me realize this is all wrong.

My wife's coworker recently had a car smash into her house and destroy the front steps and part of the house.

I'd have to ask my wife the details but I know they got well above what the estimate was and were able to do new floors or some other improvement. And it was don't in a few weeks.

We on the other hand can't seem to get 2/3 of the estimate and it's been 7 months.

ebonyandivory wrote: In reply to carknut: I wish I could answer your question but I know so little about the ins and outs of insurance claims, I don't even know how to answer. Part of your post suggests that I take my contractors estimate and bring it to the "perpetrator's" insurance company? Am I able to do that even though our homeowners is involved and is (I assume) subrogate her insurance afterwards. (I never got why we've not been dealing with her company from day 1) None, I repeat NONE of this is going the way I expected. And certainly not the way I know other very, very similar claims have gone. It's incredibly frustrating because I don't know where I stand or how to move forward

Subrogation in my experience typically takes months, you don't want to wait for that. You have every right to file a claim directly against the liable person's insurance. If you don't know who that is, I'd get a copy of the police report. Typically in an auto accident that information is exchanged. Do you have an agent helping you? You can't wait on your company to call. You need to be on the phone daily. When you start feeling obnoxious, call 10 more times. Some information is missing in the offer they made you, I wouldn't think 12k would begin to fix the foundation damage. You either had an inept adjuster or claims rep at Liberty Mutual.

ebonyandivory wrote: In reply to dropstep: These are the stories that make me realize this is all wrong. My wife's coworker recently had a car smash into her house and destroy the front steps and part of the house. I'd have to ask my wife the details but I know they got well above what the estimate was and were able to do new floors or some other improvement. And it was don't in a few weeks. We on the other hand can't seem to get 2/3 of the estimate and it's been 7 months.

I sympathize with your situation, and don't disagree that you should be made whole. I admire your patience over the last few months.

But the example you just gave sounds like a much smaller and less comprehensive repair than the foundation repair, window replacement, drywall, paint and total residing job you're dealing with at home. I wouldn't base your expectations on that one case.

carknut wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: In reply to carknut: I wish I could answer your question but I know so little about the ins and outs of insurance claims, I don't even know how to answer. Part of your post suggests that I take my contractors estimate and bring it to the "perpetrator's" insurance company? Am I able to do that even though our homeowners is involved and is (I assume) subrogate her insurance afterwards. (I never got why we've not been dealing with her company from day 1) None, I repeat NONE of this is going the way I expected. And certainly not the way I know other very, very similar claims have gone. It's incredibly frustrating because I don't know where I stand or how to move forward

Subrogation in my experience typically takes months, you don't want to wait for that. You have every right to file a claim directly against the liable person's insurance. If you don't know who that is, I'd get a copy of the police report. Typically in an auto accident that information is exchanged. Do you have an agent helping you? You can't wait on your company to call. You need to be on the phone daily. When you start feeling obnoxious, call 10 more times. Some information is missing in the offer they made you, I wouldn't think 12k would begin to fix the foundation damage. You either had an inept adjuster or claims rep at Liberty Mutual.

Can't say I agree with most of this. First, with limited exception, getting an agent involved is NOT going to help. Agents, while I love them, are good at selling policies. Unless they're former claims people...and a few are...they're clueless about claims. As I've said before, going to a typical agent to help you with a claim is like going to the finance manager at the car dealership to help you rebuild your engine.

Subrogation wouldn't be relevant to OP here, except for any deductible he has. If he files with his own carrier and his claim is settled, the subro is done "behind the scenes" as far as the policy holder is concerned. It could take months, years, but it wouldn't matter to OP except for the deductible.

You can call 10 times per day. Can't guarantee you that's going to produce the desired result. Also not so quick to throw the Liberty Mutual adjuster under the bus. Don't know all the details, and I mean as far as what's happened on the insurance side. I still feel like I'm missing something. You've got a $12k estimate. Do you have a $12k check? Did you get an estimate from the appraiser Liberty Mutual sent? Has it been given to your contractor? Has he called that Liberty Mutual appraiser? Did they physically get together, at your home, to discuss the scope of the work needed? If the answer to any of these questions is no, then something somewhere is missing and pick up the pieces from the first question that has a "no" answer.

In reply to Klayfish:

My suggestion for contacting his agent is so that the claim is not allowed to sit idle. The Insured doesn't know what to do. That is a failure of the claims people not being clear with what needs to take place in the process. That's why agents are needed, they have the relationship with the client, and ultimately their livelihood is on the line to retain a satisfied client. So it behooves the agent to make sure that claims are paid, repairs are done, and the customer's life and property is restored to pre-incident condition. I've worked as a go between many times where communication is stagnant or not understood. Agents and claims people have experience that is sometimes taken for granted. That sounds like what is occurring here.

In reply to STM317:

You're right. But I didn't give the whole story. Her steps, stone foundation and the house surrounding the entrance to her house was damaged.

It was much more like mine than I said earlier

Have you called the drivers insurance company and filed a claim?

Klayfish wrote: I still feel like I'm missing something. You've got a $12k estimate. Do you have a $12k check? Did you get an estimate from the appraiser Liberty Mutual sent? Has it been given to your contractor? Has he called that Liberty Mutual appraiser? Did they physically get together, at your home, to discuss the scope of the work needed? If the answer to any of these questions is no, then something somewhere is missing and pick up the pieces from the first question that has a "no" answer.

This is where I would start.

You should have an copy of the estimate, likely prepared in Xactimate. If there are damages not on the estimate they should either revise it or reinspect for those damages. Some damages that are hidden or not visible may be in your contractors figure but not theirs. You might have to handle these on a supplement once work begins. Is your contractors estimate itemized? It should be if not. I sometimes get estimates that basically say fix XYZ $20,000. I can't do anything with that.

Foundation repairs are tough to estimate as are structural issues. I had a vehicle imapct claim a while back that ended up about twice the original estimate due to how the poured block wall tied into the roof. My estimate nearly doubled.

It may also be helpful to get a bid from another contactor. If theirs is the odd man out then they may be more inclined to take a closer look. For example I prepared a simple estimate to replace a rather large picture window. It was roughly $2200. They got a bid for almost $8000. I contacted a local window company to take a look and provide an estimate which came in at $1800. Obviously theirs was out of line.

As far as the siding I agree with you on a personal level. Our standard procedure is to write the damaged elevation of a match can't be made. So in your case it sounds like the front and side. We don't however do the entire house to match. That like the faded auto paint example is a slippery slope. Your kid accidentally hits a baseball into the side of the house and it cracks one piece of siding. We are now paying for $15k of siding for one cracked piece. Their policy may be different.

I would agree calling often and asking for a supervisor. Be polite but persistent. If your ducks are in a row as noted above and you don't get anywhere look into your state's department of insurance.

I know this is frustrating and I wish you luck.

Source: I am a field adjuster.

I can't tell you guys how much I appreciate these answers. From the longest, most detailed to the ones that just say how bad it sucks for us.

Liberty called tonight. It was the supervisor of the guy we've been having trouble getting a call back from. The two are having a meeting as it seems this supervisor and HIS supervisor have had messages not returned to them as well.

I'll report back when we get more info.

Glad to hear it.

As in every profession there are goods and bads. Sometimes the ball gets dropped or something slips through the cracks.

Generally speaking I've always had good luck going to the person's team lead or a claims supervisor. Those 90s BMWs roll down hill as the saying goes.

I know I don't want to hear from my supervisor about a claim if I can avoid it. However I know adjusters who always seem to have problem claims and I figure it's not just bad luck.

I really hope the supervisor starts things moving again. This is a ridiculous circumstance that you have been placed into by no fault of your own.

Glad to hear you're getting somewhere. Let us know if we can help. Like Greg said, the estimate for repairs was probably written in a program called Xactamate (I was trying not to get too technical). It's an industry standard software program and the materials pricing is pretty spot on. Hope this gets resolved.

Any update?

In reply to ebonyandivory:

A word as a contractor...

Your contractor friends are likely honest, trustworthy and competent, but may not be well versed in insurance claims work.

If you don't speak the language of insurance, you won't get the claim adjusted.

I never learned how to do insurance claim work. The biggest mistake of my life.

Some contractors (like me) are very good at assessing the scope, both seen and unseen. This leads to an accurate up-front estimate. Unfortunately, that's not the way insurance works.

Insurance adjusters are not skilled at assessing what they can not see, and NEVER will. (Their system will not allow it)

The contractors who are skilled at doing insurance work use Xactimate, itemize everything, price everything in unit pricing, and never include what is not seen in the initial estimate. This leads to a very low estimate up front, and gets them the job. What these contractors understand, however, is that the process allows for adjustments throughout the repair process. Most of these contractors can't estimate a job to save their lives- they will ultimately do the job for whatever the insurance settlement is. However, they are very skilled at change orders, and using the phrase "Well, it couldn't be seen before we got started". They know how to fight with insurance companies, and find their omissions, errors, and oversights in Xactimate.

I never learned this. It made me an honest businessman with a great reputation for good work, but people thought my prices were high (because I was honest up front). It worked fine when the economy was good, but no good at all when the economy tanked. Insurance claim work did not drop when the economy tanked. It grew. I just never learned to speak their lingo.

In the end, the prices are nearly identical between the man who can bid all the stuff unseen at the start, and the insurance claim settlement. (yours will probably be in the $40K range when it is all over). But the only way to get to the final number is to fight with the insurance company through the entire process.

The contractor you need for this job needs to be one who is well versed in insurance claim work. NOT one who has a reputation for honesty and integrity.

(In the real world, itemized pricing and unit pricing for construction repairs are stupid. It's like buying a car based on how many tires it has. All square feet are not equal, and there is no real way to itemize many construction remodel components. But THAT is the way the insurance world operates, and THAT is the ONLY way to resolve a claim with an insurance company).

In reply to SVreX:

Excellent points.

Just to clarify...

I am not calling contractors who specialize in insurance work dishonest. It's just a different business model.

Often their customers are very happy with their ability to control and manage the insurance company. That is a skill unto itself. They are often honest, but ruthless in how they manage insurance company.

A fairly small percentage of contractors do insurance work.

Update: there isn't one. Private adjuster has been fired, insurance company told us he settled on $28,000 (which he denied) but our insurance company reiterated that he had.

Anyway, we're dealing with our insurer ourselves and things seemed to be going well as far as asking us to give him our contractors figures. Wife asks him "don't you already have the figures from (fired private adjuster)?

"Oh. Yeah. We can use those figures and we'll get back to you." he says.

Haven't heard from them in almost two weeks. Wife left a message saying "you were supposed to look at our contractors figures and get right back to us but it's been almost two weeks."

Nothing.

So now my question to those in the know: Knowing where we are in the process, can we just put a claim into the drivers insurance and just ignore/forget that we initially started this with our homeowners?

Do we get a do-over or are we stuck with Liberty Mutual (who is coming close to getting a complaint filed against them)

I want to add that this house has had the same insurance company covering it for over 40 years. And this is what we get for our loyalty.

Call the state insurance board and explain the situation and see if they could make a call on your behalf to your insurance company so they could be updated on your claim. I would bet that would get things rolling.

I hope you have correspondence in writing documenting things. If you don't it never happened. I try to deal with insurance companies via email and i send them my understanding of any conversations to them in writing asking them to confirm it.

It is how i ended up pounding Amica in to the pavement when they tried backing out on rental car costs when my jag was totaled.

I would also look in if your state has a consumer protection board or agency and call them as well.

In reply to dean1484:

We have what we've done documented but much of this, almost all of it, had been done by the private contractor up to a couple weeks ago.

I assumed that taking charge and advocating for ourselves would help but the company seems to be allergic to us.

this sounds like it is slowly inching it's way up to lawsuit time. Isn't your policy supposed to repair your property to a "like new" condition quickly and expeditiously?

In reply to mad_machine:

What, July crash, nice warm weather, all of Fall and now it's literally 3 degrees out deep into winter and we just had 19.5" of snow now it's gonna be 50 degrees and raining?

That's not a problem when your foundation is split all the way to the ground right?

We have this available Mass Insurance Complaint Form

Hate to say it, but I'm willing to bet that an overwhelming majority of the issues that you've had were generated by the "public adjuster". Sorry, but they're kinda like lawyers who failed law school. They really mess claims up, almost without fail. Now that you've gotten them out of the way, should go better. If the adjuster isn't calling back, simply ask for the claims manager.

The Dept of Insurance won't simply make a call on your behalf. In fact, they almost never call at all. You file a complaint, they send a written inquiry to the insurance company, who in turn responds in writing. If you feel you need to file the complaint, the sooner the better.

You can call the tortfeasors' carrier, but you're going to find it tough sledding. They're going to look hard to see if you've mitigated damages, and if any repairs are already underway, you could run into challenges.

First of all, I would like to applaud your patience. I am not a patient person; I am a USDA-certified, Grade A shiny happy person. I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on television. But allow me to tell you what this shiny happy person would do in your situation:

Go medieval on their ass.

Because you lack the legal and financial resources of a national insurance company, your weapons of war are different. First of all, file a formal complaint with whatever insurance regulation board your state has.

Post on every related Internet forum you know. This is a good start; at least several people in this thread have already indicated their reluctance to ever use Liberty Mutual.

Next, go to every local newspaper, radio station, and TV station in your area and present your story. And give them names.

Your goal here is to make such a huge stink that their only choice is to help you in order to save their public reputation.

And after they fix your house to your satisfaction, your final step is to switch insurance companies, because berkeley these guys.