No, I don't listen to Fox, but a friend does.
Today, they are broadcasting a bunch of very scary stuff regarding E-15. Oh dear. Maybe I should hide. 
Yes, I know a lot about this, and have my own opinions, but I was wondering... what does GRM say???
Overblown, if your car was OK with E10 it should be fine with E15.
I say keep food in food and out of my tank. It screws with the global food economy. It also makes my motorcycle unhappy.
Wasn't there just a thread on this talking about all the dangers?
http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/e15.asp
Yeah biofuel from corn is a bad idea too, there's the food conflict issue and it's not terribly helpful from an environmental perspective.
GameboyRMH wrote: Overblown, if your car was OK with E10 it should be fine with E15.
Overblown, yes. Car fine? No. Almost all of the car manufacturers have stated that their cars will have issues on E15, including reduced fuel mileage. Many cars built pre-2007 aren't even compatible (the alcohol content can eat through hoses and seals, such as injector o-rings).
Will your car be fine? Maybe. Every car is going to have it's own needs. I know on our fleet, the Mazda5 will need little if anything (some are saying to change the plugs a heat range) but the older (01) Pontiac will need quite a bit (fuel injector o-rings, LIM gasket (which we already did thanks to E10), fuel filter, and other stuff). The Javelin probably won't even run on the stuff (it barely runs on E10), but then it was designed for much, much different gas then we have now, has a carburetor, and is still all original.
The cars to be worried about are apparently the late 80's into the late 90's, especially pre-OBDII. Most of those were built for no alcohol and the ECU's don't have enough control (injector pulses, timing tables, etc) to run well on the E15, and a lot of the rubber will be suspect by now.
In the grand scheme, it's not really that big of a deal (unless you want to talk big corn subsidies and why we're having this thrust down, or the better alternatives). Do a little research, maybe a tune-up, and keep an eye on it and you should be a-ok.
GameboyRMH wrote: Overblown, if your car was OK with E10 it should be fine with E15.
so using that logic ... if your car is ok with E10, then it's ok with E15, then it's ok with E20, then it's ok with E25, etc .... so when is not ok ?
I'm boosted.
MOAR CORM PLZ
Javelin wrote: Almost all of the car manufacturers have stated that their cars will have issues on E15, including reduced fuel mileage.
Well you're going to get less mileage by definition since ethanol contains less energy 
I was actually thinking about hooking up a flex fuel sensor on my 'rolla for this but a mechanic's convinced me to go for an AEM EMS-4 even though I had my heart set on a MS kit. I guess I'll just have to tune the engine to suit the fuel.
From what I've briefly read FWIW E-15 hasn't gone nationwide yet, only a few mid-western states. But, the gubmint wants it... so it's gonna happen.
Swank Force One wrote: I'm boosted. MOAR CORM PLZ
We have an E85 station in my town. I want a 6-71 for the Javelin just because of that. My turbo car loved it!
wbjones wrote:GameboyRMH wrote: Overblown, if your car was OK with E10 it should be fine with E15.so using that logic ... if your car is ok with E10, then it's ok with E15, then it's ok with E20, then it's ok with E25, etc .... so when is not ok ?
Depends on the car, but what I'm saying is that if you're going to have a problem with E15, you most likely would have discovered it when changing to E10. If you have an item that wears faster, it'll wear even faster now.
wbjones wrote:GameboyRMH wrote: Overblown, if your car was OK with E10 it should be fine with E15.so using that logic ... if your car is ok with E10, then it's ok with E15, then it's ok with E20, then it's ok with E25, etc .... so when is not ok ?
Roughly E20. That's when E10 only cars will reach their limit to deal with it. If the car is Flex Fuel, well, anywhere between E0 and E85 will be fine.
More important, you are not going to find E15 anytime soon. Looks like the full blow roll out of E10 is being delayed as well.
The worst that anyone will observe is less gas mileage. Other than that, the actual chemical difference between E10 and E15 is minimal, and materials will be fine for E15 if originally designed for E10. And since most fuel systems were changed in the 90s for various alcohol blends (back then starting the methanol blends), well- no need to start that debate again. Lots of mis-information out there about it.
It's actually the big agriculture suppliers that want it (ADM, Carghill, etc) and they have long been highly influential in Washington, for a variety of reasons, mostly going back to the Nixon administration.
Most manufacturers have long since drawn the line in the sand that e10 can be dealt with, but e15 will be a problem.
They allege that 10 auto manufacturers have already said they will void warranties on fuel related issues.
Thoughts?
Sounds like an excellent opportunity to void warranties for the sake of voiding warranties for fun and profit, while enjoying the added benefit of being able to blame the gubmint.
SVreX wrote: They allege that 10 auto manufacturers have already said they will void warranties on fuel related issues. Thoughts? Sounds like an excellent opportunity to void warranties for the sake of voiding warranties for fun and profit, while enjoying the added benefit of being able to blame the gubmint.
I very much doubt that claim. Both the original claim and the consipricy to want to void warranties.
I have run it, and barly even notice it. And I'm aware that E20 is a very common fuel to be part of a development progam, since it's actually partially available in areas that have a lot of E fuels.
SVreX wrote: They allege that 10 auto manufacturers have already said they will void warranties on fuel related issues. Thoughts? Sounds like an excellent opportunity to void warranties for the sake of voiding warranties for fun and profit, while enjoying the added benefit of being able to blame the gubmint.
You hit the nail on the head.
I wish all fuel was labeled like it used to be, E-10, E-15 etc. Now I only see that on E-85 pumps. It's hard to think this is being done as a benefit to me when I can't make a choice on my own.
From what I can tell, most of what you read and hear is coming from the fringes on either side of the issue.
Guy on the left says it will bring the dodo back to life, guy on the right says it will kill your children and enslave your mind to the government, the truth is that you'll get a little worse gas mileage and some other countries will pay more for their corn.
I don't know any "guy on the left" saying this is actually good. This is the corn lobby at work from what I can tell.
pres589 wrote: I wish all fuel was labeled like it used to be, E-10, E-15 etc. Now I only see that on E-85 pumps. It's hard to think this is being done as a benefit to me when I can't make a choice on my own.
Right now, the law is anything under E10 is not labled, anything above is. In theory, when the new E15 law is applied (which I'm not sure of the date) than anything up to E15 wont be labled.
BTW, few who do actual emissions think E(anything) is good. It's the corn growing states that push the E's. You can check the color of those states on your own, but Bob Dole (R- Iowa) was one of the major pushers of E10 originally. The only thing that is easily better with E10 or E15 is NOx. Other than that HC is higher, and you get new aldehides to deal with. Not horrible increase in anything, and it's not all that hard to have SULEV30 with E10.
The local lawn mower/chainsaw/small engine shop has been making a mint since E10, and is cheering for E15 FWIW.
In reply to alfadriver:
Bob Dole is from Kansas and represented the state in the US Senate, grew up out in Russel (same as Pennsylvania Senator Arlen Specter) where corn is very much not growing, but he may have had the corn lobby in mind all the same.
You'll need to log in to post.
