That's Not A Mustang; How I Sold a Purist on My Foxbody.

I went and had lunch with a long time friend this Friday. He grew up in Daytona Beach and started racing in  in the 70s, he once did the 24hrs and Sebring back in the early 80s.  

He was my mentor went I started racing and we try to meet up a couple of times a year to catch up. I showed him pictures of the Foxbody and he said "That's not a Mustang". He's a Shelby GT350 kind of guy.

To which I replied "yeah it's pretty much a Fairmont with a swoopy body on it"

After that I started telling him how ridiculously cheap all the go fast goodies are.

I also extolled the virtues of it being a hooligan car "the driving experience is akin to stealing your mom's car and bombing down dirt roads at midnight."

He started laughing and said "sounds like fun"

LOL at "not a Mustang". Before the Fox body, Mustangs were rebodied Falcons and Pintos. They've never been some pure performance car. They are better looking bodies on a cheap chassis with some go-fast bits. Always have been.

I once replaced a Volvo wagon with a late 70s Fairmont wagon thinking, "Gee it's just a 6 cylinder 4 door Mustang that I can slap a Mustang front end onto." It wasn't and I didn't.

Exactly similar to this:

So wait, the S197 (05-14) is the first Mustang to have it's own chassis designed for hooning?   True but I never thought about it.

Pretty sure the S197 shared a platform with a Lincoln.

The only vehicle labeled a Mustang that isn't a Mustang is the Mach-E. 

ddavidv said:

Pretty sure the S197 shared a platform with a Lincoln.

Yeah, it has a fair bit in common with the DEW98 platform (Lincoln LS, Jag S-Type), especially in the front suspension. But the DEW98 had IRS and the S197 had a stick axle, so it's not exactly the same.

We restored a 67 GT500KR for a customer. 

I drove it, it was just OK. Quick but not fast. The usual Mustang build quality with the added benefit of needing tiny hands to work on it.

I poke fun at all Mustangs but the Fox platform is light years ahead of a tarted up Falcon with too much engine.

Another customer had a Falcon wagon with a built 390 in it. Much faster in a straight line. 

We didn't take them to the track but another customers Dart 340 felt a lot faster than the KR too.

Maybe it's me, maybe I just think Carrol Shelby was a good salesman, not God's gift to American motorsports like everyone else does.

Give me a 70 Torino Cobra-Jet instead.

The S197 chassis in light years ahead of the FLEXI-FLYER Fox body.

We raced a 1983 SVO Competition Delete in SCCA and the Ford Ford Econobox Endurance Series back in the day.  After each event we were adding additional bars / welded in connectors to keep things from cracking and affecting handling.

Later we ran a 92 Fox Body with a full race NASCAB 358 CI Yates motor in Hi Speed Events (Fort Stockton, Silver Challenge, & etc.), again adding weight and welding in connection points to keep the chassis from flexing.

The solid axle version is simple to update, and as Tom pointed out, parts are inexpensive and readily available.

Give one a try.

You might be impressed

ShawnG said:

Maybe it's me, maybe I just think Carrol Shelby was a good salesman, not God's gift to American motorsports like everyone else does.

Agreed. He took an engine he didn't design and put it into a car he didn't design and the world called him a genius.

Don't forget, he also would sue everyone who ever put one of his logos on a car or dared make a replica Cobra roadster without his blessing.

AClockworkGarage said:

ShawnG said:

Maybe it's me, maybe I just think Carrol Shelby was a good salesman, not God's gift to American motorsports like everyone else does.

Agreed. He took an engine he didn't design and put it into a car he didn't design and the world called him a genius.

I think he deserves more credit for putting the right people together on a team than for any engineering he did himself. Which is no small feat, to be honest. But, as David points out, he got very lawsuit-happy in his later years and kind of ruined his image in my eyes. 

That chili seasoning packet he sells is pretty legit, though.

Team Terlinqua and Shelby Chili 

For the Win

A Foxbody Mustang is an awful car.  Awful fun to hoon and awful cheap to operate. 

I bought it because I wanted something different from what I would normally get. Typically I would have bought another single seat race car or Miata.

The Foxbody Mustang is slow but it's always talking to your inner child "let's slide around, you know you want to".

I worked at a Chrysler dealer in the early 2000s. Every time a 5.0 fox body came in on trade we would take it out on the used car inspection drive. Took turns behind the wheel beating on it and grinning! Fast ? No. Fun? YES!!

I feel like I need to be the old guy here and point out that they weren't slow when they were new. But this is the time when 14-sec quarter miles were genuinely quick, before every minivan could do them.

Tom_Spangler (Forum Supporter) said:

I feel like I need to be the old guy here and point out that they weren't slow when they were new. But this is the time when 14-sec quarter miles were genuinely quick, before every minivan could do them.

Keep in mind I was riding motorcycles in the 80s and anything that wasn't sub 13 second was slow.

I drove a brand new 84 from the Las Vegas Convention Center back to the Ford dealer. I found the car to be huge fun.

^this

Everyone forgets this was coming out of the era of 150hp Corvettes, Camaros with wheezing 305's and 3.08 gears and (ugh) the Mustang II

Fox Mustangs aren't fun if they don't have the 5.0.  Drive one with a NA 2.3 and a four speed.

That's one car I don't miss.

On the "that's not a real mustang" end of the spectrum: I used to have a 2006 Pontiac GTO. I heard on more than one occasion "that's not a REAL GTO, it's just a rebadged Holden."

"But weren't ALL GTO's just rebadged whatever's?"

That response usually resulted in significant mental gymnastics afterwards.

In reply to BA5 :

A real GTO is a Ferrari

In reply to ShawnG :

You mean the name they borrowed from the FIA?

The original GTO was built on the Le Mans Platform. to circumvent the GM Corporate NO RACING directive.

Google is your friend

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_GTO

FWIW

For me it was never a question of whether or not 80s Mustangs were the real thing.

It was the typical owners that put me off of them..............they all seemed to be a bit meatheaded to me. Granted I tend to be very counter culture so it could be that as well.

I went from BMWs to a Mustang when I bought my S197. The FB groups I joined...let's just say, they weren't my people.

ddavidv said:

I went from BMWs to a Mustang when I bought my S197. The FB groups I joined...let's just say, they weren't my people.

Yeah. I feel that. Fortunately there are places like TrackMustangsOnline that are more my speed.