This makes me want an XJ

Fueled by Caffeine wrote: Also understand any vehicle with full time lockers will have some interesting handling traits on the street. That thing wouldn't do what it did without lockers. I've wheeled plenty of one wheel or slectable two wheel drive jeeps. They do well. But not that well. The hill climb shown was the proper test of the lockers. Still an awesome rig though. And I can't believe the price of those lockers. $300 or so. Cheap.

Paid $86 for a mini spool, 90% street driven. Loved it in all conditions. Hands down awesome.

ebonyandivory wrote:

Fueled by Caffeine wrote: Also understand any vehicle with full time lockers will have some interesting handling traits on the street. That thing wouldn't do what it did without lockers. I've wheeled plenty of one wheel or slectable two wheel drive jeeps. They do well. But not that well. The hill climb shown was the proper test of the lockers. Still an awesome rig though. And I can't believe the price of those lockers. $300 or so. Cheap.

Paid $86 for a mini spool, 90% street driven. Loved it in all conditions. Hands down awesome.

Well that's news. Mine scared the hell out of me in the snow and ice. The rear end would just slide sideways. You might be a better driver than me. That is entirely possible.

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:

I doubt that! I had 5" of lift and 31" Super Swamper LTB's and drove in every imaginable weather in New England. Very predictable in the snow, If it ever under steered, One blip of the throttle would induce a bit of oversteer on demand. Traction was out of this world.

I'm a little late to the thread, but my XJ could get around 325 miles out of the 18 gallon tank and that was driving it past empty.

I'm not sure what that measures out in MPGs, but I was told by other XJ owners that it was rather impressive.

I got 334.2 miles out of an all highway tank on my XJ. I've never been able to put more than 15 gallons in it.

That tank only came out to 22.9mpg.

In reply to Swank Force One:

Even more impressive.

I think i hit 330 once. My 325 was more consistent, but I watched the trip odometer like a hawk, I think once it hit E, I would take it another 25 or 30 miles before I hit the gas station,

Or when I turned a corner really sharp and the engine would die out for a split second, then it was time for the gas station.

I just fill up when the gas light comes on.

Usually though, this thing is driven about 8 miles a day round trip to and from SWMBO's job.

And returns 13-14mpg doing so. It's pretty atrocious, but she gets bad MPGs in anything she drives because it's a short trip with 45mph as the fastest speed limit.

She managed to get 18mpg out of the MSM last summer.

My 93 xj got 14-16 mpg stock tires 250k mils

99 got 17 -19 then 13 towing 2800lb with 175k mils

Never saw 20.

ebonyandivory wrote: Montero, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

FTFY

Ehh, monteros are good off-roaders but their general availability is E36 M3ty before and during ownership, especially if you go off and break it somewhere. But finding a junkyard or parts store without cherokee parts is just bizarre.

ebonyandivory wrote: XJ, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

does not compute. AT ALL.

cheap, yes reliable? yes capable, not in stock form and those puny axles make it a major project to get it to capable.

icaneat50eggs wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: XJ, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

does not compute. AT ALL. cheap, yes reliable? yes capable, not in stock form and those puny axles make it a major project to get it to capable.

How many Jeep axles have you broken?
I hear all kinds in internet folks screaming about the D30/35 combo. I've owned lots of Jeeps, lots. How many axles have I ever broken? None. Biggest tires on a D30/35 combo was 35" MT Baja Belted. They survived some pretty serious wheeling. I'd never go larger than a 33" tire on a D30/35 now, but hey, they survived. I've had LSD's and lockers in those puny axles with no issues.
If I were building another Jeep now I'd swap out the 35 for a Ford 8.8" or a D44 because c-clip axles are the devil, but again. Never had a problem with an axle myself.

DrBoost wrote:

icaneat50eggs wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: XJ, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

does not compute. AT ALL. cheap, yes reliable? yes capable, not in stock form and those puny axles make it a major project to get it to capable.

How many Jeep axles have you broken? I hear all kinds in internet folks screaming about the D30/35 combo. I've owned lots of Jeeps, lots. How many axles have I ever broken? None. Biggest tires on a D30/35 combo was 35" MT Baja Belted. They survived some pretty serious wheeling. I'd never go larger than a 33" tire on a D30/35 now, but hey, they survived. I've had LSD's and lockers in those puny axles with no issues. If I were building another Jeep now I'd swap out the 35 for a Ford 8.8" or a D44 because c-clip axles are the devil, but again. Never had a problem with an axle myself.

My only issue with the d30 is the passenger side seal that you have to access through the vacuum disconnect motor. (Insert gay seal image). Other than that I have no issue with those axles. Neither does my friend who drives... Well... Un-gently.

Joey

I've never broken any jeep axles. But then again I've never owned a jeep.

Ive seen quite a few broken.

But then again I've also seen 60s 70s and once a 2.5 ton Rockwell broken.

m4ff3w wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: Montero, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

FTFY

Sure, much less available, little junk yard support, independent suspension. Ok, ya got me!

Plus I've 'wheeled the heck out if three XJ's. one for $1,200. One cost me $500 and was by far the prettiest one and the other cost me $900. Not sure what an average buy-in would be for a Montero but I bet an average of ~$900 doesn't go very far very often. Which was the basis of my statement.

icaneat50eggs wrote:

ebonyandivory wrote: XJ, simply the most capable and versatile 4x4 ever made for the money.

does not compute. AT ALL. cheap, yes reliable? yes capable, not in stock form and those puny axles make it a major project to get it to capable.

Totally in opposition to my years of experience offloading these (I've owned three started out stock then built them to my specifications as needed). The group of mountain bikers that stopped to watch me climb through a field of rocks would argue with your point as well but all we really have is our personal experiences.

I've abused four pairs of Dana 35/30's and never broke one. Although I've heard the blood-curdling snap of a 9" Ford and a Dana 44 front FWIW.

The Montero vs XJ does not compute for so many reasons I don't know where to begin. Now if you wanted to give me a stock Montero in good condition or an XJ in the same condition, I'd take the MONTERO. If I had $2,000 to get through the Rubicon or Hammers, give me the Cherokee.

capable, not in stock form

Compared to the majority of stock 4x4 vehicles that exist, yes it is! You must be comparing it to some pretty off-road biased vehicles. The majority of vehicles that are 4wd are LESS suited for off-road use than a cherokee.

capable, not in stock form and those puny axles make it a major project to get it to capable.

On paper, maybe you're right

The real world says otherwise

These things are extremely capable and seem to never cease making the jaws of the unknowing drop.

My perspective is pretty biased.

And as was pointed out, compared to most 4x4 vehicles of the last 15 years they are capable.

We are arguin about axles, but at least it has a front axle and not Incredibly Foul Suspension!

The group I ran with was really hard core. I agree that for a normal 4x4 usage they are very good especially at the price point.

This is not the first time I have also heard good things about the older montero's or as my acquaintance called his "the battle wagon" but I know nothing about them

2nd gen monteros are cool until the engine eats one of the butterfly valves in the variable length intake. Ask me how I know.

An XJ is a steel box, a Montero is a Rubiks Cube. I really like Monteros, as does the Third World but the Jeep for the money wins hands down.

My neighbor just offered up his xj for sale. 6" lift 33's and lots of dents and some rust. "Been wheeled hard," he says. Despite being a 5spd. I think I'll pass.

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:

Good idea. Never buy an already-built 4x4. Never.