Tires and sidewall stiffness - minivan edition

Just to chime in too...
I would be more likely to buy Coopers if they were easier to price and spec compare (via online).

With that said, is there a retailer that you would recommend or a shopping avenue we have not considered or aware of?

My Sedona is using the Khumo Crugen tires. They did well in the winter and I haven't noticed that they are noisy. The wind noise seems to dominate on the highway.

The other option I experienced on my brother's crossover were some Michelin Premier ltx tires.

tuna55 wrote:

Nick (picaso) Comstock wrote: Michelin have about the stiffest sidewall at regular passenger car type sidewall heights.

I love a Michelin, but they price like the rubber is molded with unicorn tears

The cost at Costco was surprisingly cheaper than other places. Not the best in speed or demeanor but got the dismount old tires, mount and balance new michelin's on my daughter's car cheaper than getting the tires alone shipped from Tire Rack.

I was happy with the Cooper CS4s we had on our RAV4 (225/65/17). I replaced them with Michelin Defenders, and will be going back to the Coopers once the Michelins wear out. The Michelins overall have been very underwhelming compared to the Coopers, and also will not approach the treadwear I got out of the Coopers.

If your van is still riding on the original shocks/struts I'd look at replacing those too. There may be something slightly stiffer that's available.

drdisque wrote: If your van is still riding on the original shocks/struts I'd look at replacing those too. There may be something slightly stiffer that's available.

The whole van could use bushing and struts, but that's a bigger chunk than I can swing for a bit. Just to be clear though, the issue was from one day to the next with the new tires, so I suspect a swap to better round black things will help a lot.

tuna55 wrote:

KyAllroad wrote: In reply to ShawneeCreek: Cooper tires aren't carried by Tire Rack, it'd be nice to be able to compare your product to the other stuff that's out there. Out of 4 cars I have Coopers on two of them and they seem very good so far. Tuna: When I went from "C" load rated tires on the suburban to regular P-metric tires the squish and roll as you describe it got much worse. For you I'd look into a higher than usual load rating or possibly a larger wheel size to get a shorter/stiffer sidewall. Maybe there is something on CL in an optional size that you can pick up cheap.

Cooper tires do seem hard to find - I have to pick up the phone instead of the mouse

Tell me about it. I keep asking Sales and Marketing why we don't sell through Tire Rack, but I haven't gotten the full answer yet. There is a store locator on the main Cooper Tire website that lists tire stores that sell our products.

We do sell through Discount Tire and Canadian Tire. And Canadian Tire does their own on-vehicle testing and reporting, much like Tire Rack does here in the US. You could use that for some side by side comparisons.

Count me as another voice that wants to buy Cooper from Tire Rack. Even when I buy tires locally I do a lot of comparison online and having Cooper off by itself (so to speak) makes them fall through the cracks more than they probably deserve to.

I've been super happy with BFG Advantage T/A on my Ford Ranger and Honda Odyssey. I used to put Michelins on my daily drivers until they started thinking they had to charge like their belts are made of Valyrian Steel.
(But: Pilot Super Sports on the WRX - cost no object there) I expect to get close to 60,000 miles out of the Goodrich's. Good traction. Handle well. No weird wear patterns.

If your van is twitchy it may be time to look into new dampers. It may not be the tires. My wife's Odyssey has 140,000 miles on it and I can tell its time go shock shopping.

To take this thread slightly sideways, what struts would you guys recommend for a mini van. I see Monroe and Gabriel, but not impressed with either. Also see KYB and figured they might be better. The preloaded struts have no name struts mounted on no name springs.

In reply to tuna55: So far so good.

I've put about 600 miles of highways, secondary streets and dirt roads.

Handling with 40psi in them is good for the van. No mushy feelings, it responds to steering wheel inputs with ou hesitation. So far they seem to be competent and have more grip than I have courage on the off ramps.

Any tire noise is minimal and does not interfere with music, conversation or audiobooks. On most surfaces it's drowned out by wind noise.

Thanks for the update! That brought the slate to the General vs the Coopers. The big issue was price, and since I've had great success with Coopers in the past I would pick them if price was even.

I brought the printout from eBay from the Discount Tire store to Discount Tire and they reduced their own price and matched the cost from Tire Rack for the Generals, so they are ordered. In a few years we can both chime in here and let everyone know how they are both wearing.

Could it be tread squirm? When I put new tires on my track it felt like I was driving on marshmallows. Got better with a few heat cycles.

ross2004 wrote: Could it be tread squirm? When I put new tires on my track it felt like I was driving on marshmallows. Got better with a few heat cycles.

They are three years old now, so no.

ross2004 wrote: Could it be tread squirm? When I put new tires on my track it felt like I was driving on marshmallows. Got better with a few heat cycles.

Before power steering, the steering was notably easier on new tires as compared with the old.

I got into a discussion on speed ratings an the difference. T vs H. What makes the difference on the same tire. Altimax RT43.

Never did get a satisfactory explanation .

In reply to iceracer:

I think H usually gets you an extra ply in the tread, called a "cap ply".

I'm glad to hear that you made a decision Tuna. I hope that they turn out to be better than your current set of tires.

iceracer said: I got into a discussion on speed ratings an the difference. T vs H. What makes the difference on the same tire. Altimax RT43. Never did get a satisfactory explanation .

Depends on the manufacturer. But typically you get more (or stronger) nylon ply in the tread area. Say T-rated has one layer of nylon, then V-rated might have two. The body ply materials are sometimes switched out as well. Essentially, the tire just needs to be stronger to handle the larger forces at the higher test speeds.

I was recommended the Cooper CS5's for my 300TD, and plan on getting a set in 205/60R15 when I get some pennies saved. There was a road test (can't find it now) where they compared very, very favorably to other tires.

We've had pretty good results with the BFG g-forces on our LeMons LTD, too!

ShawneeCreek wrote: I'm glad to hear that you made a decision Tuna. I hope that they turn out to be better than your current set of tires.

iceracer said: I got into a discussion on speed ratings an the difference. T vs H. What makes the difference on the same tire. Altimax RT43. Never did get a satisfactory explanation .

Depends on the manufacturer. But typically you get more (or stronger) nylon ply in the tread area. Say T-rated has one layer of nylon, then V-rated might have two. The body ply materials are sometimes switched out as well. Essentially, the tire just needs to be stronger to handle the larger forces at the higher test speeds.

I'll let you know!

Should I have tried to find a size in something other than the 100T designation then?

Some Jeep Cherokees have the same oem bolt pattern and hub bore.

Such as the SRT8 Cherokee

tuna55 wrote:

ShawneeCreek wrote: I'm glad to hear that you made a decision Tuna. I hope that they turn out to be better than your current set of tires.

iceracer said: I got into a discussion on speed ratings an the difference. T vs H. What makes the difference on the same tire. Altimax RT43. Never did get a satisfactory explanation .

Depends on the manufacturer. But typically you get more (or stronger) nylon ply in the tread area. Say T-rated has one layer of nylon, then V-rated might have two. The body ply materials are sometimes switched out as well. Essentially, the tire just needs to be stronger to handle the larger forces at the higher test speeds.

I'll let you know! Should I have tried to find a size in something other than the 100T designation then?

General makes the RT43 in both H and T in 225 65 16.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/TireSearchResults.jsp?zip-code=&width=225/&ratio=65&diameter=16&rearWidth=255/&rearRatio=40&rearDiameter=17

tuna55 said: Should I have tried to find a size in something other than the 100T designation then?

No. 100T is exactly what you want. You could put a higher speed rated tire (100H or 100V), but you are not going to gain much performance from it. And a T speed rating is more than sufficient for daily driving. They are all tested to 115 mph (I think, don't quote me). Regardless, it's much faster than your likely to drive your van.

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The goofs at Discount Tire even used a torque wrench!

I also had them replace the TPMS on two wheels also.

The initial five mile drive back to work proved that these tires are far more competant than the H727 Hankooks. The wishy washy underdamped nature is gone. It's not like driving an autocross prepped Miata, but at least when I flick the wheel I get one movement and not three.

Nice! Looking forward to getting a set for my Merc wagon!