I have often thought a mk1 Capri with the 2.0 engine would make a great racer.
I have often thought a mk1 Capri with the 2.0 engine would make a great racer.
I'd think a mini would also be a great option to consider.
Apexcarver said:Looked into doing it for awhile. My answer was square body spridget and go find a used racecar. They are around and it's much much cheaper to freshen up someone else's build and make it right vs building your own.
I wound up getting a F500 instead
From my digging...
- 1275cc motor, I have a spare on my shelf figure 1-6k depending on how fast you really want to be. Read rules, many want you to even keep the SU carbs.
- Trans. Stock can work, built with straight cut gears is better...
- Rear end. Good axles, gonna spend $1000 on the rear, it also needs double bearing hubs. Spool for cheap, lsd for expensive.
- Front, disc brake upgrade if it's an older car. Strengthened front axles for several hundred bucks. Gotta do it, they break and you lose a wheel.
- All the usual race car stuff. Safety gear, fuel stuff, etc.
Total cost to turn a LBC into a Vintage race car ( plus the cost of the car ) based on the above recommendations is near $7000 plus cosmetic stuff and wheels & tires
Less if you find good deals or a previously raced car
The cost to get a XJS to the same point About $4000 plus cosmetic stuff, wheels, and tires.
Trouble with Capris, Cortinas and 510s is finding a donor. Outside the west coast those cars simply don't exist anymore. Plus one should consider the availability of body parts as you will bang it up on occasion even in vintage racing.
V8 cars cost a LOT more to run than low powered four cylinder cars.
A Spridget is probably the cheapest and easiest way to get in. Old Spridget racers are everywhere so you won't have to start from scratch. Mutch cooler running something with history anyway. My only gripe with them is they are archaic and will require more wrenching.
I would love to see somebody do a Trans Am Pinto but there probably aren't any left. Probably easier to find a Falcon.
70s and 80s Toyotas are super fun. Anything with a TC engine will be tunable and cheap and I lovelovelovelove the way that era of Toyota handles. Very light weight, very easy on consumables and very fun to drive.
ddavidv said:Trouble with Capris, Cortinas and 510s is finding a donor. Outside the west coast those cars simply don't exist anymore. Plus one should consider the availability of body parts as you will bang it up on occasion even in vintage racing.
V8 cars cost a LOT more to run than low powered four cylinder cars.
A Spridget is probably the cheapest and easiest way to get in. Old Spridget racers are everywhere so you won't have to start from scratch. Mutch cooler running something with history anyway. My only gripe with them is they are archaic and will require more wrenching.
At least they are good options.
Which reminds someone buying a car like this- be patient, and also 100% ready to buy at the same time. When we were searching for our car, we spent a lot of time trying to find the ideal car, and once it showed up, we got it immediately.
Solid, but well used, cars are out there. Just takes time to find them.
But it also means that the car you choose is something that you can be 100% emotionally attached to. So when you struggle with it (working on it, driving it, finding the right set up, whatever) you still have the love for the car that you continue on.
AND make sure you fit in it. Like for Alfas- they have odd seating positions- not everyone would last a long time felling comfortable in them. These older cars can be very quircky in terms of the design.
My car is pretty close to what you are talking about. 85.5 Mustang SVO. It still has tags and I run it in SVRA (group 12b) and HSR (SSB), and also track days and the occasional autoX. Easy to get parts, lots of donor cars as it is really just a Fox body Mustang with some special stuff. 2.3L turbo that was 210HP factory and is very easy to make a reliable 275-300 with minor changes. I still have the original 90K mile short block in the car, original T5. Has decent brakes and tons of good suspension parts can be found. Fox cars are well sorted out. My car is classified for vintage classes as having competed in "Showroom Stock" race series in the '80s, so there are limits to what you can do. No front mounted intercoolers for example, no aftermarket brakes, limits to wheel and tire sizes, but you really don't need those things with this platform in these events.
One nice thing is that in nearly every event that I have been in, I am the ONLY American car. There are a couple of Capri's that have run in my group, but I consider them foreign even though they are Fords.
SVOs are still pretty cheap unless they are pristine examples that someone put away and are left untouched. 5K will get you a solid car that can be run in vintage classes with little more than safety equipment.
I have found the vintage organizations to be VERY friendly, helpful and sincerely grateful have you participate.
You do need a racing license. I got my SVRA license by attending their school which is usually held at Robeling Road in February. Best bang for your buck. I don't see it on their schedule for 2021 however, so that is a disappointment.
This is my car at the SVRA event at VIR in 2019.
Snowdoggie said:I would love to see somebody do a Trans Am Pinto but there probably aren't any left. Probably easier to find a Falcon.
Pintos were regulars in the IMSA BFG Radial Challenge. Brian Walsh of "Racer Walsh" still supports the platform and still competes in vintage events.
Along those lines, I would like to see a Gremlin, Hornet, or Spirit vintage car--Team Highball, headed by Amos Johnson did very well in that series with the AMC cars.
Again, so many amazing inputs here, thank you all so much!
Somebody earlier mentioned 60s Fords, and I think I'm leaning that way.
I have experience with Windsors, and 60s Fords. The Carrera also requires the car to run hours at street legal speeds on 91 unleaded, and to survive rough, pot-holed roads.
So I think something like a Falcon/Mustang or Comet/Cougar is a safe bet. The cars are relatively plentifal in NA compared to Euro cars. Easier to source body panels, wear items, speed parts, etc.
If your looking at mid 80s then a c4 corvette z51 package should be considered. It was actually banned from the scca pro showroom stock endurance series after 3 seasons it was 29-0 in overall wins. The Porsche 944 turbos couldn't beat them.
FSP_ZX2 said:Along those lines, I would like to see a Gremlin, Hornet, or Spirit vintage car--Team Highball, headed by Amos Johnson did very well in that series with the AMC cars.
I love all those old AMCs. Depending on the class too, a newer 4.0 will bolt in where an old 3.8 or 4.2 once sat so you have a an easy path to a well supported, modernish, straight 6.
I'm thinking since meateater is a Ford guy and seems to have a sense of fun a Pinto wagon could be something a bit different and fun.
Volvo 544 or 122 is the smart way to do this.
In reply to MeatEater :
Here you go. Both in the same picture:
In reply to stukndapast :
That's an interesting option. I hadn't really thought about those as "Vintage" yet.
Early Falcons in race trim just look so damned good. I’d like to attempt to build one some day.
Here’s a few more examples to add to what @rustomatic posted.
That said, that SVO Mustang has got me going too. That looks like good fun!
If you want to do any sort of racing, you really need a truck and a trailer. Things break at the track. You need a way to get broken cars home, and since most tracks are more than 100 miles from home, paying for a tow is pretty much out of the question. A weekend long event requires lots of gear, coolers, tools etc. If you are content autocrossing, then you can get away with just a car and no tow rig. I currently have two cars that I am prepping for vintage racing. Now that the kids are both in college, I see a future that once again involves motorsports. If you are in the northeast and would consider racing a BMW 2002 in Vintage, send me a message. Lost storage for my 02 and think I would rather just sell it and keep the TR8 former GT1 race car.
Ford raced quite a few Falcons back in the day. The first gens shown above were not unusual nor were the second gen cars. Falcons are a bit harder to get parts for than an early Mustang (you can mail order the entire car) but are more unique.
My next project will be a third gen Falcon. I haven't found any evidence they were ever raced outside of drag racing. They are a better handling platform and have a wider engine bay that will accept pretty much anything between the shock towers. The platform is shared with the Fairlane after 1965. Downside is they reproduce about nothing for them.
The Australians only had the four door body but did a lot of racing with them. The car evolved quite a bit over the years. Genuine GT-HO Falcons now can command in the six figures.
My first choice would be a 240Z, but buying one and prepping it is not cheap any longer. And I hate to beat this drum, but Miatas are vintage eligible for the NAs and probably the least expensive way to get in.
I think I may be running the cheapest option for vintage racing with my Formula 500, I have $5200 in it but about $500 of that is related to autocross. I already had a trailer to tow the Datsun but if the F500 was my only race car I'd just but a $750-$1200 ramp gate utility trailer and tow it with my Subaru Outback.
While I was the first person to vintage race one I do know that one of the midwest groups are going to be running several of the cars at Elkart Lake sometime this year. Older F500's can be had for $2500 - $5000. I only paid $2000 for mine but then it cost me another $1300 to have it shipped cross the country.
I found some ~$2K Falcons on FB Marketplace, but thought you might want to see this:
914Driver said:For the pure entertainment factor, drape a Renault Dauphene body over a Legend?
I've looked into that kind of thing: considered putting a bugeye Sprite body on an Allison Legacy chassis. Believe it or not, they share the same 80" wheelbase. Seemed like the easy/cheap way to get a reliable and well-balanced vintage racecar.
Unfortunately for us GRM hacks, this kind of thing is specifically disallowed by vintage racing groups.
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