AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) said:
I'm constantly evaluating it. I know in the end EVs win. Think back 10 years. The reality of the dream is getting closer everyday. I just wish progress could occur more organically with less outside input. Let the innovators and customers decide.
Less outside input on BOTH sides of the aisle? Remember back in the mid 2000s when the Chevy Volt was being developed by Bob Lutz as an American answer to the Prius, while being even more technologically advanced? It was the ONLY new program from before the bailout that was retained. Remember how badly the oil companies and RW outlets slammed that car? Look at social media now and all the anti-EV propaganda being spewed that is FULL of falsehoods. How does that foster innovation and customer choice?
I'm not a fan of government incentives, and I got no government incentives on any of my EVs. But letting government push them is no different than letting government push any emissions/pollution related legislation or innovation going back to 1970 and Nixon's creation of the EPA. Or the government development of Arapanet and the governmental push to broadband everywhere and digital signals for TVs. Or GPS satellites. Innovation often comes from meeting government regulations, whether that's pollution, safety, etc. And it's kind of in the national security interests to do this.
When looking at cost of ICE v. EV you do need to take into account the big picture of what we have done, and continue to do, to ensure the oil flows.
I am not a liberal anti-war guy but yeah, we have fought wars over oil. We went into Iraq twice because Iraq threatened the flow of oil (that was the real reason). What was the cost of those operations and the subsequent occupation? We are 'close' friends with Saudi Arabia a nation with which we share no common values, because of oil. We protect and police the middle east and its waterways to ensure the flow of oil. We involve ourselves across the planet in the affairs of other nations, and protect global trade lanes, so that the oil may flow. Then add in the oil spills, the disasters (BP Horizon, Exxon Valdez, etc). While we frack massive amounts of oil now, what is the long-term impact to the environment and water tables? I am fine with that when there was no alternative, but we now have an alternative.
The true costs of ICE are massive, and include blood and lives, not just carbon and pollution. By comparison, the rare materials in batteries are recyclable, batteries can be used in 1st and 2nd applications giving them operational life of a decade or more even now, and then they can be recycled. We can get our power from domestic sources, and from the sky. Yes some existing mines are in terrible places, but we can try cleaning them up, and ensuring new mining is done better. We can almost start anew with the supply chains for EVs and do it better. One way is the Lithium Valley in California where lithium is now starting to be extracted from the Salton Sea using clean geothermal energy. It looks like we will be able to extract up to 600,000 tons of it annually from just that location (enough to cover all the US needs for the foreseeable future). And that problematic mineral, Cobalt, that is mined in the Congo by child slave labor, is being used less and less in EVs (and many modern EVs use none), while still being heavily used in gasoline refining to get the sulfur out...
Oil is the blood of economies...but if we have the ability to seriously cut our need for it, and possibly eliminate military operations and disasters - do it. Petroleum will always be valuable for plastics, fertilizer and others things, but if we can dramatically cut our needs for it by removing most transportation on the demand side (most, not all) perhaps we can stop having to police the world. What I love most about EVs is the potential for energy independence in conjunction with renewables/fission/fusion/etc. Domestically produced energy (and in many cases, individually generated solar energy on your home...).
