With used frisbee twins prices falling into just above $10k range

In reply to NOHOME:

It's as much about a modern small coupe with a solid chassis to house the LS, as it is about the lack of power in the BRZ/FRS. If GM hadn't killed off the Kappa platform, and had it improved, then I'd be suggesting dropping an LS into a roughly $10k Kappa offering, instead suggesting putting the LS into a BRZ/FRS is a compliment to them as they're the best small RWD chassis of the last decade that can be found in that price range. Though if someone were to be unloading a Cayman that lunched it's engine at an appropriate price, that's also a route that would have to be seriously be considered as well.

My 2015 FR-S is at 45,000 miles with zero issue. It is my favorite of the cars I've owned.

Ok, so, final question, assuming I get a couple of cars sold here soon...

Suspension travel when lowered? Obviously, it's reduced, but, is it like Miata reduced, where to get what I consider a nice fender to wheel gap (about 1/2", maybe a touch less, from fender to top of wheel, given an OEM size wheel/tire diameter) the bump stops are part of "normal" suspension travel?

And I do enjoy auto-x, so the car will definitely see that - does that change the "lower it" alternative significantly (i.e. to make it live well on the street/auto-x the $$$ coilovers are the only real alternative - ok if it is, just wondering).

I drove a friend's BRZ when he got it a couple years back, the chassis was amazing to drive, so I know I'll like that part.

Power delivery was "flat" but I guess a tune and header takes car of that, wakes the car up pretty well?

I think it's time to pare down the fleet, get back to one car (yes, GRM heresy!) - and at these prices I can do everything I want for not a lot (my usual springs wheels tires exhaust).

Complete thread jack - sorry...

Ahem...

Frisbee twin Solo spec class

In reply to racerfink:

I look forward to picking up a used spec frisbee in 5-10 years

In reply to racerfink:

Also hilarious timing.

I have a 2015 BRZ limited, about 36k miles I bought 3 years ago. Great car other than the lack of power and the crunchy gear synchros.

Keep in mind if you are buying one still under warranty, the ECU has a "counter" so the dealer can see if they have been flashed.

My car has a rough transmission they won't warranty because of a tune.

Even though Edelbrock will do a 3/36k warranty with their supercharger on the drivetrain.

I'll never buy another Subaru again. It's a pretty poorly built car for the cost.

That's why the used values have plummeted, I wish someone would steal my car.

Overall power is not an issue, but 'splain crunchy synchros.

There are several "nothing but gas and oil" posts in here.

What year is yours? Edit: duh, 2015...

I have often wondered if the "flat" power band is the reason people think these cars are underpowered?

z31maniac wrote: I'll never buy another Subaru again. It's a pretty poorly built car for the cost.

This is my general impression of Subaru from every one I've been around. They build decent cars, but not great. They kinda suck at building higher powered engines that don't blow up or wear out much sooner than they should. And they all have absolutely awful paint that's about as durable as smearing some butter and food coloring onto the metal...

In reply to OldGray320i:

Doesn't like to shift into 2nd when trans fluid is cold. In my experience, during 9 months out of the year it only happens on the first 1-2 shift. During cooler months (semi-winter here in the south) it happens for the first 2 or 3 times I shift into 2nd gear. If I go over 3000 rpm's before shifting into second while fluid is cold it shifts fine. This is a pretty well documented "issue" on the forums. I read about it after purchasing mine and noticing it. After reading about it I have not really gotten very worked up. But it is one of the reasons I want to change my transmission fluid before it cools off in a few months.

OldGray320i wrote: Overall power is not an issue, but 'splain crunchy synchros. There are several "nothing but gas and oil" posts in here. What year is yours? Edit: duh, 2015...

Multiple transmissions have been replaced, assuming you've never tuned the car (as if 10hp is what screwed the crummy transmission).

Like I said, Edelbrock will warranty the drivetrain if you install their supercharger.

Subaru NA sucks. I know "it's modified" blah blah blah, but I think it sucks that manufacturers can sell a car as a "tuner car" then when you do it, they tell you to pound sand.

Seat has ridiculous wear for the miles, tons of slack in the driveline.

My BRZ will be replaced with a Mustang or Camaro as soon as I recover from buying my house.

In reply to secretariata:

I switched to Redline hoping to get rid of the crappy cold 1-2 shift. It didn't make any difference at all.

In reply to parker:

I'm going to try Motul and see how it does.

That new spec class is intriguing. Think it means that those cars can run in STX too? Might be nice to have a couple classes to run.

We have these trans problems in the Suzuki cars I work on. 3 things work really well.

Synchromesh

ATF

ISO 100 vac pump oil. It works the best, but it's crazy expensive. Probabnly any thin gear oil will work

FWIW, Cruze 6MT transmissions are known for a weak 1-2 shift, with random crunches at times. Sometimes it will grind, sometimes not. Doesnt matter hot or cold. It is definitely worse when your revs are higher tho.

The consensus is that the gear oil GM spec'd for the factory fill isnt up to the task (Im not a gearbox expert...far from it, but the difference between the 1st and 2nd gear is a big one in terms of ratio). The forums agree that an Amsoil lube (cant remember which atm) is the easy button to get smoother engagement of lower gears at higher revs. I dunno if thats the case with the twins or not. YMMV

In reply to parker:

I'm going to try Motul and see how it does.

"I'm not crazy...I'm just a little unwell" - Rob Thomas

It does help. I run the Motul 300 in my trans and diff.

I'll never buy another Subaru again. It's a pretty poorly built car for the cost.

I think it is more a case of it's poorly built BECAUSE of the cost. 

When the car first came out, expectations from the consumer were that the car would have Lexus build quality, Mustang GT acceleration and Lotus Elise handling for the cost of a Toyota Yaris.

What we got was a delicate balancing act that kept the car as light as possible in order for the chassis dynamics to shine while still remaining on the economy car budget. Both luxury and power were going to add weight and cost so they had to take a back seat; and a small backseat it is!

I don't know about the transmission, but a good look at the engine will show that it was built with a mandate to keep the weight down and handle the 200 hp from the factory. Having seen the internals, I would never ask this engine to put out more power. How durable it is I will have to wait and see; right in the middle of my ten year tenure.

In my opinion, the Twins are a vehicle that you either love right off the lot and leave alone, or else you are going to be setting yourself up for a long list of disapointments as you spend time and money trying to make it something it is not.

I just checked CL and all I'm seeing are at least $15k with some up in the mid $20k's.

It doesn't seem like they caught on around here. I think I've only ever seen enough to count on my fingers and toes.

In reply to captdownshift :

I was planning on mentioning it.

Ok, bringing back this thread...

Doing a little more reading on the FT86 forum, seems that bad throw out bearings and even the occasional spun rod bearing is not terribly unusual. 

This is throwing a monkey wrench in to my plans,  so the question is if these are early car problems that mellow out the longer they're in production. 

For example,  early Focus DCT trans' were consistently problematic, later ones were generally better, but they still had problems. 

Didn't want to buy new, but if I'm going to wing it with one of these, might be the best option.

Thoughts? 

Is now the time to consider the reality and merits of a $20k LS powered sports coupe with fantastic chassis dynamics?

 At this stage they remind me of the RX-8.

^This, although maybe in a slightly different way.  I think the parallel to the RX8 is that i personally saw the RX8 as the ultimate LS swap recipient just waiting for the prices to come down enough to make it attractive. The funny thing is, it never really came together in spite of broken Rx8s being, at this point.. precisely worthless in terms of purchase price. Personally, i find the RX8 a more attractive swap recipient than the FRSBRZ86  in every sense but looks, and it just goes to show that price isn't everything. There have to be more factors that line up in order for v8-swapped 86s to become common.