Ye olde TPMS question...

So I'm starting to prep the Si for the upcoming year and some autoxes and track days. My 8th gen Si had no issues with putting a set of wheels/tires on with no TPMS sensors and turning off traction control.

The 9th generation Si though. You can't be one PSI low without the car alerting you in 40 different places that you have low tire pressure. Take all four wheels off with TPMS sensors and turning traction control off is impossible. You'd think it should default to turning off in the event you have to put a spare on....but looks like the Honda engineers brain farted on this one.

I took the car to my old employer (a honda dealer) and we couldn't find anyway to magically disable the TPMS system with Honda's specialized tablet for their cars.

Pulling the fuse does nothing as it defaults to the same trouble code if it sense a TPMS sensor is missing.

I don't want to mess with the pressurized PVC pipe and sensors inside as I want to leave the sensors in my daily driving wheels/tires.

Anyone else have any kind of creative solution? I've tried Civic/generation specific forums and those are about as useful as a used depends.

On my '13 Fiesta, the light blinks a few times then stays on steady. No other problems.

Four Blizzaks on Contour wheels, no TPMS

No idea; but as a 2012 Si owner, I want to know an answer too...

Contemplated buying a spare set of "cloneable" sensors and adding them to some STX class wheels (but again; you get too low on the pressure scale and the car goes into "oh E36 M3" mode, entirely preventing ANY disabling of traction or stability control)

Why not just do the pressurized can and keep the sensors in the car at all times? It seems like the easy solution.

DirtyBird222 wrote: You'd think it should default to turning off in the event you have to put a spare on....but looks like the Honda engineers brain farted on this one.

Indeed, this IS what most companies do. If there's a tire issue then the car will not respond correctly so they default to no/minimal stability control.

I don't want to mess with the pressurized PVC pipe and sensors inside as I want to leave the sensors in my daily driving wheels/tires. Anyone else have any kind of creative solution? I've tried Civic/generation specific forums and those are about as useful as a used depends.

Get aftermarket TPMS sensors that can be cloned, and clone your existing sensors. Then you can swap wheels/tires without having to relearn anything.

Knurled wrote:

I don't want to mess with the pressurized PVC pipe and sensors inside as I want to leave the sensors in my daily driving wheels/tires.

Anyone else have any kind of creative solution? I've tried Civic/generation specific forums and those are about as useful as a used depends.

This may not work on 2012+ (after talking with a service tech); the TPMS (allegedly) only "allows" traction/stability control disabling after seeing ROTATION and a specific amount of time moving above a certain MPH... grr.... The only trick i can really think of is that for a few autox runs, the time/mph requirement probably WOULDN'T be enough to trip it into "limp" mode (IIRC 20ish miles?)

Autolex wrote: This may not work on 2012+ (after talking with a service tech); the TPMS (allegedly) only "initializes" after seeing ROTATION and a specific amount of time moving above a certain MPH... grr....

Initializing is something completely different than just reading.

On the Honda systems that I am familiar with there is a 'low line' and 'high line' system. With either system, speed and rotation are required before they are recognized, but the high line systems utilize an initiator mounted about the wheel well to talk to the specific sensor, so putting them all in a tube won't work anyway.

As far as how the traction control interacts with that system, well, I don't know. I was only in Tier 1!

Traction control cannot be disabled in EITHER system without Sensor presence and "full value represented" (which I guess means "happy sensor"/reading a pressure AND rotating)

Knurled wrote:

Autolex wrote: This may not work on 2012+ (after talking with a service tech); the TPMS (allegedly) only "initializes" after seeing ROTATION and a specific amount of time moving above a certain MPH... grr....

Initializing is something completely different than just reading.

You're right; I misspoke though. Reworded it more accurately.

Damnnnnn it I used to have a whole bucket full of working TPMS sensors that I just left at Honda when I left the job.

iceracer wrote: On my '13 Fiesta, the light blinks a few times then stays on steady. No other problems. Four Blizzaks on Contour wheels, no TPMS

Most other manufacturers don't have this issue. Seems just to be Honduh! And their "best Si ever"

DirtyBird222 wrote: And their "best Si ever"

I would agree with them if they'd fix a few things

• Make the giant (17" x 7" at 21+ish lb each) boy-ricer wheels an option
• Dumb door stickers (I scraped them off the day I got it)
• Throttle Mapping/Rev Hang
• Traction Control should be able to be disabled WHENEVER the berkeley I want
• Remove the Clutch Master Cylinder "delay valve" (makes even good stick drivers look like amateurs)

and usually 28mph is the "high line" in Hondas. It's when the sensors finally relay the tire pressure back to home and will clear any codes if you have any. I can' think of a time where I was at a track day and never made it over that speed.

I could put the sensors in my track wheels/tires but then I'd have to deal with that annoyance on a regular basis. And if you haven't been in a 2012+ civic yet with an issue you seriously are alert on the dash and the radio screen with lots of donging.

You get the orange i in the speedo area, a similar warning on the radio screen, plus the (!) near the tach. http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/13/thumbnail/qujadapy.jpg

Sounds like the Hondata FlashPro can't be used to address any of this either (but the plug in traction control module DOES work? how the berkeley is that right?)

Autolex wrote:

DirtyBird222 wrote: And their "best Si ever"

I would agree with them if they'd fix a few things * Make the giant (17" x 7" at 21+ish lb each) boy-ricer wheels an option * Dumb door stickers (I scraped them off the day I got it) * Throttle Mapping/Rev Hang * Traction Control should be able to be disabled WHENEVER the berkeley I want * Remove the Clutch Master Cylinder "delay valve" (makes even good stick drivers look like amateurs)

I painted my wheels and they still look horrible lol. The rev hang can be gone with the tune but that's a lot of money. And TPMS should be an option as well.

DirtyBird222 wrote: And TPMS should be an option as well.

Honda would have a tough time with that:

http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/tpmsfinalrule.6/tpmsfinalrule.6.html

NHTSA wrote: This final rule re-establishes FMVSS No. 138, Tire Pressure Monitoring Systems, which requires installation of a tire pressure monitoring system in light vehicles, thereby implementing a mandate in the TREAD Act. In accord with the Act, the objective of this standard is to supplement regular tire maintenance on the part of drivers by providing a warning system to alert them when one or more of a vehicle�s tires become significantly under-inflated. Under-inflation of tires increases the likelihood of many different types of crashes, including those involving: (1) skidding and/or loss of control of the vehicle; (2) hydroplaning; (3) increases in stopping distance; (4) flat tires and blowouts, and (5) overloading of the vehicle. We anticipate that 90 percent of drivers will respond to a TPMS low tire pressure warning by re-inflating their tires to the recommended placard pressure. Once all new light vehicles are equipped with compliant TPMSs, we expect that a resulting 119-121 fatalities would be prevented each year.

requiring it is one thing. not being able to disable T/C in certain situations isn't (in my mind) okay... I couldn't get my 3 month old civic out of my parking spot at my apartment after the first snow (3" IIRC?) without first going to find a pump to pump the tires up the 2 psi they needed to get T/C off!

tuna I know I still think it should be an option vs. mandatory. It's just another one of these stupid things that make cares more expensive and it was sold because it "could help you get more MPGS!!! ZOMG"

It really should be able to be disabled just like it was on the 8th gen. If it was a smart traction control like a Mercedes C class has I'd be ok. This one just cuts off all power at any hint of slippage.

In reply to Autolex:

In reply to DirtyBird222:

Oh, I agree, but the fact is that, without going into politics, that is a direct consequence of this law and the way Honda integrated the warning into their systems. They even asked about it, here was the answer:

NHTSA wrote: MIL Disablement The NPRM did not contain any provision for MIL disablement. Honda requested clarification as to whether it would be permissible to disable or to suppress the MIL when the TPMS sending units have been removed as a result of the replacement of the original equipment tires and rims with aftermarket components that are not compatible with the direct-sensing TPMS. Honda stated that it had previously received complaints from customers and dealers who encountered this situation and were confronted with a recurrent malfunction warning. The company expressed concern that if the MIL cannot be suppressed in these situations, consumers may become desensitized to MILs generally, which could have negative implications for occupant safety. NADA provided a similar comment. We do not believe it is appropriate to permit disablement of the MIL when aftermarket tires and rims are installed on the vehicle that are not compatible with the continued proper functioning of the TPMS. In such cases, the TPMS MIL is performing its intended function. We believe that the MIL should continue to operate when tires and rims that are incompatible with the TPMS are mounted on the vehicle, not only to discourage such actions, but also to provide an ongoing reminder that the TPMS is unavailable to provide low tire pressure warnings.

Yes, I can confirm this based on my mom's Honda Odyssey. To get around this you can pull the fuse for the VSA (check your owner's manual). But SCCA Solo rules prohibit this.

I would apply for an exemption (from the SCCA) or swap the sensors over.

Ironically, in the older Hondas, the owner's manual specifically instructed the driver to turn the traction control off if the spare was being used.

Mmadness wrote: Yes, I can confirm this based on my mom's Honda Odyssey. To get around this you can pull the fuse for the VSA (check your owner's manual). But SCCA Solo rules prohibit this.

Doesn't work anymore (at least not on my 2012 Civic)

Nope. Pulling the VSA or TPMS fuses has no effect whatsoever on the system. In Canada though, that works. F'ing Canadadians

so the Canadian version has a different ECU ? could someone get a Canadian ECU and just plug it in to a USDM car ? would it still pass different states pollution tax … er…. I mean emissions test ?