Back when I did blue-collar grunt work, one thing I noticed is that even though I had gone to college (and they respected that) they still had to yell at me like I was a E36 M3head in order to keep the actual E36 M3heads from getting explosively pissed off that I wasn't being talked to like a E36 M3head. I'd say depending on the job it was a 25-60% E36 M3head rate.
SVreX said:In reply to z31maniac :
Then ask.
Ask what? You're the one that started a thread implying "Just become a plumber and you'll make $100k+ working less than 40 hours per week!" And have had to go back and clarify multiple points you've been trying to make to multiple people.
Such as this particular persons sweetheart deal with his boss that lets him use company property for personal work, money off scrap, etc. I won't make any assumptions about other companies, but I know if I was his boss and found out, there would be a severe "Come to Jesus" meeting, and if it continued, he'd be gone and I'd be looking to recoup lost earnings from his misuse of my equipment.
You were using a case study to make a generalization, which typically doesn't work well.
In reply to z31maniac :
Ok. We disagree.
Edit: Content removed because I didn’t need to show my azz.
Jesus, this E36 M3 again?
I was reasonabley interested until it devolved.
berkeley it, I'm out.
In reply to Appleseed :
You’re right. I apologize.
Im good at over reacting when I’m called a liar.
post removed.
There is a sign near my house looking for service people. The company is a tire supplier that has trucks that provide emergency roadside service for semi trucks, changing flats etc. The job is the overnight shift, so that sucks, and tires can explode, and that sucks. But it doesn't require a college degree and the pay is $45 hour. That's even if you have no calls during your shift. That's $93,600 per year.
SVreX said:In reply to Appleseed :
You’re right. I apologize.
Im good at over reacting when I’m called a liar.
post removed.
Except I didn't call you liar. I said a case study doesn't make a good basis for generalization.
And you have had to clarify multiple points regarding residential vs commercial work, this guy having a sweetheart deal, and what seems to be exorbitantly, expensive plumbing rates in your area (judged on how many responded they have never seen prices anywhere near that high).
None of which was intended to piss you off.
In reply to z31maniac :
I’m not pissed.
I have spent 40 years in an industry working in 14 different states that has a big opportunity for some people at this time.
Just came to share. That’s all.
pinchvalve said:There is a sign near my house looking for service people. The company is a tire supplier that has trucks that provide emergency roadside service for semi trucks, changing flats etc. The job is the overnight shift, so that sucks, and tires can explode, and that sucks. But it doesn't require a college degree and the pay is $45 hour. That's even if you have no calls during your shift. That's $93,600 per year.
I once saw a job that was similar but for construction equipment field servicing. The job description made it sound absolutely badass. Basically, you get paid to go out in the middle of no-where and wrench on equipment. It's like working on a race team.
In reply to SVreX :
Apologies accepted.
I too need to realize that tone and manor are not the easiest thing to convey over the internet.
Seriously? I've known some shiny happy people in my life, but really, the way this thread's gone makes me realize some of them are here, and I have the power to reduce that number with just a few clicks. Get your E36 M3 together, or leave your E36 M3 where someone else eats, please and thank you.
Marge
Just had to put $337 on my credit card because my landlord is out of the country. Leaking shower head. That'll ding the credit for a few weeks. 30-40 minutes of time.
z31maniac said:None of which was intended to piss you off.
Both of you could use work on your tone, but at least Paul's apologized. If you don't think you've been antagonistic, you might need to reread the thread.
Paul never said he was spelling out exactly how everyone could easily fall into a $275/hr paid position. He was talking about opportunities for big money in the trades that are being overlooked by the general populace. Expecting your friends to come up with a doctorate thesis on every subject they post about is a little excessive. He had to clarify some points! Oh my, I'm clutching at my pearls.
(BTW, that was intended as a good natured ribbing there. :-)
Fair enough. My apologies for being a shiny happy person in my response, it was terse and I should know better.
I sometimes do side work for my dad, a self employed plumber. Maybe he is undervaluing his time or maybe our little slice of paradise values trades differently than other places... I don't know. I know several (licensed) plumbers working for honest companies and working long hours. I'd be surprised if any of them make much more than 65k in a good year, with the exception of the guys who own the larger companies with 10+ employees.
Not knocking the work. And I firmly believe the value of such work will rise as fewer folks are willing to get their hands dirty. It just isn't the picture I see. Not around here anyway.
In reply to barefootskater :
I suspect the plumbers you referenced focus on residential work and don’t chase a lot of service work, contract work, or unit billing.
I also suspect they make more than you think. Plumbers’ lifestyles are not showy, and it’s easy to assume they don’t make much. They probably don’t make $150K, but $85K or 90 is very possible.
I also think it may be possible there is not much new construction growth in your area right now (which drives the market). But nationwide right now, that is not the case.
There is great value in fair prices, simple living, and stress free lives. I’ve lived that way my whole life. But I am now a commodity, and could ask a lo more.
I get 30-40 hits on my LinkedIn page per week. Someone is looking for what I’ve got. I’ve turned down 2 full time permanent offers in the last several weeks that were over $95K (plus benefits that were worth an additional 30%). And I’m just a superintendent. I don’t have one of the more valuable licenses (like plumbing).
But I have seen the contracts on dozens of projects in the last few years, and I know how much they have increased. I know how many hours projects like this take.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the life your Dad and his friends have chosen. I’ve done it too. But if I was 30 again, there is no question I would be doing it differently. The industry is changing
In reply to jharry3 :
Yeah but not my property. And the guy actually did struggle with it. I'll get the money back also. Busting a caliper bolt and flooding not your house have different impacts. 
As a business owner, do let me remind the thread that while high gross margins can make it look like a company (or person) is making too much or at least a lot of money that the net margin can still be sucky, nonexistent or even negative.
16 years ago I left the salvage yard industry for Dealership Service just before the wages started dropping. I tried to climb the ladders but I was just spending hours and making the same money. 2012 came along and I was freshly divorced, $100k plus in debt with nothing to show for it and at a job that was paying less every year. I struggled for a bit longer until I took a chance on getting a job at Denso as a regular associate with the intent of moving up. 90 days after being hired in I was awarded a Machine Technician position. It was an entry level maintenance job and a very lucrative one at that, base wages are $46k and more than a few coworkers have made 6 figures with judicious application of overtime. After 4 years of doing this job I have cleared off a majority of my old debt, bought a house and a new Wrangler and truly found a happy place in life.
In October I start the next step. At 47 years old I will be testing the waters of the Apprenticeship Program which will allow me to be a Level 1 Maintenance Technician.
If you have any mechanical aptitude I suggest looking into Skilled Trades. The investment is nothing compared to the reward.
Not to be the old guy in the room but... you really need to have some aptitude for and interest in what you do for a living. You will not be able to work for any length of time if you don't, regardless of how much you make. All work has aspects that are unpleasant and unrewarding and you need to care about what you do to make it through them.
Just posting because I am currently struggling to find a plumber. We need to have our water heater certified (a legal requirement for the local government presiding over the house we are currently selling). Basically someone needs to come look at the water heater to make sure it is hooked up normally and then run some hot water in the tub to make sure it's hot. $150 service, should take 30 mintues or less, if you are local you could just swing by before or after a close by service.
We can't get someone to call us back, and the one guy we just caught on the phone very tersely told us: "I can't help YOU! I'm freaking SWAMPED!"
So, when you have so much business that you can yell at people asking to pay you $300/hr you must be doing something right.
Correction, just got someone to agree to do it. $180.
What are the license requirements for plumbers in most states?
Could you work part-time to obtain licensure?
For example, here in AZ, the license exam require 4 years of experience, but I can't find out where the classify what "4 years" is, and if that might include schooling or not. Say I work for a licensed plumber, but he actually only does plumbing occasionally, the rest of the time he installs pools, if I shadow him every time he occasionally does plumbing work for 4-years, can I take the test?
Likewise, what if I apprentice alongside a handyman who is licensed plumber, electrician, etc...and I do a bit of everything. Does that mean if I only do plumbing part-time, I'll need to accrue the equivalent of 8 years of experience?
pheller said:What are the license requirements for plumbers in most states?
Could you work part-time to obtain licensure?
For example, here in AZ, the license exam require 4 years of experience, but I can't find out where the classify what "4 years" is, and if that might include schooling or not. Say I work for a licensed plumber, but he actually only does plumbing occasionally, the rest of the time he installs pools, if I shadow him every time he occasionally does plumbing work for 4-years, can I take the test?
Likewise, what if I apprentice alongside a handyman who is licensed plumber, electrician, etc...and I do a bit of everything. Does that mean if I only do plumbing part-time, I'll need to accrue the equivalent of 8 years of experience?
I'm going to guess, based on other professional jobs in the country, that 4 years of experience means...............4 years of full-time experience, ~8320 hours.
But it looks like in your state you can get extra credit toward that.
http://www.usaplumbing.info/license/az/arizona-plumbing-license-requirements
Best to call someone who knows.
In reply to pheller :
If it's anything like the electrical apprenticeship program when I was younger, it's a good bit more formal than just shadowing someone. The electrical program had classes 1-2 afternoons a week several times a year, and exams based on those classes. The class time was mandatory.
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