Columbus day's almost over, let's talk about Christopher Columbus.

When you were a kid in school you probably learned that Christopher Columbus was the intrepid geographical genius who benevolently discovered America. Sometime afterward, you probably learned that he was a seafaring proto-Hitler with unconventionally wrong ideas about geography who got sloppy thirds on America. But it turns out that's not right either - many of the crimes against humanity he's been accused of are based on mistranslations and misattributions. Have a look at this excellent video and inform yourselves:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEw8c6TmzGg

In reply to GameboyRMH :

Interesting, thanks for sharing. 

That’s very interesting. 

Still a little different from what I learned when I lived in  Dominican Republic (formerly known as Hispaniola), but FAR more accurate than any other summary I’ve heard. 

Thanks for sharing. 

He was from Genoa, so, ehhh. 

But hey, I want to be angry about something.... I don't need reasonably researched information...

...GIVE ME SOMETHING TO BE ANGRY ABOUT!!!!

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(I kind of wish this guy was in charge of a news network... but that would likely get corrupted)

Since it all happened 500 years ago it's pretty hard to say one thing or the other is the definite truth.  Not long ago I read a book about Magellan and his voyage around the world - if the book was correct, pretty much everything about that journey was a real clusterberkeley.

I always wondered how much more efficient our school system would be if they didn't spend so much time re-teaching us stuff they already taught us incorrectly...

all I know is that Columbus and Erickson are a bunch of Bob Costas' compared to St. Brendan the Navigator

also, the recreation of the voyage is a good book if you need something to read

Like most history we know what someone wants us to know not necessarily what actually happened.

Basically he was a third rate hack who the Italians didn't have time for.  the Spanish crown gave him some leaky old tubs and invested some gold to get rig of him, but supported him on the off chance he found a new trading rout and would claim it for them rathar that one of ther pesky European neighbors.  He got luck, they got rich.  Well, that's my story and I'm sticking too it.

Good time to post though, since it's Leif Erikson day who beat Columbus over to the new world by 500 years or so.  There are those who claim Europeans were here long before that though.

There's also some evidence that the Chinese made it to America quite a while before Columbus did, and that Columbus may have been aware of a Chinese map that shows both North and South America in reasonable detail.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

See, I said he was just a lucky hack 

Actually I'd forgotten about the Chinese theory.  It got a lot of press a few years ago.  Think I'll head off to Wiki for a refresh.  thx.

Washington Redskins lost yesterday. 

Cleveland Indians lost yesterday. 

Atlanta Braves lost yesterday. 

I'm not making this up

Part of the problem with discussing this sort of thing is that the world was very different 500 years ago.  Even if the accounts of what happened then were accurate, which they are not, you would be ill equipped to make a judgment on how he compared to his peers.

In reply to Adrian_Thompson :

I remember reading years ago about some evidence pointing toward Vikings having visited pretty far up the Missouri River too. 

My favorite detail about Columbus myths is how many people think that the reason Columbus couldn't get a backer for his expedition is that everyone at the time though the world was flat. In reality, the reason nobody wanted to back him was that scholars at the time had a pretty good handle on the straight line distance from Europe to China, and knew the ships Columbus planned to use couldn't cover that distance without stopping for resupplies.

Pete Gossett said:

In reply to Adrian_Thompson :

I remember reading years ago about some evidence pointing toward Vikings having visited pretty far up the Missouri River too. 

That's nothing.  They've got an away game with the Jets in MetLife Stadium in NJ the week after next!

The problem with the supposed visits and attempted colonizations by the pre-Columbian Chinese, Japanese, Polynesians, Scandinavians, Irish, etc. is that none of them made the contact stick.  Even the folks who walked over evidently didn't go back and forth much, and seem to have forgotten that there was another continent.

After 1492, the Americas were open for business.

In reply to slantvaliant :

Forgetting the people who where already settled prior to Columbus.  More than likely, most came across the land bridge or via sailing from the south Pacific.  They stuck for many, many years.  Just not affiliated with some home location.

Blaming Columbus for the exploitation of the native people of the Americas is a bit like blaming J.J. Thompson for the atomic bomb.

Thompson’s “Plum Pudding” Model

The first major discovery that set off modern atomic theory was that atoms aren’t in fact the smallest things that exist. J. J. Thompson discovered the electron in 1897, which led him to posit a “plum pudding” model (a.k.a. the “raisin pudding” model) for the atom. Electrons are small negative charges, and Thompson suggested that these negative charges are distributed about a positively charged medium like plums in a plum pudding. The negatively charged electrons would balance out the positively charged medium so that each atom would be of neutral charge.

In reply to slantvaliant :

And we’re largely taught that nothing much of consequence happened here between when CC landed and my family stepped off the Mayflower 130 years later.  The Pilgrims weren’t in any way the first but their story is the one that’s known the “best”.  And even it is heavily twisted and revised from the actual events.

They were the ones with whom the folks listed would have made contact. 

In reply to KyAllroad (Jeremy) :

Hmmm.  Different from what I was taught.  But then, I enjoyed Texas history in school. 

There are problems with the history of the Americas, in that many of the early inhabitants didn't record much.  Much of what we have from them has been altered through retelling, often with filters and embellishments of various eras.  Not unlike our history books, but more difficult to compare with primary sources.

The Europeans often recorded what they thought was important, and what they wanted their bosses to hear.  

I just thought I might point out, as a Canadian student, I was taught the Columbus discovered America.  As in, the continent.  Nobody except United Statesians has ever said Columbus discovered the United States... 

I've never heard anyone say that. It was always,  "Columbus discovered America." 

When you are young, and you learn that you are an American, maybe you assume that means he discovered the United States?