In reply to KyAllroad :
I had wondered the same about causalities and resistance. On the one hand I hear interviews with Ukranian mothers who say they just got their AK-47 and are willing to fight in the streets, but on the other hand I don't see causalities and Russia is on the outskirts of Kyiv.
Plenty of propaganda on both sides. Important to remember that we're most susceptible to the kind that we secretly hope for.
CrustyRedXpress said:In reply to KyAllroad :
I had wondered the same about causalities and resistance. On the one hand I hear interviews with Ukranian mothers who say they just got their AK-47 and are willing to fight in the streets, but on the other hand I don't see causalities and Russia is on the outskirts of Kyiv.
Plenty of propaganda on both sides. Important to remember that we're most susceptible to the kind that we secretly hope for.
The last line is especially important. We all have bias. We also expect the war to be freely and immediately broadcast on the internet. Just because we set up a fledgling new cable news network with full access to the Persian Gulf War to show off doesn't mean that's normal or expected.
tuna55 said:93EXCivic said:Russia is threatening Finland and Sweden now.
https://www.newsweek.com/russia-threatens-finland-sweden-nato-ukraine-invasion-1682715
I think there are quite a few Russian soldiers already 6 ft under in Finland
A good time to fast-track them into NATO. I would not want to mess with Finland.
Shewt, they're practically in as it is. They're a participating member of NATO's Strategic Airlift Capability, NATO is currently honoring their military levels of clearance (with regards to releasing classified information), and if I'm not mistaken they have some sort of agreement with NATO that lets them use Finnish land for exercises.
(all points I was pondering while Vladi-poo was making such a ruckus about Ukraine joining NATO)
All I know is that if I had played less Risk as a kid my understanding of where Ukraine actually is wouldn't be so incorrect.
CrustyRedXpress said:Plenty of propaganda on both sides. Important to remember that we're most susceptible to the kind that we secretly hope for.
On that note, here is a vignette from the end of this NYT article:
Even as the artillery barrages intensified, not everyone was ready to hide. Walking with intention toward the source of the artillery booms on the outskirts of Kharkiv was Roman Balakelyev, dressed in camouflage, a double-barreled shotgun slung over his shoulder.
“I live here, this is my home. I’m going to defend it,” said Mr. Balakelyev, who also pulled out a large knife he had strapped to his back as if to show it off. “I don’t think the Russians understand me like I understand them.”
A short while later, Mr. Balakelyev reached the edge of the city, where the Ukrainian troops were huddled around the abandoned Russian troop transports. They watched as he passed. No one moved to stop him. One soldier uttered: “Intent on victory.”
Mr. Balakelyev, his gaze fixed and his shotgun ready, headed down the road in the direction of the booms and a tall billboard that read: “Protect the future: UKRAINE-NATO-EUROPE.”
Hungary Bill (Forum Supporter) said:tuna55 said:93EXCivic said:Russia is threatening Finland and Sweden now.
https://www.newsweek.com/russia-threatens-finland-sweden-nato-ukraine-invasion-1682715
I think there are quite a few Russian soldiers already 6 ft under in Finland
A good time to fast-track them into NATO. I would not want to mess with Finland.
Shewt, they're practically in as it is. They're a participating member of NATO's Strategic Airlift Capability, NATO is currently honoring their military levels of clearance (with regards to releasing classified information), and if I'm not mistaken they have some sort of agreement with NATO that lets them use Finnish land for exercises.
(all points I was pondering while Vladi-poo was making such a ruckus about Ukraine joining NATO)
It makes me wonder with his increasing irrationality if Putin migh have brain cancer/tumor? A lot of people get really unrational with that but luckily hey aren't in charge of large countries full of nukes.
In reply to bobzilla :
Yeah he is acting like a cornered rabid dog. His speeches seem to be getting increasingly angry and out there.
I wonder military leaders and oligarchs in Russia are thinking right now. Cause I doubt the oligarchs who have seen their wealth heavily hit are too happy and nuclear war does nothing for their bottom line e
I wish I could figure out how to share it but there is a video of a Ukrainian women going up to Russian soldiers and offering them sunflower seeds so that sunflowers could grow from their bodies.
bobzilla said:In reply to 06HHR (Forum Supporter) :
They are trying the tried and failed "one size fits all approach".
I agree, seems they would have learned from the F-111 boondoggle..
In reply to 93EXCivic :
Here ya go, I think Radio Free Europe link
Turkey is trying to decide if this counts as a war or if they can wiggle out of closing the Straits
CNN says the NATO response force is activated for the first time in history.. On standby
In reply to 93EXCivic :
This seems to be a disaster for Russians of all socioeconomic statuses. The general populace is protesting - something that does not happen there. The ruble is getting hammered (though I admit at 6% yesterday it was not as much as I expected). What does that mean for Babushka trying to buy a loaf of bread?
An unimportant thing on a global scale, but the KHL has lost a team to the SM Liiga (Helsinki Jokerit, they said... Nah, we're not doing this)... That is not a good look for the KHL, that the only Finnish team pulls out, and will impact the quality of the league as there is a good chance it will reduce the number of non-Russian/Belarussian players willing to play in it - they'll either stick with the minor leagues in North America or play in SM Liiga or Swedish League. That is a relatively small thing, but from a cultural impact, I personally don't think it is insignificant. How much will that weaken the league? Will it fold? How many other things will happen like this outside of hockey? It adds up.
In reply to 06HHR (Forum Supporter) :
The navy got a kickass air interdiction fighter and we got a great movie about it so it wasn't all bad.
In reply to mtn :
F1 race canceled in Russia. Russia kicked out of Eurovision song contest. And the Champions league final removed from Russia.
When FIA and UEFA do something that will cost them money you know you have berkeleyed up big time
Error404 said:In reply to 93EXCivic :
Here ya go, I think Radio Free Europe link
Turkey is trying to decide if this counts as a war or if they can wiggle out of closing the Straits
Thanks
My understanding was closing the straights wouldn't do much because they can't close it to ships returning to home port (which would be most of the Russian fleet).
06HHR (Forum Supporter) said:CNN says the NATO response force is activated for the first time in history.. On standby
Article 4 or 5? Neither is the first time in history. I need details.
tuna55 said:06HHR (Forum Supporter) said:CNN says the NATO response force is activated for the first time in history.. On standby
Article 4 or 5? Neither is the first time in history. I need details.
CNN was light on details so I found this article on MSN: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/nato-deploys-troops-to-eastern-flank-as-russian-attack-escalates-in-ukraine/ar-AAUjsDk?ocid=uxbndlbing
Error404 said:In reply to 93EXCivic :
Here ya go, I think Radio Free Europe link
That is the most bad ass thing I wish I didn't have to hear.
In reply to tuna55 :
It's the NATO Response Force "in a collective defense context", per SecGen Stoltenberg. Air, sea, and land assets up to 40,000 possible. Also sending parts of the Very High Readiness Joint Task Force, lead by the French. Seemingly a response to the Article 4 trigger by the Baltics (to be briefly imprecise)
Source: AP source
Re: the video, soldier seems to be fulfilling a "peacekeeper"/occupier role. Maybe some training on that, marking them as not your ordinary Russian conscript with an AK47 and 2 left boots? Idk, out of my depth there so just speculating irresponsibly
Error404 said:In reply to tuna55 :
It's the NATO Response Force "in a collective defense context", per SecGen Stoltenberg. Air, sea, and land assets up to 40,000 possible. Also sending parts of the Very High Readiness Joint Task Force, lead by the French. Seemingly a response to the Article 4 trigger by the Baltics (to be briefly imprecise)
Nice. That's prudent.
In reply to 93EXCivic :
They can limit passage of warships during wartime or if threatened. This could, possibly, tie in with the movement of the Response Force after the Article 4 meeting. Or not. Kinda depends on Turkey to commit to action against Russia. I'll follow with a link
I looked over part of my 'collection' this morning for reference. Sometimes I still prefer to hold physical maps vs look at a screen. Here's a couple views from some 20th century globes and maps of the area; All during the Soviet Union time:
Hammond Atlas Published in 1988:
I expect that Putin still see those maps as correct.
In reply to Error404 :
But not if the ships are returning to home port was my understanding. Since home port is already inside, it would only prevent Russian ships going back out which seems kind of useless unless I am missing something
In reply to 93EXCivic :
My reading was that they normally cannot obstruct ships from returning to a home port but, in wartime or when threatened, they can close the straits to warships. With NATO activating the Response Force that could be twisted towards a "threat" and NATO "requesting" that they close the straits. Either way, that's above my paygrade. Either way it would trap the ships currently there but would prevent naval reinforcements from any late arriving allies or russian fleets.
AAZCD-Jon (Forum Supporter) said:I looked over part of my 'collection' this morning for reference. Sometimes I still prefer to hold physical maps vs look at a screen. Here's a couple views from some 20th century globes and maps of the area; All during the Soviet Union time:
I expect that Putin still see those maps as correct.
I think Putin is looking more at pre-revolution maps:
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