I saw a meme on FB that was kinda interesting. It had a picture of a snowstorm, the kind that can hit places like Colorado, Chicago, New York, Canada, etc. It was a highway full of cars, all stranded for hours. The question was what happens if all cars go electric? How long can you sit there with the heat blasting? And what if 100 electric cars are all dead on the highway, how do you clear that mess? You can't just dump in more fuel. It was interesting to think about.
pinchvalve said:I saw a meme on FB that was kinda interesting. It had a picture of a snowstorm, the kind that can hit places like Colorado, Chicago, New York, Canada, etc. It was a highway full of cars, all stranded for hours. The question was what happens if all cars go electric? How long can you sit there with the heat blasting? And what if 100 electric cars are all dead on the highway, how do you clear that mess? You can't just dump in more fuel. It was interesting to think about.
Portable chargers are a thing now. There is a rumor that some can be charged by being flat towed.
Also so are tow trucks.
Humans are more than capable of being prepared for eventualities like that. People routinely fail to do so and that will never change. A quick check of curent traffic patterns will give you an idea if you should venture out at all (doesn't cover all situations, but it can give you an idea if traffic is already stopped, why join the dog pile if you can avoid it?)
As electric cars become more and more common, gas powered cars won't ever completely go away, so there will always be a backup of some sort. Also more charging points, including portable ones will become more and more common.
pinchvalve said:I saw a meme on FB that was kinda interesting. It had a picture of a snowstorm, the kind that can hit places like Colorado, Chicago, New York, Canada, etc. It was a highway full of cars, all stranded for hours. The question was what happens if all cars go electric? How long can you sit there with the heat blasting? And what if 100 electric cars are all dead on the highway, how do you clear that mess? You can't just dump in more fuel. It was interesting to think about.
A couple years ago in Atlanta, we had a snowstorm leave a lot of stranded Nissan Leafs with dead batteries on I-285. Took days to get the road clear. They mostly had to tow the cars out, weren't able to recharge them.
At full blast my LEAF uses about 3kw for heat. Mine's old, and has a way smaller battery pack than modern electric cars (only 24kwh). It also has a resistive heater instead of the heat pump more modern electrics use.
Basic math says that even my LEAF would run the heat on full blast for 8 hours.
Oddly, Janel got this same question when we got our Tesla. People seemed to assume that 1) she would immediately get stuck in a snowstorm and 2) she would then freeze to death. It's a big ass battery, how long do you plan on sitting there? How long can you idle a random gas car with a random amount of fuel in the tank? It's a really inefficient way to heat people, electric seat heaters would be a lot more effective.
Any good cold weather emergency car kit should have a candle in it. You can keep a car interior surprisingly warm with a candle.
And yes, if you run out of power it's time for a tow truck. This is a solved problem, we know how to tow cars.
A gasoline powered car is going to drain the fuel tank idling to keep you warm, too. And, if the wind is right, it will kill you with carbon monoxide at the same time.
Gas car's don't really sit and idle that well for long streches; i've been stuck like that one time, and you have to keep getting out of the car to clear away snow around the exhaust, which naturally releases any built up heat you had. There's also the detail of the sheer number of us whom regularly aren't at a full tank when things like this hit.
Right now there will soon be electric cars that can be plugged into each other and will "Equalize" the difference in charge between the two cars, i.e. a 75% state of charge can connect to one that's at 25% and will bring both eventually to 50%, like some smartphones. Many EVs also are getting very clever about ways to scrap for energy and efficiency either with solar glass, routing battery cooling and management into the cabin HVAC, and even adding solar PV to the electrical system as a small "boost" for total energy.
Doing math like Tom - apparently the Model 3 heater is about 4 kW, and the LR battery is 75 KWh. That means it could run the heater on full tilt boogie for 18 hours or so. But that's assuming you can't keep up with heat loss and you need 100% duty cycle. And a seat heater is about 0.057 kW, so you could keep two people warm for over 3 weeks.
Considering how most people seem to have a quarter tank of gas and 20% charge on their phone at any given time, I think the energy source of a car is the last thing to worry about in a storm.
Living in the midwest, I would actually rather be stranded in an electric. More efficient heating at "idle", and no dangerous fumes. Once the battery/gas runs out the type of car is irrelevant.
This is one of the primary reasons I keep fuel in the car. Not to save the pump, but knowing that I can jump in the car and run it for hours at any given time in any situation.
Tom Suddard said:At full blast my LEAF uses about 3kw for heat. Mine's old, and has a way smaller battery pack than modern electric cars (only 24kwh). It also has a resistive heater instead of the heat pump more modern electrics use.
Basic math says that even my LEAF would run the heat on full blast for 8 hours.
Most of the stuck Leafs weren't stuck from sitting in the snowstorm running the heater with the car sitting still - what did them in was a combination of the cold weather reducing the avaialble battery power and running the heater for longer than expected when traffic jams slowed the cars down. The cold took a car that already had a marginal range for a long commute, and hit the cars with a triple whammy of less available energy, more energy-depleting accessories in use, and a longer time to burn through the energy due to more traffic jams.
Teslas seemed to have done lot bit better - much larger battery pack.
Human beings more than capable? You must not see to fools out in shorts and street shoes in a snowstorm that I do. 
How many of the people asking this question don't have even the most basic emergency supplies in their gas-powered car?
A vaguely connected paraphrase af a quote I saw a while back.
"The youth of today is more prepared for a zombie apocalypse than a power outage."
Apologies for the generalization.
I'm not sure I'd limit that statement to youth.
In reply to wheelsmithy :
Why did you apologize for generalizing... after generalizing? Like, you only do that when you can't stand by your opinion.
MadScientistMatt said:pinchvalve said:I saw a meme on FB that was kinda interesting. It had a picture of a snowstorm, the kind that can hit places like Colorado, Chicago, New York, Canada, etc. It was a highway full of cars, all stranded for hours. The question was what happens if all cars go electric? How long can you sit there with the heat blasting? And what if 100 electric cars are all dead on the highway, how do you clear that mess? You can't just dump in more fuel. It was interesting to think about.
A couple years ago in Atlanta, we had a snowstorm leave a lot of stranded Nissan Leafs with dead batteries on I-285. Took days to get the road clear. They mostly had to tow the cars out, weren't able to recharge them.
My Mom's leaf was a champ in the snow but couldn't get around stopped traffic so she ended up spending the night on the road. When the battery started getting low she ran just the seat heater and covered up with blankets she had in the car. She was able to drive it home the next day.
Appleseed said:You must not see to fools out in shorts and street shoes in a snowstorm that I do.
I resemble tgat remark. Sometimes.
This talk of towing has me curious, how do Teslas handle it? I would expect them to be designed with motors that can freewheel with no ill effects, but you never know with Tesla.
GIRTHQUAKE said:In reply to wheelsmithy :
Why did you apologize for generalizing... after generalizing? Like, you only do that when you can't stand by your opinion.
It's a real touchy world these days. That was a way of admitting there are exceptions to the rule. I'd hate to offend you jerks
Mr_Asa said:This talk of towing has me curious, how do Teslas handle it? I would expect them to be designed with motors that can freewheel with no ill effects, but you never know with Tesla.
It has a towing mode. Think of it as the equivalent of putting my 1967 Land Rover's transfer case into neutral.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
I'd be surprised if it didn't have towing mode, but I was more wondering aloud how they did it.
Mr_Asa said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
I'd be surprised if it didn't have towing mode, but I was more wondering aloud how they did it.
iirc you have to have charge in the 12v normal car battery for it to engage
Which can easily be accomplished using a set of jumper cables from the tow truck. And yes, there are external jump points so it'll work even if you're locked out. I don't think that draining the drive battery also takes out the 12v, so the car would have to be totally dead for some other reason.
Will said:How many of the people asking this question don't have even the most basic emergency supplies in their gas-powered car?
I have a cell phone that can't make a call for more than five minutes before the battery dies, and a charging port in the car that requires the engine to be running to work. What else do I need?
Seriously.... I GET why cigarette lighter type ports are ignition-only, but it's damned inconvenient when you're on the side of the road and trying to charge your phone because you've been on hold for ten minutes and the car is screaming at you to start the engine or turn the key off because battery voltage is low. There's buttons for eveything and everything is controlled by electronic modules instead of switches, why not a button to turn on the "accessory port" with the key off?
When we drove to Portland over Christmas break, we brought multiple coats, blankets, boots, a road atlas, cable chains, a real GPS, and tools.
And a few old Duracell Power Bank rechargeable battery backups for our phones.
We didn't need any of it, but it was better than not carrying it and needing any of it due to weather causing an accident or an interstate getting shut down. I like to carry the battery backup in the car on most any trip. Just in case. It is incredibly cheap peace of mind.
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