Manufacturer survey about dealer

Schmidlap wrote: I think people just have completely unrealistic expectations about what the dealership is required to do and what the survey is asking. Looking at it from the analogy of an exam, since so many want to look at it that way, if they did the repair on time, it was done properly, and they picked me up/dropped me off on time, why not give a perfect score?

Because that E36 M3 isn't supposed to happen to me and my hooptie.

And yes, the surveys are as clear as mud on what the results represent, for both the customer and dealership.

rotard wrote: Some of you guys are real shiny happy people. You know that they need perfect scores to get their bonus or whatever. Why not just give it to them? The only time I don't give a 10 is if they've done a crappy job. You people probably tried to berkeley over classmates when grading each other's tests in school. You also probably hose any employees you have when it comes to promotions/raises during eval time. "I don't believe in giving excellent scores, so you got a 5/10 for competence, which is average. I'm not really putting you at a disadvantage against other employees with different managers, even if they give 9 and 10/10 for most categories."

Misplaced anger again. You're mad that a customer doesn't automatically know without any background information (such as this thread, or an employee blatantly telling them "Grade me a 10/10 so i can get money!") that the survey system is utter horseE36 M3 and they should always give a 10/10?

Fix the sickness. Not the symptom.

Its the swame exact system they use at hospitals for customer satisfaction BS. No one is going to give 5 out of 5 or 10 out of 10 when they feel like crap or are hurting. Its BS and about everyone complained but nothing was ever changed, it was the hospital management that started the surveys(either bought it or had help making it with consultants I bet). They harped on us all the time about our lower than perfect scores. To be fair it was an insurance type thing, the higher the score the better they paid. It was a Blue Cross and Medicare thing. They were on us instead of trying to change the survey. Anyway, I have the same feelings about the surveys as most here do, no one gives perfect scores becuase its impossible, if they do its a lie. They told us to try to explain to the patients to give perfect scores but not to actually ask them to give them, I never even said anything to them about it.

The survey is also used to gather data to make up some extremely misleading advertising.

I feel about surveys like I feel about tips. If you don't give me more than I expect then you've just given average service. Look up the definition of average sometime. Average isn't bad.

I don't participate in your pay scale or rate. You need to negotiate a different deal if you don't like it, that's not my problem. It's as if the Dealers use the system to determine your pay because they know they will come out ahead in that game. Just remember the House always wins@

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

rotard wrote: Some of you guys are real shiny happy people. You know that they need perfect scores to get their bonus or whatever. Why not just give it to them? The only time I don't give a 10 is if they've done a crappy job. You people probably tried to berkeley over classmates when grading each other's tests in school. You also probably hose any employees you have when it comes to promotions/raises during eval time. "I don't believe in giving excellent scores, so you got a 5/10 for competence, which is average. I'm not really putting you at a disadvantage against other employees with different managers, even if they give 9 and 10/10 for most categories."

Misplaced anger again. You're mad that a customer doesn't automatically know without any background information (such as this thread, or an employee blatantly telling them "Grade me a 10/10 so i can get money!") that the survey system is utter horseE36 M3 and they should always give a 10/10? Fix the sickness. Not the symptom.

I'm not angry, and I don't work at a dealership. As a matter of fact, I've been twice to get work done in the past several years. One was getting engine replaced in the RX-8 under warranty, and another was an oil change on the Z06 with a coupon.

I understand, however, that giving someone a 10/10 on a survey that affects his or her pay doesn't hurt me, and helps them. All I'm hearing from you guys is "wah wah, 10/10 is perfect, and nothing is perfect!"

The system is in place to keep these guys from getting paid as much. That's all it is. These kinds of things will get fixed when the owners and guys in charge want it fixed, which probably won't happen. INB4 get a better job.

rotard wrote:

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

rotard wrote: Some of you guys are real shiny happy people. You know that they need perfect scores to get their bonus or whatever. Why not just give it to them? The only time I don't give a 10 is if they've done a crappy job. You people probably tried to berkeley over classmates when grading each other's tests in school. You also probably hose any employees you have when it comes to promotions/raises during eval time. "I don't believe in giving excellent scores, so you got a 5/10 for competence, which is average. I'm not really putting you at a disadvantage against other employees with different managers, even if they give 9 and 10/10 for most categories."

Misplaced anger again. You're mad that a customer doesn't automatically know without any background information (such as this thread, or an employee blatantly telling them "Grade me a 10/10 so i can get money!") that the survey system is utter horseE36 M3 and they should always give a 10/10? Fix the sickness. Not the symptom.

I'm not angry, and I don't work at a dealership. As a matter of fact, I've been twice to get work done in the past several years. One was getting engine replaced in the RX-8 under warranty, and another was an oil change on the Z06 with a coupon. I understand, however, that giving someone a 10/10 on a survey that affects his or her pay doesn't hurt me, and helps them. All I'm hearing from you guys is "wah wah, 10/10 is perfect, and nothing is perfect!"

I can understand that aspect of it. I'd probably do it once.

Then never step foot in that dealership again. I refuse to support such a total BS system. And really, it's MOSTLY on the basis that it's unfair to the employee, not that i believe the employee doesn't deserve their bonus, far from it.

And guess what? My boss this year did not give me a 10/10 review. She never has. She probably never will. I'm not bitching about it. Know why? Because 8/10 and above still qualifies for the full portion of the merit pool percentage raise. Probably something that should be implemented with the auto service industry.

I think the average Joe walking into a dealership for service has no concept that said dealership is a separate entity than the manufacturer. If they are unhappy with a crappy car YOU are the same as manufacturer because YOU are who they have to deal with when the crap breaks.

I am so glad that I don't have to deal with any of that crap both as an employee and as a consumer. Nobody touches my junk but me. But if I was asked to give a 10/10 score on a survey I just wouldn't fill it out. Or give 0/10 scores because I'm a dick.

Wow there was like ten replys in the time it took me to type that.

OK,

I'm going to let ya'll know how it works when you try to raise hell with the people who make the surveys.

They don't give 2 E36 M3s what you think. You're an employee and should be treated as so. They're you're higher up's and you should treat them as so.

End of story.

Survey's won't change, EVER. As it's been said on here already, quit being jerks and just take care of the people who take care of you and your car. Now you know how the system works, just work with it and us and all will be fine.

I'm not an employee. I'm saying that the customers should be also raising hell. I will next time i get one.

That's the typical dealership attitude I excpect. 1/10 for you.

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

rotard wrote: Some of you guys are real shiny happy people. You know that they need perfect scores to get their bonus or whatever. Why not just give it to them? The only time I don't give a 10 is if they've done a crappy job. You people probably tried to berkeley over classmates when grading each other's tests in school. You also probably hose any employees you have when it comes to promotions/raises during eval time. "I don't believe in giving excellent scores, so you got a 5/10 for competence, which is average. I'm not really putting you at a disadvantage against other employees with different managers, even if they give 9 and 10/10 for most categories."

Misplaced anger again. You're mad that a customer doesn't automatically know without any background information (such as this thread, or an employee blatantly telling them "Grade me a 10/10 so i can get money!") that the survey system is utter horseE36 M3 and they should always give a 10/10? Fix the sickness. Not the symptom.

The anger isn't misplaced when you explain the survey to a customer and they still reply with the "I never give a 10/10 score because there's always room for improvement." That's just being a dick. Plain and simple.

nicksta43 wrote: That's the typical dealership attitude I excpect. 1/10 for you.

Thanks

Sorry just in a bad mood this morning.

Conquest351 wrote: The anger isn't misplaced when you explain the survey to a customer and they still reply with the "I never give a 10/10 score because there's always room for improvement." That's just being a dick. Plain and simple.

Conquest, don't even bother. I plainly laid it out for the people who refuse (because of principle) that the only people they are hurting are ones like you. Nothing is gained, nothing will change, but they'll sure make sure money stays out of your pocket as that somehow will show the dealership owners/manufacturers who they are dealing with! Ha!

Complete and utter shiny happy people. It's an arbitrary numbering system setup to get people paid less than they are promised. berkeley! insert bang head on wall emoticon here

Curmudgeon wrote: But then you get all the 'Princess and the Pea' types who are pissed at something that the service advisor had NOTHING to do with and they hit THEM for CSI because BMW or Chrysler or whoever built a E36 M3ty window regulator which the manufacturer refuses to stand behind, meaning if it's replaced out of warranty the DEALERSHIP, NOT THE MANUFACTURER, takes the hit. As in: 'I'm pissed and just like the Romans of old I am going to kill the messenger who brings back bad news from the battlefield'.

I understand, and always did. CSI bonus is like waitstaff tips - variable, dependent on variable customers, and an assumed average amount is factored into your base pay. I get it.

I didn't ding my service advisor or the dealership for anything they didn't have control of. They gave me decent 8-9/10 work and I gave them 8s and 9s. I specifically wrote in my commentary that I understand warranty program decisions are made at the corporate level, and were not the dealer's fault. There was a blank on the survey form for a message to BMW headquarters and I let BMW have it there.

But I'm not giving Johnny Dealership straight As for B+ work just because "that's the way the system works".

I'll tip a great waitperson 20% or more... but if the service is not great, they get a standard 15% or so.

Conquest351 wrote:

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

rotard wrote: Some of you guys are real shiny happy people. You know that they need perfect scores to get their bonus or whatever. Why not just give it to them? The only time I don't give a 10 is if they've done a crappy job. You people probably tried to berkeley over classmates when grading each other's tests in school. You also probably hose any employees you have when it comes to promotions/raises during eval time. "I don't believe in giving excellent scores, so you got a 5/10 for competence, which is average. I'm not really putting you at a disadvantage against other employees with different managers, even if they give 9 and 10/10 for most categories."

Misplaced anger again. You're mad that a customer doesn't automatically know without any background information (such as this thread, or an employee blatantly telling them "Grade me a 10/10 so i can get money!") that the survey system is utter horseE36 M3 and they should always give a 10/10? Fix the sickness. Not the symptom.

The anger isn't misplaced when you explain the survey to a customer and they still reply with the "I never give a 10/10 score because there's always room for improvement." That's just being a dick. Plain and simple.

That's still focusing on the symptom...

Should i be ragging on my boss for giving me a 9/10 this year?

Ranger50 wrote: Oh and I never give 10 out of 10's. To me it implies everything was perfect. Nothing is ever perfect.

Schmidlap wrote: Looking at it from the analogy of an exam, since so many want to look at it that way, if they did the repair on time, it was done properly, and they picked me up/dropped me off on time, why not give a perfect score?

Because it specifically says "Exceptional". If it asked if I was "Satisfied" I would have answered yes, because I ws satisfied.

This system appears to be set up like the Lake Woebegone school system where ALL the students are "above average". That is NOT the customer's fault. It is the corporation's fault. So I guess from now on I'll just scrawl THIS SURVEY SUCKS in Sharpie across the form and send it in, since I'm apparently not allowed to tell the truth that something competent and acceptable was good enough to make me happy but simply not "exceptional".

carguy123 wrote: The survey is also used to gather data to make up some extremely misleading advertising.

This. I'm not having the company extort good JD Powers scores out of me by playing on my sympathy for their hapless service advisor. I won't take company crap out on him, but I'm not going to give the only answer the company wants to hear if they didn't earn it.

Isn't that exactly how we wind up with high school graduates that can't read?

rotard wrote: I understand, however, that giving someone a 10/10 on a survey that affects his or her pay doesn't hurt me...

But it DOES hurt you, because it allows companies to delude themselves into thinking that any old crap service they give is automatically exceptionally good, because you'll always answer the surveys that way to help out the SA.

The system is corrupt, we all agree on that. While purporting to test customer satisfaction it's actually a tool of the auto manufacturers to deny performance pay that usually has been earned by the adviser/salesperson. Can we agree on that? Granted there are people in dealerships who are incompetent, they deserve bad scores. But if they did a decent job either rate them as 10s or don't do the survey. when I worked for a Nissan dealer you could get fired for tampering with a survey (Telling the customer how the system works is considered tampering) & the 10 that you needed was labeled "Truly Excellent" Unfortunately it's industry wide so you can,t just walk away from it & go someplace else you have to change industries.

purplepeopleeater wrote: The system is corrupt, we all agree on that. While purporting to test customer satisfaction it's actually a tool of the auto manufacturers to deny performance pay that usually has been earned by the adviser/salesperson. Can we agree on that? Granted there are people in dealerships who are incompetent, they deserve bad scores. But if they did a decent job either rate them as 10s or don't do the survey. when I worked for a Nissan dealer you could get fired for tampering with a survey (Telling the customer how the system works is considered tampering) & the 10 that you needed was labeled "Truly Excellent" Unfortunately it's industry wide so you can,t just walk away from it & go someplace else you have to change industries.

THIS^

There are lots of good independent shops out there. If I have a repair that's not under warranty and I don't want to tackle it, they'll be getting my business. Screw the stealership and their meaningless surveys.

And you, sir, have proven that you are not affected by the things. Work under that system for a year or so then report back and let us know how you feel then.

I did not write the goddamn things. I friggin hate them because every whackoff who has to wave their 'look how much I spent' penis around uses them to beat the messenger across the head.

I just bought a Fannie Mae REO house. I had some prick of an 'asset manager' tell the real estate agent to tell me 'Christmas is over' in response to my initial offer. No counter offer.

Now in your opinion, since I 'participate in a democratic western society' the proper way for me to handle this is: I should just go off at Fannie Mae and infer that she's at fault because she told me what that assclown said. Um, no. I have made it a priority to make that asset manager prick's life miserable, though. That is how it should really work. I am REAL good at writing letters.

It does give me some small bit of cheer to know I'm not the only one living in 10/10 Hell.

I used to work for employers that measured customer satisfaction on a true 1-10 scale. I always finished in the 90% points. When I came to work for, uh, the current employer they used the "9-10 Only Counts" system. My first half year was so bad (70% points) I was put on work improvement...a laughable system that required me to fill out a daily report that I was actually doing my job and nobody ever looked at (I know they didn't; because I quit doing it occasionally just to see). I bitched and complained to management how completely moronic and slanted the survey grading was...and nobody cared. Because the CEO thought it was a Great Idea, everyone else followed suit. They actually told us "We want you to ask every customer for the 10".

Yeah, well berkeley that, I don't beg people for anything. So I hatched an experiment...

For the last two years I've done my job exactly the same. I may explain to half a dozen people a year verbally the need for a 10. The rest of the time I simply hand them, with their 'official' paperwork, a single sheet titled "An Important Message From Your Damage Appraiser". It explains the survey and how anything less than a 9 doesn't count. It explains it directly effects my performance review. It points out that it addresses the adjuster (me) only and should not reflect anything done by anyone prior to me in the company, nor the repair shop, nor the parts supplier, nor the language of the policy itself. It's clear, succinct and honest. Nowhere on the paper does my company's name or logo appear. I do not staple it to the 'official' paperwork.

Result? I've been in the 90% since implementing The Sheet.

I got excluded from my CSI bonus last year because of a guy giving me a 0 survey since he thought the survey system was stupid. He wrote a novel in the comments section about how he couldn't have been happier with how he was treated but since I asked him to fill out the survey he had to burn me. Cost me several grand. I'm sure he feel's better about not participating in that corrupt system though...