They all had roles in a big-time, big-money Football Program. They didn't want to rock that boat. They didn't want to believe that one of their own was raping little boys in the locker room shower. They won't see that as caring more about themselves and the money than they did about the safety of children, but it's really that simple.
I'm sorry, but I've got to say this whole bit about: "Paterno heard something kind of vague, what was he supposed to do..." is disturbing. Obvious questions arise. You say the man, a direct eyewitness, was "distraught." What exactly did he say? Did you not demand to know what he saw? If not, why not? Were you curious? If you weren't going to call the police, were you curious about whether anyone else ever did? As the years went by, did you wonder whether this child, and others, were still being raped?
He's in his 80's, all he knows is football, and I understand it hasn't sunk in yet. I just hope that the rest of us understand that when you hear what he heard, you pick up the phone and call the police.
Is anyone else just really bummed for the students currently at Penn State, that this is the E36 M3 they have to live through while on campus? The stuff they will remember ten years after they graduate...not all the fun and all the awful studying and that crazy professor they had for English- they will have to remember the time some pervert raped little boys. Great.
Oh, and I think it's a little unceremonious to just kick Paterno out on his ass. Did he screw up by not calling the police? Yea, little bit. But the dude is a living legend, the longest-tenured football coach in history by a couple decades. He should at least be allowed to finish the season and retain what little shred of honor he can after they drag him through the criminal case.
RossD
SuperDork
11/10/11 8:39 a.m.
Lets just review who the eyewitness was: Mike McQueary. A former player and now assistant coach. Do you think Joe doesn't trust in Mike? If I had put someone in a position to assist me, you damn straight I'd trust them and what they had to say. This isn't just some student that was working for the program for a semester and left.
alfadriver wrote:
A real question- what kind of crime does it take to call the police right away?
~
My wife and I talked a lot last night about the whole "chain of command" reporting structure that we all live in that may not include the police for quite a while. Or even a different authority vs. the local police for some.
It's an iteresting debate that this has really brought to light.
Any felony should include contacting law enforcement. Maybe its time to learn what things may constitute as a felony. The answer isn't always as clear as many would hope.
RossD
SuperDork
11/10/11 8:42 a.m.
Twin_Cam wrote:
...
Oh, and I think it's a little unceremonious to just kick Paterno out on his ass. Did he screw up by not calling the police? Yea, little bit. But the dude is a living legend, the longest-tenured football coach in history by a couple decades. He should at least be allowed to finish the season and retain what little shred of honor he can after they drag him through the criminal case.
Tell that to the mother of the child that was raped. See how sympathetic she is with your 'living legend' arguement.
This whole situation is just terrible.
Twin_Cam wrote:
Is anyone else just really bummed for the students currently at Penn State, that this is the E36 M3 they have to live through while on campus? The stuff they will remember ten years after they graduate...not all the fun and all the awful studying and that crazy professor they had for English- they will have to remember the time some pervert raped little boys. Great.
Please, Lord, let this be sarcasm.
In reply to alfadriver:
Yeah, it is a good question. In this case the police were the first to drop the ball before any of this at PSU came to pass (or take a bribe, or just gush all fan-boy and let it slide just this one time). I wonder why we have not heard more about that.
I am absolutely positive that the elevated status of Sandusky as a 2 time National Champion defensive coach allowed him to avoid prosecution for so long.
I am sure the University did what a lot of Bishops have done... just try to wish it away by ignoring it. It never works and the guys who knew and didn't say anything certainly bear some responsibility for the misery inflicted afterward.
I would also like to think that people would execute some measure of restraint before placing serious accusations in a spotlight since the impact can be just as damning if false. You bear responsibility either way.
Twin_Cam wrote:
Is anyone else just really bummed for the students currently at Penn State, that this is the E36 M3 they have to live through while on campus? The stuff they will remember ten years after they graduate...not all the fun and all the awful studying and that crazy professor they had for English- they will have to remember the time some pervert raped little boys. Great.
Meh, a billion Catholics live with it everyday and they manage to sleep at night.
(you were kidding right?)
Twin_Cam wrote:
Is anyone else just really bummed for the students currently at Penn State....
yeah, no...I really couldnt care less about them
4cylndrfury wrote:
Twin_Cam wrote:
Is anyone else just really bummed for the students currently at Penn State....
yeah, no...I really couldnt care less about them
Maybe they could leave campus for a bit and do something productive... Or just riot.
If the assistant coach that witnessed this just walked up and put a bullet in that disgusting pedophile's head..I believe there's not a jury in this nation that would've convicted him of murder.
Everyone who turned a blind eye to this deserves to lose their jobs at the very least. End of story. Full stop.
Xceler8x wrote:
If the assistant coach that witnessed this just walked up and put a bullet in that disgusting pedophile's head..I believe there's not a jury in this nation that would've convicted him of murder.
Everyone who turned a blind eye to this deserves to lose their jobs at the very least. End of story. Full stop.
Rape is cause for lethal force. No grand jury would allow that to Court.
In reply to N Sperlo:
What Sandusky will get in prison should be pretty bad, but it sure would have been nice if Joe Paterno could have put a stop to this long ago.
Datsun1500 wrote:
How do you see a 10 year old getting raped in the shower and just leave? Not 2 guys messing around, 10.
Dude was a football player too, so it's not like he couldn't have at least tried to overpower the guy.
Otto Maddox wrote:
Joe Paterno could have put a stop to this long ago.
Seriously? The football coach who first heard of this in March of 2002 is who you see as the party who should have put a stop to this?
This excerpt below is from the ESPN timeline
Sandusky, Penn State case timeline
1998
Victim 6 is taken into the locker rooms and showers when he is 11 years old. When Victim 6 is dropped off at home, his hair is wet from showering with Sandusky. His mother reports the incident to the university police, who investigate.
Detective Ronald Schreffler testifies that he and State College Police Department Detective Ralph Ralston, with the consent of the mother of Victim 6, eavesdrop on two conversations the mother of Victim 6 has with Sandusky. Sandusky says he has showered with other boys and Victim 6's mother tries to make Sandusky promise never to shower with a boy again but he will not. At the end of the second conversation, after Sandusky is told he cannot see Victim 6 anymore, Schreffler testifies Sandusky says, "I understand. I was wrong. I wish I could get forgiveness. I know I won't get it from you. I wish I were dead."
Jerry Lauro, an investigator with the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare, testifies he and Schreffler interviewed Sandusky, and that Sandusky admits showering naked with Victim 6, admits to hugging Victim 6 while in the shower and admits that it was wrong.
The case is closed after then-Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar decides there will be no criminal charge.
Why is Attorney Ray Gricar not on the block here? Where the hell is the responsibility from the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare? The goddamn head coach got involved 4 YEARS after this one should have been in the books.
In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:
I agree with all that. There is more than enough blame to go around.
Even the graduate assistant stayed on and moved up through the coaching ranks.
Fire a big name coach, make a media splash = University sweeping issue under the rug...
See? SEEE??? we did something about it, (washing hands) now cameras, please go away...
Now, as far as all the posturing going on here:
- Child molestation is terrible
- ignorance of an issue does not absolve responsibility
- Authority = responsibility. Failure to act on your responsibility is bad, mkaay
We all agree...lets move on
all this I woulda...they shoulda... talk is boring. They will get what they have coming. Joe P's firing = justified. Sandusky imprisonment = justified. Probably a lot more firings to come = Justified.
Now, can we go back to talking up 90s sports cars again...sheesh
In reply to 4cylndrfury:
They did fire the university president. That is kind of big.
What the rest of the country (world) sees:
Rioting at Penn State. Penn State is apparently OK with child rape, as long as it means the football team is doing good.
Perhaps Penn State needs to realize it is a school of higher learning with a football team, not the other way around. (yea, I know, not going to happen)
N Sperlo wrote:
Otto Maddox wrote:
In reply to 4cylndrfury:
They did fire the university president. That is kind of big.
Meh...
In my experience, university presidents are figure heads, but I went to the U so Shalala might not be a fair example of that particular position.
mtn
SuperDork
11/10/11 11:03 a.m.
MG_Bryan wrote:
N Sperlo wrote:
Otto Maddox wrote:
In reply to 4cylndrfury:
They did fire the university president. That is kind of big.
Meh...
In my experience, university presidents are figure heads, but I went to the U so Shalala might not be a fair example of that particular position.
I'm in school now, and the President is the head honcho. He's the guy approving new buildings (including a football stadium) being built, new department heads. It goes all the way to he or his assistant being the one who cancels school on snow days.
