In reply to Toyman01 :
True, but a moderate amount of money can make many day-to-day problems go away too. When you’re between those two points can suck though.
In reply to Toyman01 :
True, but a moderate amount of money can make many day-to-day problems go away too. When you’re between those two points can suck though.
I found it interesting that the country with the highest per capita individual wealth is Switzerland. Average net worth is close to $550,000. Damn socialists! LOL
In reply to pinchvalve :
Nah....JB is only worth $550,000,000. Chump change
There’s one thing money just can’t buy…
Poverty
mtn said:I remember thinking when I got out of college that if I made $50k a year, I'd be rich.
When I got out of college the goal was to make your age x 1000. 23 years old making $23,000 was decent money. Excellent money was $30,000 and guys picking up MBA’s were close to $40-$50,000 (1985).
Now we all call out “6 figures” for decent wages. Try figuring how much you will need 15 years into retirement.
It doesn’t matter the little lady spends it all.
I've never "felt" richer than when I was first out of college. My wife and my combined income wasn't very high, but we had no kids, a small 1 bedroom apartment and a couple of old but paid for and reliable cars. The reason we "felt" rich is that only a small percentage of our available funds were committed to living expenses. I miss those days sometimes.
In reply to Pete Gossett :
True, but a lot of my day to day stresses are caused by stuff I own because I have money to buy them. When I didn't own a house, I didn't care about the $5k bill to replace the A/C, or the $10K to replace the roof. When I didn't own the company, I didn't worry about much of anything. Jobs are easy if you don't mind working. Now I've got 20 people that are depending on my company to feed them and keep roofs over their heads.
When I couldn't afford something I just did without or scrounged around for something free off the side of the road or bough it used. I just replace the entertainment center I picked up on the side of the road 20 years ago. The chair I'm currently sitting in came from the side of the road about that long ago. We still eat dinner at a table that was bought from a thrift store decades ago. I think it was $25. To replace it with a new set would be $1000, but that wouldn't make the food taste any better or the company any different, so why waste the money.
Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
Toyman01 said:Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
In general I agree with your post. But to me, once you get past the basics, money buys me freedom from the shackles of a job.
Also traveling. That is very difficult to do without money. Although if you don't have a job to worry about it does become a lot easier.
Once I make enough money to go to heath care professionals as necessary and obtain medicine and equipment to maintain that health, I will then consider myself wealthy.
Craigslist insulin can only go so far.
Toyman01 said:Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
I'll admit life was a lot simpler when I got out of college and I could fit everything I owned in the back of a pickup truck. As I approach retirement I'm thinking more and more it may be a good idea to work towards that level of stuff-ness again.
I make just over that magical $50,000 a year mark. Between taxes, health care, 401k, and child support(!), I see about half of it.......then I get to pay the mortgage, gas, water, electric, et all. So while it sounds like a fair amount to earn, i’m Pretty much broke all the time. Call me lower-middle at best.
ProDarwin said:Toyman01 said:Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
In general I agree with your post. But to me, once you get past the basics, money buys me freedom from the shackles of a job.
This. Look at my signature. There's nothing like being able to say to anyone at any time, I do not need your E36 M3. There is nothing you can do to me that would make me lose sleep because my cushion is so deep. That's what they call "berkeley you money" and it doesn't take millions as long as you live WAYYY within your means, no matter what those means are.
Stop borrowing money for cars. Stop borrowing money for crap you don't need. Stop buying funny t-shirts because they caught your eye. Stop "treating yourself" because you had a bad day - those are all poor people habits. Pay yourself first, take care of future you, and present you will be happy, future you will be happy, life is so much easier and more stress free when you haven't put yourself one step from total financial destruction.
dculberson said:ProDarwin said:Toyman01 said:Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
In general I agree with your post. But to me, once you get past the basics, money buys me freedom from the shackles of a job.
This. Look at my signature. There's nothing like being able to say to anyone at any time, I do not need your E36 M3. There is nothing you can do to me that would make me lose sleep because my cushion is so deep. That's what they call "berkeley you money" and it doesn't take millions as long as you live WAYYY within your means, no matter what those means are.
Stop borrowing money for cars. Stop borrowing money for crap you don't need. Stop buying funny t-shirts because they caught your eye. Stop "treating yourself" because you had a bad day - those are all poor people habits. Pay yourself first, take care of future you, and present you will be happy, future you will be happy, life is so much easier and more stress free when you haven't put yourself one step from total financial destruction.
And when you do treat yourself to a nice mr2, buy another to part out.
While im not the best example as we bought a brand new minivan and got a note on it, I agree with this 100%. There is a reason that other than that minivan, the prior 5 cars we owned cost an average of $3500. There is a reason that I have 2 jobs, even though I make what most would call a lot of money. I’m killing myself not taking work tomorrow ($150 for 4 hours) because the baby is due on Sunday. Really would like to take that $150 to the car loan.
dculberson said:ProDarwin said:Toyman01 said:Once you get past the food, shelter and clothing, money is just more stuff and stuff is a pretty shallow happiness.
In general I agree with your post. But to me, once you get past the basics, money buys me freedom from the shackles of a job.
This. Look at my signature. There's nothing like being able to say to anyone at any time, I do not need your E36 M3. There is nothing you can do to me that would make me lose sleep because my cushion is so deep. That's what they call "berkeley you money" and it doesn't take millions as long as you live WAYYY within your means, no matter what those means are.
Stop borrowing money for cars. Stop borrowing money for crap you don't need. Stop buying funny t-shirts because they caught your eye. Stop "treating yourself" because you had a bad day - those are all poor people habits. Pay yourself first, take care of future you, and present you will be happy, future you will be happy, life is so much easier and more stress free when you haven't put yourself one step from total financial destruction.
No matter how much you have. Events can and will come up.
How does it go? Man plans and the gods laugh!
In reply to frenchyd :
They also say “fortune favors the prepared.” No prep, no fortune.
My combined household income is under $40k. I can't afford to move to a country where that would be considered "wealthy".
Meh, I don’t worry too much about where I stand compared to the rest of the world. As long as I can pay my bills without getting behind, and still have enough left over to enjoy other things (like autocross), then I consider myself wealthy.
Its all perspective.
Regardless of what dollar figure constitutes middle class, child care, tuition, and health care costs have risen in some cases triple digit percentages in our lifetimes. Meanwhile, wages have remained more or less the same in many cases.
Apart from being lucky and not having any student debt, the best financial decisions I've made so far were to buy a home as early as I could and rent most of it out to roommates to pay the mortgage as well as not have any children. Now that I'm in my 40s, those decisions made in my 20s have served me well.
Toyman and Culberson get it. There's a difference between "being rich" and "being wealthy." One of the best financial books I've read is The Thin Green Line by Paul Sullivan:
I realized it's how I've always lived my life, and I'm appreciating that today. I gave a copy to my son.
Armitage said:Regardless of what dollar figure constitutes middle class, child care, tuition, and health care costs have risen in some cases triple digit percentages in our lifetimes. Meanwhile, wages have remained more or less the same in many cases.
Apart from being lucky and not having any student debt, the best financial decisions I've made so far were to buy a home as early as I could and rent most of it out to roommates to pay the mortgage as well as not have any children. Now that I'm in my 40s, those decisions made in my 20s have served me well.
We are following the path other nations did as they declined. Investing more and more in the military while failing to ensure the real wealth of the nation receives a fair share of it’s wealth.
Your decision to own appreciating property ( real estate ) early is not only serving you well it’s also putting you in the best position tax obligation wise.
Once you are in a position where you can invest in rental property and take advantage of those tax benefits you are on one of the very few escalators available to rise out of the middle class.
dculberson said:In reply to frenchyd :
They also say “fortune favors the prepared.” No prep, no fortune.
Too many ( IMHO) believe a significant bundle of cash is the best way to deal with adversity. History has proven that not to be the case.
Attitude and aptitude is likely the best real defense. Remember not all trials can be solved financially.
In reply to frenchyd :
Give me a break. A bundle of cash and the right attitude will get out farther. Attitude doesn’t pay the bills. You also won’t get that bundle of cash without the right attitude.
Is your suggestion to just spend everything you earn and if you have “aptitude” that everything will work out?? It sure seems to be, based on your comments in every thread like this.
Keeping in mind, of course, by “cash” I mean “income producing investments” be they stocks, bonds, real estate, etc. cash is not good in actual cash.
Spoolpigeon said:Meh, I don’t worry too much about where I stand compared to the rest of the world. As long as I can pay my bills without getting behind, and still have enough left over to enjoy other things (like autocross), then I consider myself wealthy.
Its all perspective.
Best post in thread!
Even though I'm squarely upper class, I live a middle class lifestyle. It's how I was born and how I've always lived. It's just comfortable. I do travel a fair amount but since my job is travel based, my personal travel is usually pretty cheap with the use of miles, car credits, etc. Because of that I've been able to build up a nice reserve. Maybe I'll be lucky enough to retire a few years early because of it.
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