My theory: the lack of V-8 RWD cars drove people, needing to get their man on, to trucks. A healthy roar of a engine and perceived speed helped sell millions. The big three caught on to this and started offering options up the wazoo. Now you pay an arm and a leg just to be able to have a warranty and be able to haul crap.
I could be wrong.
Appleseed wrote: My theory: the lack of V-8 RWD cars drove people, needing to get their man on, to trucks. A healthy roar of a engine and perceived speed helped sell millions. The big three caught on to this and started offering options up the wazoo. Now you pay an arm and a leg just to be able to have a warranty and be able to haul crap. I could be wrong.
Actually, it was your federal government and the CAFE requirements that created the truck/suv monster. What is a 4 door, 5 foot box, Ford truck with a tonneau cover other than a Crown Victoria? People buy what they want. If they have to buy a truck instead of a car to get a full framed rear drive V8 powered vehicle, thats what they do.
Streetwiseguy wrote:Appleseed wrote: My theory: the lack of V-8 RWD cars drove people, needing to get their man on, to trucks. A healthy roar of a engine and perceived speed helped sell millions. The big three caught on to this and started offering options up the wazoo. Now you pay an arm and a leg just to be able to have a warranty and be able to haul crap. I could be wrong.Actually, it was your federal government and the CAFE requirements that created the truck/suv monster. What is a 4 door, 5 foot box, Ford truck with a tonneau cover other than a Crown Victoria? People buy what they want. If they have to buy a truck instead of a car to get a full framed rear drive V8 powered vehicle, thats what they do.
yeah, but Ford has had an actual Crown Victoria up until very recently.. i think most people buy trucks because they feel somehow emasculated by modern society- the same reason bacon memes are so prevalant online and why Hardees is always bragging up their latest 2000 calorie creations- which the automakers don't mind because it allows them to get by with easier CAFE and crash standards to go along with the higher profit margins trucks bring.
wearymicrobe wrote: why in the world would you pay 22-25K for a new stripper when you can pay 1/4 that pre scratched/dented one.
If I was buying a stripper It would have to be new. Old ones usually smell funny and the glitter keeps falling off.
The work trucks are still out there but they can be hard to find. I need a truck for work and buy nothing but stripped models. I have an 06 GMC work truck with vinyl floors and a 5 speed. In 06 it cost me 16k and it is a 4x4. My new truck is an 11 Ford Ranger with vinyl floors and a 5 speed 2wd and cost 14k. When I looked it did not appear you could get a full size non diesel stripper truck with a manual and only Ford and Toyota had small base model standard cab manual trans trucks. If you look around you can find the work truck versions but the salesman will always want to show you a loaded truck because they cost twice as much.
Our company orders F-150 work trucks from Ford. Nowadays we do get AC, power brakes and steering and automatic trans. We used to get them with a manual, but the young engineer grads we were hiring couldn't drive a stick. The last five speed Fords were crap. We still have a couple with 4x4 and the manual trans had to be rebuilt in both.
When I was hired ~20 eyars ago we got the strippiest of strippers. No AC, a manual trans, no sound deadening and AM radio that didn't work. They were brutal and I suspect part of the source of my hearing loss.
It's really tough to find any 1/2 ton in a manual anymore, Chevy stopped making them with the last redesign.
My truck is pretty stripped, vinyl floor, manual windows, manual door locks, etc. But, it still has A/C, an auto, a knob (not lever) for 4WD engagement, so it's not like it's a penalty box. On a two door truck I don't mind manual door locks, but I will say it is a pain on a 4 door truck, especially since the back two doors can't be unlocked from the outside.
My dad had a '77 Chevy 1/2 ton that was stripped. Only options were the the folding seat and the heavier duty rear springs. Manual steering, manual brakes, 3 on the tree, straight 6, I loved that thing!
If you're thinking of installing a mechanics box or such, go to the commercial truck dealers and look at a cab and chassis.
Almost clandestine, that world. Even Toyota stills sells in it though.
When I think of a work truck, I think of something where you can lean over the side of the bed to get things in and out. Even 2wd trucks seem to be jacked way up these days.
Streetwiseguy wrote:Appleseed wrote: My theory: the lack of V-8 RWD cars drove people, needing to get their man on, to trucks. A healthy roar of a engine and perceived speed helped sell millions. The big three caught on to this and started offering options up the wazoo. Now you pay an arm and a leg just to be able to have a warranty and be able to haul crap. I could be wrong.Actually, it was your federal government and the CAFE requirements that created the truck/suv monster. What is a 4 door, 5 foot box, Ford truck with a tonneau cover other than a Crown Victoria? People buy what they want. If they have to buy a truck instead of a car to get a full framed rear drive V8 powered vehicle, thats what they do.
What kind of Crown Vic are you talking about? The trunk is big and all, but 5 foot bed big? Hellll berkeleyin' no.
The suspension on the F-150 is unable to handle a snow plow. According to Ford. Yet it can handle big loads and pull big trailers.
As I recall, 20 or so years ago, the cheapest thing on a dealer's lot was the basic full-size truck. They were cheaper than a mid-size sedan, and on a par with the cheapest small car on the lot.
Alas, those days are gone.
I bought a 07 GMC Sierra. 4.8L automatic A/C carpet Limited slip
Stickered around 21K, leftover deal $12800
Forgot to add, it is my favorite thing to drive...until the gas guage gets below 1/8 tank!
Otto Maddox wrote: When I think of a work truck, I think of something where you can lean over the side of the bed to get things in and out. Even 2wd trucks seem to be jacked way up these days.
No kidding. That has got to stop. I cannot stand it. No wonder you need a man step to get in and out, because the bed is five feet off the ground.
iceracer wrote: The suspension on the F-150 is unable to handle a snow plow. According to Ford. Yet it can handle big loads and pull big trailers.
Snowplows put some really hard stresses on the front of the truck. You're basically ramming things over and over. Much different than a sustained pull on a trailer.
tuna55 wrote:Otto Maddox wrote: When I think of a work truck, I think of something where you can lean over the side of the bed to get things in and out. Even 2wd trucks seem to be jacked way up these days.No kidding. That has got to stop. I cannot stand it. No wonder you need a man step to get in and out, because the bed is five feet off the ground.
This is by far my biggest complaint. We have 2 fairly new F150's, and both are a PAIN to get things in and out of. One is a 4wd, the other 2wd, and both are around the same height. For a real work truck, they are usless in many ways.
racerdave600 wrote:tuna55 wrote:This is by far my biggest complaint. We have 2 fairly new F150's, and both are a PAIN to get things in and out of. One is a 4wd, the other 2wd, and both are around the same height. For a real work truck, they are usless in many ways.Otto Maddox wrote: When I think of a work truck, I think of something where you can lean over the side of the bed to get things in and out. Even 2wd trucks seem to be jacked way up these days.No kidding. That has got to stop. I cannot stand it. No wonder you need a man step to get in and out, because the bed is five feet off the ground.
So true. That was the major drawback to the truck i had. At over 6' tall, I couldn't stand beside the truck and reach over to touch the floor of the bed more than 6" from the sidewall. ridiculous.
Same issue on the bed height here, my 1/2 ton Ram 4X4 is about 6" higher than my 1994 Chevy K1500 (also 1/2 ton, 4WD). I don't need the extra clearance, but it makes it much more difficult to load/unload. I bought a trailer so I could load some heavy rocks, there was no way I could lift some of them into the back of the truck.
Keith wrote:iceracer wrote: The suspension on the F-150 is unable to handle a snow plow. According to Ford. Yet it can handle big loads and pull big trailers.Snowplows put some really hard stresses on the front of the truck. You're basically ramming things over and over. Much different than a sustained pull on a trailer.
In most cases it is the frames that can't handle it. I have seen numerous 1/2 tons that "crab" down the road because they have had plows on them. Wanna plow? - get a 2500 or a 3500.
Part of the problem is body lines. As the body lines went up on cars, so did trucks and unfortunately it affected the bed height.
I saw someone mention earlier a $36k 2500 Series GMC with a Diesel. Why? A work truck is going to have the E36 M3 beat out of it in it's lifetime. Why pay so much? A good work truck shouldn't cost over $25k in stock form. I'm talking V8 2WD 3/4 ton truck. Add 4WD and a diesel, it shouldn't go over $30k. I still don't understand why they have to add $8k to the price for a diesel engine. $2k? A little more understandable, but not almost $10k.
You'll have to ask Them. It's pretty clear around here that most people are willing to pay the premium, both new and used. You get a lot more than a different engine with that upgrade - you get a stronger trans with the option of a stick instead of an auto, stronger rear end and more towing gear. The truck under discussion was a Dodge, not a GMC. Different engine. I don't know what the price for a non-Cummins is.
Of course, we're talking about MSRP. If you can't find a 1/2 ton that's $5000 off list, you're not trying. The 3/4 ton diesels don't get the same discounts - again, that's probably a reflection of our local market, which has a lot of ranchers and oil field workers.
As for the bed height, I think it's partly a function thing. You can put more in a truck with higher bed sides. When Toyota did a mid-model refresh on the Tundra in 2003 or so, one of the things they did was raise the sides of the bed. I've used both for hauling race car stuff, and the higher one's better. Yes, it's a hassle to reach over the sides, but I use the tailgate most of the time anyhow. As pointed out, a lot of work trucks go with a cab and chassis and drop either a custom storage box or a flatbed on the back.
dj06482 wrote: Same issue on the bed height here, my 1/2 ton Ram 4X4 is about 6" higher than my 1994 Chevy K1500 (also 1/2 ton, 4WD). I don't need the extra clearance, but it makes it much more difficult to load/unload. I bought a trailer so I could load some heavy rocks, there was no way I could lift some of them into the back of the truck.
The worst part is that there really isn't any extra clearance!!!
In reply to Keith:
Ahh yes I forgot about the extra crap needed to Work with the diesel.
There still needs to be a small displacement diesel for tue 1/2 ton trucks.
Agreed, if Cummins would knock two cylinders off the end of that big inline six it would be great for half-tons.
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