carczar_84 said:
Okay, so back to general virus questions. Myself, the wife, sister-in-law and husband have a vacation to Thailand scheduled for mid-march. I've been following the news here, and what I can find from there online, and the tracking data. I keep going back and forth on being worried about the trip. Anyone have any general thoughts on this?
We will be traveling to the northern parts of the country (very small town near the Loas border region to visit her extended family), Chiang Rai, Chiang Mai, Krabi and back to Bangkok. I figure there is some general risk, but considering the reports are now saying it will hit the states soon, are we really putting ourselves at a greater risk? The tourist numbers there are and will be significantly down and we are healthy and in our 30's.
The only problem that I see about any travel out of the country is that the country you are visiting can be put on the "no fly" list and you could be stuck in a 14 day quarantine ,
Look at Korea , not "no fly" yet but it could be soon and then you are screwed.....
not sure if you only transfer at an airport if that counts as visiting a country ( probably does ) and your flight probably is not direct ,
As far as getting the virus......probably not
californiamilleghia said:
Look at Korea , not "no fly" yet but it could be soon and then you are screwed.....
Listening to someone talking at work who has relatives in Korea, he says that the cities are essentially in self lockdown (I am assuming it's self-lockdown), very little going on in the streets, which actually might be good thing travel wise. That's just hearsay of course.
californiamilleghia said:
The only problem that I see about any travel out of the country is that the country you are visiting can be put on the "no fly" list and you could be stuck in a 14 day quarantine ,
Look at Korea , not "no fly" yet but it could be soon and then you are screwed.....
not sure if you only transfer at an airport if that counts as visiting a country ( probably does ) and your flight probably is not direct ,
As far as getting the virus......probably not
Where is this "coronavirus no fly list" at? I'm going through Beijing's airport to go to Tokyo and the US embassy in China said that's still fine.
crankwalk said:
Where is this "coronavirus no fly list" at? I'm going through Beijing's airport to go to Tokyo and the US embassy in China said that's still fine.
It's a rolling-issue list that can be instituted in a moment. What's no-fly could be lifted an hour from now, and what's currently on the fly list could be no-fly within an hour.
Which makes business travel super-easy to plan for, let me tell you. 
(I’m supposed to be going to Japan in 3 weeks)
crankwalk said:
californiamilleghia said:
The only problem that I see about any travel out of the country is that the country you are visiting can be put on the "no fly" list and you could be stuck in a 14 day quarantine ,
Look at Korea , not "no fly" yet but it could be soon and then you are screwed.....
not sure if you only transfer at an airport if that counts as visiting a country ( probably does ) and your flight probably is not direct ,
As far as getting the virus......probably not
Where is this "coronavirus no fly list" at? I'm going through Beijing's airport to go to Tokyo and the US embassy in China said that's still fine.
As said below its a moving target ,
But I think I read that Delta Airlines was going to cancel flights to Korea , so part of the "no fly" is if no airlines will fly there !
We will be flying in and out of Bangkok w/ a layover in Taipei. So far there aren't any flight restrictions through there yet, but we are playing it day by day at this point.
Pete Gossett said:
In reply to Dr. Hess :
About the "no known medicines to treat the coronavirus", what about the statements from last month that it responded to HIV medications? I never saw any reports stating they didn't work.
Virii are a biatch to treat. There are a few drugs that attack certain virus specific pathways, but the best you can do is more or less put them on hold, like the HIV drugs given to HIV patients. It will delay their eventual death from the disease, but that's it. No cure. Your body has to beat a virus infection by itself by generating antibodies and killing any cell with the virus, and beating HIV just doesn't happen. Now the Mexican Beer Virus, some have reported that some HIV drugs are helping. It's a different type of virus than HIV, and I don't know what specific pathway it is using and what the drugs are stopping. However, This Article says Mexican Beer Virus is using HIV cell entry points and that the anti-HIV drugs are helping block Mexican Beer Virus from entering other cells, thus stopping it's expansion while the body kills off anything with the virus in it. It seems there are no clinical tests on this.
carczar_84 said:
We will be flying in and out of Bangkok w/ a layover in Taipei. So far there aren't any flight restrictions through there yet, but we are playing it day by day at this point.
Hot airline reservation clerk looks at my travel itinerary and says “Bangkok Sir”…yes please.
Gingerbeardman said:
crankwalk said:
Where is this "coronavirus no fly list" at? I'm going through Beijing's airport to go to Tokyo and the US embassy in China said that's still fine.
It's a rolling-issue list that can be instituted in a moment. What's no-fly could be lifted an hour from now, and what's currently on the fly list could be no-fly within an hour.
But where is it located? By each airline or is there a centralized place to check?
Is the no fly thing listed at the State Department website, maybe CDC? Try this link
Travel Advisory Link
The company I work for just put a ban on all air travel. Domestic or international.
A DOG has tested with low levels of the virus.... (more testing needed)
https://time.com/5792150/coronavirus-dog/
UC Davis has a Mexican beer virus victim in their ICU, few dozen staff exposed and on a 2 week sabattical
I'm seeing a report of a 3% false negative rate for the Mexican Beer Flu test. So, for every 100 people WITH THE VIRUS, 3 will show up as "nope, you're good to go." Another report is saying that the true positive rate for the gene sequencing test is 30-60% on the first test given, so a false negative or false positive rate of 40-70%. Or, for every 100 people tested that actually do have the virus, somewhere between 30 and 60 and told "nope, you're good to go, pick up some bat soup on the way home," or put in isolation with other real Beer Flue cases where they'll be sure to actually get it this time, on top of whatever else they have that brought them to get tested. The radiologists, of course, claim that if you just scan everyone's chest as they walk in the door, that's the best way to be sure. They probably get like $35 to look at that scan. There is also some suggestion of just keep giving patients the genetic test until they come up positive.
Actual numbers for the test(s) being used seem to be, ahh, rather difficult to find. I did find one journal site that had a PDF they wanted to sell me for $40 that seemed to maybe have some sensitivity and specificity numbers. Don't think it's worth $40 to me. An article on Nature.com went to great lengths to explain that there are lots of tests and they have sensitivity and specificity and false positives and false negatives, then failed to actually give any real numbers of useful information at all.
Toebra
Dork
2/28/20 10:06 a.m.
My understanding is the test is 70% accurate. Certainly not all the false negatives are infected, but some probably are.
carczar_84 said:
Okay, so back to general virus questions. Myself, the wife, sister-in-law and husband have a vacation to Thailand scheduled for mid-march. I've been following the news here, and what I can find from there online, and the tracking data. I keep going back and forth on being worried about the trip. Anyone have any general thoughts on this?
We will be traveling to the northern parts of the country (very small town near the Loas border region to visit her extended family), Chiang Rai, Chiang Mai, Krabi and back to Bangkok. I figure there is some general risk, but considering the reports are now saying it will hit the states soon, are we really putting ourselves at a greater risk? The tourist numbers there are and will be significantly down and we are healthy and in our 30's.
I posted this in the "Panic" thread, I'll post it here since it relates to your question. My cousin just spent 2-weeks in Thailand from China, and has just returned to his apartment (in Chengdu).
“Things are looking a little bit grim but could be worse. It looks like I will be on a mandatory 14-day quarantine in my apartment. Potentially can’t even go downstairs or leave the flat. Unfortunately, without a piece of paper from the government official associated with my complex stating that I have finished the quarantine, I can’t return to work. Potentially have to order all food online and call the guards to deliver it to my door. Here we go! Only 336 hours left! At least I’m not sick.”
I would expect something similar, were you to visit. Masks, temperature checks, and probably a 2-week quarantine when you got back. Honestly, I think it'd be a big unnecessary risk. Even if it is a small village that you're visiting, you'll be flying through big cities with lots of other people from lots of other places.
My cousin took the vacation to Thailand just to get out of his apartment (due to the local self lockdown, most all the stores, restaurants and bars are closed). I'm sure he's not the only one from that area looking to stretch their legs somewhere else...
I want to travel to china now to get a mandatory 2 week vacation from work.
Ask Dr. Google: Last night I drank 8 Corona Beers, and now my head hurts, I have nausea, vomiting, blurry vision, I'm dehydrated... I think I have Coronavirus. If I only drank 7 Corona Beers, would I still get the virus?
Looks like there is a death in king county Washington.
From a CME on Medscape:
Myth: Drinking bleach keeps the virus away.
Fact: Recently, bleach-like products have appeared on the market touting to be remedies for treating various conditions, including autism, cancer, HIV/AIDS, hepatitis, and flu. One such product is Miracle Mineral Solution. The product solution, when mixed, develops into a dangerous bleach, which has caused serious and potentially life-threatening adverse effects. The FDA has issued warnings after receiving reports of people experiencing severe vomiting, severe diarrhea, life-threatening low blood pressure as a result of dehydration, and acute liver failure associated with drinking these products.[14]
The FDA Acting Commissioner Ned Sharpless, MD, released a statement in August 2019 denouncing these products, stating, "... Miracle Mineral Solution and similar products are not FDA-approved, and ingesting these products is the same as drinking bleach. Consumers should not use these products, and parents should not give these products to their children for any reason."[14]
He further stated, "The FDA will continue to track those selling this dangerous product and take appropriate enforcement actions against those who attempt to evade FDA regulations and market unapproved and potentially dangerous products to the American public. Our top priority is to protect the public from products that place their health at risk, and we will send a strong and clear message that these products have the potential to cause serious harm."[14]
From what we know concerning the COVID-19 virus, it is spread mainly from person to person, within about 6 feet, according to the CDC.[8] It is spread through respiratory droplets produced when an infected person coughs or sneezes.[11] These droplets can then land in the mouths or noses of people who are nearby, with possible inhalation into the lungs.[11] For prevention, the CDC recommends daily preventive actions such as avoiding close contact with people who are sick; avoiding touching the eyes, nose and mouth; staying home when sick so as not to infect others; covering up cough or sneeze; appropriately disposing of infective tissue; cleaning and disinfecting objects and surfaces daily; wearing a face mask for persons who show symptoms of COVD-19; as well as washing hands with soap and water for at least 20 seconds (or using an alcohol-based hand sanitizer with at least 60% alcohol).[15]
Myth: Coronavirus is transmitted from packages mailed from China.
Fact: There are no confirmed reports of this, and it is highly unlikely, according to the CDC because of the fact that the COVID-19 virus is spread through respiratory droplets. [11] They responded to this concern by stating on their website that currently no evidence supports transmission of COVID-19 through imported goods. In addition, there have not been any cases of COVID-19 in the United States associated with imported goods.
As healthcare professionals, using reliable and trusted sources (such as the CDC and WHO websites) is essential in providing the most updated information about virus outbreaks to alleviate patient fears and community concerns.
People would drink bleach? Man. Well, there's Goop, right?
Indy-Guy said:
Proof is surfacing that the Chinese government Knew of the virus and ordered a cover up to suppress information and delay effectiveness of a containment.
That's not surprising at all; heck, im more surprised it took this long to be found out.
Dr. Hess said:
People would drink bleach? Man. Well, there's Goop, right?
In reply to GIRTHQUAKE :
I think everybody, even the Chinese, just sort of assumed that.
