Bluej and I were talking about this and it seems like a reasonable time to open that discussion to a larger group. For those who don't feel comfortable traveling to Florida this year, or who simply can't, or in the nightmare scenario of the real challenge being canceled, would anyone care to attempt a remote, distributed version?
I volunteer to organize the northeast/mid-atlantic portion if so, as well as document it to share with the rest of the forum. Here's what I'm thinking:
Drags: A video (in car or external) and a timeslip photo. This can be done at any test and tune event, but maybe we would try to designate a certain track that a small group could attend in each region so that first timers aren't all alone. I volunteer Island Dragway in NJ for my region.
Concours: Photos and a description, or maybe a walkaround video. For the physical, regional aspect, we could have a little meetup in a parking lot somewhere before the drags, but the intent would be to have judging online with a single group of judges to keep things equalized.
Autocross: This seems nearly impossible to equalize across all regions, so hard pitch but... drop it. We didn't have drags a couple years ago, maybe we don't have autocross for this.
Scheduling: Maybe we stagger these, so that the 5 people in a given area do their thing while others look on through the internet with amazement, then the next weekend it's a different region we're watching? Or not, maybe we all do it one weekend in a million places.
Who likes this concept? Who hates it? Who has a brilliant idea that will make it way better? Who would organize for their region?
I like the idea of a group autox in local areas, but for those that can't do a local autox, maybe opt out like the concourse allows?
In reply to Mr_Asa :
Sure but how do you then equalize the times across regions? PAX finishing position? Bogey car? We can probably assume a stock Miata will show up at any given autocross, maybe %faster or slower than stock Miata? I want to be able to score all of the cars together at the end, ideally- I know there are variations in drag conditions too, but not nearly as many there are in autocross course layouts.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:
In reply to Mr_Asa :
Sure but how do you then equalize the times across regions? PAX finishing position? Bogey car? We can probably assume a stock Miata will show up at any given autocross, maybe %faster or slower than stock Miata? I want to be able to score all of the cars together at the end, ideally- I know there are variations in drag conditions too, but not nearly as many there are in autocross course layouts.
OK, so I will go to each region and set an auto-x time in the same car. Fixed. I will need to source some good will with the wife to make this happen.
Not sure, definitely needs to be workshopped. I do like the stock Miata idea, but the driver can make a big difference.
In reply to bobzilla :
Have your skills plateaued such that you won't be significantly faster by the last of 8 consecutive weekends of autocross? 
In reply to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ :
Pretty much I hit my peak my 3rd run at my first event. I've been equally sucky since.
Seriously, you should have seen my challenge auto-x times. 5 runs and they were all within a second of each other. I need to find that pic...
edit dos:
Will my BBC Jaaaaag be elligible? :)
Tom Suddard
Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
7/13/20 3:56 p.m.
To clarify, the $2000 Challenge is still scheduled to run in Gainesville as usual. You can see details, including COVID policies, here:
https://2000challenge.com
FWIW, years ago I autocrossed in Ontario. There was no centralized national autocross championship location back then (1980s and 90s). It was done by setting the same course in multiple locations across the country. Of course , there was no way to equalize times from the various venues which had different surfaces and differing weather on the day. Class champions were based on fastest time, independent of any other factors. While not ideal, it was better than no championship at all.
bobzilla said:
Stefan (Forum Supporter) said:
Will my BBC Jaaaaag be elligible? :)
No. Get out.
What if it was a Kia with a BBC?
DeadSkunk (Warren) said:
FWIW, years ago I autocrossed in Ontario. There was no centralized national autocross championship location back then (1980s and 90s). It was done by setting the same course in multiple locations across the country. Of course , there was no way to equalize times from the various venues which had different surfaces and differing weather on the day. Class champions were based on fastest time, independent of any other factors. While not ideal, it was better than no championship at all.
This would probably be the way to do it, but it takes this from something a bunch of people can do with very little oversight required to something that requires lot rentals, insurance, and a bunch of coordination. I'm not sure I could pull it off here, and then we'd be rolling the dice on other regions being able to do it too.
Tom Suddard said:
To clarify, the $2000 Challenge is still scheduled to run in Gainesville as usual. You can see details, including COVID policies, here:
https://2000challenge.com
I can add this to the first post if you want- I just thought it wouldn't be a bad idea to talk about options. Everyone's situation is different, and the way 2020 has been going Gainesville could be teleported to another dimension by October or be overrun with mole people or some E36 M3 before then.
In reply to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ :
While it certainly wouldn't be equal, if you're going to attempt to include autox here are my thoughts.
Every club/region/whatever has a mix of fast & slow car-driver matchups. However some clubs definitely have more faster cars/drivers than others, so I don't think finishing position(whether PAX or raw) is the best metric.
I think either using the time difference from the raw time from the fastest finishing car may be slightly more equalizing across Challenge competitors.
For example, yesterday my best time was 50.444. That was 5.672 seconds back from FTD at 44.772. So something like this:
- Use the reciprocal of the difference between my time, and FTD, times 10(just to make it a whole number) rounded to 3 decimal points. So for my time yesterday it would be (1/5.762) x 10 or 1.7355 points.
- For comparison, let's say I finished 2.5sec behind FTD. In that case the math above would work out to be 4-points.
- If a competitor was only .001 off FTD, their score would be 10,000 points
- If a competitor happens to get FTD we could give them 10,001 points.
Then we'd just rank them based on "Challenge" finishing position & assign the dynamic time, as is currently done.
Instead of timed autocross, how about a "style" contest? We can go to an event, find a parking lot, or even set up a cone course in our backyard. Hustle your car around the cones and take a video. Whoever's car "looks" the fastest wins.
slowbird said:
Instead of timed autocross, how about a "style" contest? We can go to an event, find a parking lot, or even set up a cone course in our backyard. Hustle your car around the cones and take a video. Whoever's car "looks" the fastest wins.
Drift challenge! I'm so in for that.
Also, I wanted to reiterate that before posting, Chris and I seriously discussed how long to wait before bringing this up since we didn't like the idea of pulling people from the official challenge. The goal is to have a backup plan for those who already know they can't go, and for it to be ready for anyone who has to make that decision last minute. Low key is mandatory
Tom Suddard
Director of Marketing & Digital Assets
7/14/20 9:13 a.m.
Yeah, I think now is too soon to discuss. We're still months away from knowing what the situation will be in October, so for now let's hope for the best and plan on a fun time in Gainesville. We've got contingency plans and have planned out a few different scenarios, and will make sure everybody gets to experience the $2000 Challenge in one form or another. Right now, that means holding the event.
i've been injecting ultraviolet light for a couple months now, so by October i'm gonna be good for just about anything. ;-)
Tom Suddard said:
Yeah, I think now is too soon to discuss. We're still months away from knowing what the situation will be in October, so for now let's hope for the best and plan on a fun time in Gainesville. We've got contingency plans and have planned out a few different scenarios, and will make sure everybody gets to experience the $2000 Challenge in one form or another. Right now, that means holding the event.
I'm glad to hear you guys have been thinking about it (contingency plans). Respectfully, please don't wait too long to share those thoughts, even if informal. The more time we all have to plan for those possible contingencies, the more likely they are to be successful, and better in general.
Lots can change between now and October. Every week we get different guidance on schools reopening (early August in FL)...so it's definitely a moving target.
It'd be tough to do, but Autocross could be a custom PAX based system. Pick a car that's popular in stock form at SCCA events and measure the difference, that should help help standardize the course-to-course variations. Stock NA or NB miata, new civic Si, VW MKVII GTI, etc. and measure the % difference.
