Ok then you are south of me. Still not to bad. So who is up in Monroe? that's where I thought you were.

Got to love home electricians, load calcs aren't usually on their mind when adding sub panels.

Welders can bugger up good plans fast in a garage. Have had people tap right into the mains to run their welders. Then wonder why the welder goes belly up instead of tripping the breaker. I just look at them and go What breaker? You've tapped in ahead of any breaker. Some are lucky and the internal breaker tripped some not so much.

Oh on the pea gravel I would say when the original home owner changed the roof was because that's what was on it. Neighbor had a low slopping roof that had a membrane then pea gravel on top of it for years. My guess is it started leaking and was cheaper to redo the roof line and use asphalt shingles.

All Framed!

Last night we had an appointment with the bank to sign the last forms - we get our money Monday!

Most all of the wall demolition you've seen in past posts was done a few minutes here, a few minutes there as time allowed. Before our appointment with the bank last night, I stupidly decided to hit it hard and get the last of the original header jacks and studs pulled out, and get the new header hung. This turned into a mad dash in the last fifteen minutes before we had to leave, but I managed to just barely get it jacked up into place before racing off to our appointment.

Header in:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Regarding the floor jacks holding up the temporary posts - The one in the foreground is from a SAAB 900, and the dark blue one was discovered in the trunk of a parts car, so I don't actually know what car it is supposed to be used on. I've always joked that it isn't really one of my projects until some SAAB parts make their way in somehow, and I'm happy to report that this project only went a week and a half before becoming legitimate.

After we got back, I pulled the braces out and cleaned up a little.

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

I need to make a nailer plate or some sort of joining plate to tie the two headers together and also tie into the finished post. I figured I'd just cut something out of some 10 or 12 gauge steel and run some bolts all the way through, sandwich style. I'd love some suggestions there, as I hope to have finished sheetrock covering all of the header and leaving the post bare. I don't think there will be an off-the-shelf option here since I've got non-standard thicknesses. The new header is 4 2x8s sistered together, and the old header is 2 3x8s with an airgap between. They both work out to be around 6-1/2" thick.

The Post

I was going to join four #1 grade VG Fir 4x4 posts together with some decorative/functional steel bands, but that worked out to be about $300 in post alone. For that kind of money, I decided to use these giant mahogany planks I've had for years. I got them from an old warehouse where they had been sitting for 40 years. I'll post more on that later.

Mezzanine wrote:

Enyar wrote: What's the deal with asbestos? From what I read it's only a major issue with long term exposure in which case I don't understand the necessity for the heavy duty clean up. I mean I wouldn't plan on rolling around in it in my birthday suit but as long as you have a mask and you're well covered.....is it really that big of a deal? Also, how wide is that cabinet to the left of the oven?

I contracted out a LOT of asbestos abatement when I worked at a paper mill. The guy I worked with (Asbestos Jimmy) had been doing it for decades, and claimed that the only people that actually get Asbestosis or Mesothelioma are smokers who have been exposed a good deal. You'll note Steve McQueen was a smoker. Mad_Ratel is spot on though - There are no half measures. If you are going to do the work above the board, you have to do EVERYTHING. I've supervised lots of abatement in the past, but never done it myself. By law, a homeowner is allowed to do their own abatement, but if they hire the work out it must be to a certified abatement contractor. I was very careful when I did the work not just for my own safety, but also that of my family. With a full enclosure you can control all the 'stos. Important to note that the paper backing on the vinyl that contained asbestos is barely friable - it serves no danger unless you disturb it, and then when you do it creates very little dust. Almost none. I am super confident in the work I did - Asbestos Jimmy would be proud.

What mill? (I work for a certain engineering company that does a LOT of work in the industry. We used to build new plants back when people did such things. Just worked on a GP plant in Alabama.)

In reply to Mad_Ratel: Formerly Simpson Tacoma Kraft, now WestRock Tacoma.

I currently work for the company that bought all of Simpson's lumber mills, Interfor.

What company do you work for? I was in power and recovery and also the paper machines for a number of years.

In reply to brad131a4:

Sorry for the confusion - Canyon Creek cabinet company is in Monroe.

Regarding the pea gravel, I thought about the roofing option, but there is no way - the roof has at least 6/12 pitch!

Mezzanine wrote: In reply to Mad_Ratel: Formerly Simpson Tacoma Kraft, now WestRock Tacoma. I currently work for the company that bought all of Simpson's lumber mills, Interfor. What company do you work for? I was in power and recovery and also the paper machines for a number of years.

We do work for the New WestRock conglomerate. (though with the merger it's taking them some time.) I work for Jacobs Engineering (formerly Sirrine or JE Sirrine.) as a Piping Engineer.

The Post, Episode II

So I have to support the point where the two headers meet, seen here:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Plating

Any suggestions on how to plate this area? I see two options:

• a tee-shaped plate on each side of the joint. The top leg of the tee spans between the headers and is bolted or nailed, with the leg of the tee extending down the new post and also bolted or nailed.

• a nailer plate on each side of the headers, joining the two headers together, with a separate horizontal plate under the headers that would be nailed/lag-bolted up to the headers, and would also have a vertical section that would be sandwiched by the two sistered planks.

The first option is easiest to make and bolt up, but the most difficult to sheet rock around. The second requires heavier plate for the connection piece on the underside, but makes sheet rock super easy and would look good.

Thoughts?

The Post

As I said in my last update, I am going to use some fancy mahogany planks I've been storing for years. I dug them out of the shop yesterday and managed to drag them to the back deck where I've set up temporary carpentry shop. One plank is just under 8' long; the other is 11' long. Both are ridiculously heavy - I'm talking hundreds of pounds. This stuff is seriously hard and dense. They were milled at least 50 years ago based on what history I can place with the mill; they've used that time to get hard as a rock.

Here are the planks in the temporary carpentry shop:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

I took a belt sander to one of the planks where I would likely have to cut to see what the wood looked like under a half century of grime, and I was stunned to find this warm orange/red tone.

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

I'm unsure how we'd like to see it finished. I want to leave it a little rough, since all the planks are very rough sawn. So I sanded a whole section down leaving a bit of the saw marks with 32 grit on the belt sander. Then I did a section of that with 80, and a part of that 80 with 150. Masked it all off so I have three finish grades to test with. I'll try some tung oil, maybe some boiled linseed, a varnish or two, and perhaps some stain. Totally open to suggestions here. Here you can see that I took the 32 grit to one whole side of a plank, with the finish test grid on the plank in the background.

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

The discolored spot in the above photo is where I hosed down a section with some acetone to see what it would look like wet. Here is a photo of just that, in another area:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

LOOK AT THAT GRAIN! This wood is spectacular, and I'm certain that it is totally wasted in this application... but it is time to put it to work. I've tried selling the planks in the past without success, so I'm excited to give it a home now.

I see about the disposal, makes sense. Our house was built in 1980 and everything I've read says I missed the asbestos train but reading about it makes me want to get it tested anyway. From what I read asbestos was phased out in the mid 70s but online it said everything older than 79 should be tested to be safe. We're doing lots of work in the attic (cellulose type insulation) and drywall (pop corn ceiling).

Mezzanine wrote:

Enyar wrote: Also, how wide is that cabinet to the left of the oven?

Good question - it is a 15" wide box, and I will be doing a waterfall edge with the countertop on the exposed face. I was worried that it was a small box standing all by itself, so the waterfall edge will help give it some mass. Especially since I'm planning on doing 2" thick concrete for the tops. 15" wide to the left of the oven will still make for some useful space to set pans while cooking.

Sounds nice. The interwebs says 15" is the recommended minimum. We can't fit anything larger than 12". I think I'll follow your lead and start a build thread about our house to get GRM's input.

In reply to Enyar: Please do test- asbestos was used in flooring all the way to the 90s, and it is still legal for manufacture of new goods if I recall correctly. Our house has some popcorn ceiling, and it tested positive as well.

Cool project. Would it look awful to leave a steel "post to beam" bracket exposed? Otherwise, can you pad out the sheetrock (or plow out a slight recess in the edges) to hide a light gage connector?

Maybe some variation of Simpson's CBTZ concealed connector is suitable if you want to hide a steel connector inside that beautiful mahogany.

Mezzanine wrote: In reply to Enyar: Please do test- asbestos was used in flooring all the way to the 90s, and it is still legal for manufacture of new goods if I recall correctly. Our house has some popcorn ceiling, and it tested positive as well.

We have new carpeting throughout and we're not touching that yet but I'll test the drywall. Hopefully the test comes out well because we've already scraped the ceiling in the bathroom and did some nasty work in the attic, though we were wearing face masks for both jobs.

Any recommendation for a lab?

Man, that mahogany is amazing! How in the world...?

For the header, I like the second option. It seems sturdy enough, and would be easier to work with when it comes time to 'rock it

Speaking of which: I live close by and I can lift heavy things. If you're in danger of butting up against a deadline, don't hesitate to tag me in

(and you know I'm watching this to get ideas for my own kitchen, right?)

In reply to Enyar:

There is a much smaller chance of Asbestos in the mud and tape used on your drywall, but worth testing if you've suspicions.

For labs, I'd encourage you to find one local to you - most every major city area has one close, and it saves you the trouble and wait time of mailing. There may be special requirements for mailing the stuff; I'm not sure because I planned on hand delivering all along. I used Asbestos NW out of Federal Way WA. Easy to work with, and an email response within 2 hours of dropping off. They must have had a slow day, because results are usually more like 24 hours.

The Post, Episode III

I got some sample finishes laid down yesterday. I used Tung oil, Teak oil, semi-gloss polyurethane clear, and then a stain called "gunstock" and ran the three above finishes over stained sections. Here they are wet, laid out in a grid with the three different levels of surface prep:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Note that the stained sections above don't have the oil/poly coat yet as the stain had to dry. Here they are after top coats with oil/poly, all dry:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Close up:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

It's hard to get a photo that shows all the samples in equal light, but there really isn't much difference from one to the next. I think the Teak oil has the best color, and I like oiled wood more than poly, especially if I am going to leave it a tiny bit rough and still showing some of the rough saw marks. Poly still has too much gloss, and if we leave the wood rough at all, that just makes it look poorly finished. The "Gunstock" stain was not the right choice, because it is basically the same color as the natural wood in this case. It deepened the color a tiny bit, but not by much. We'll see what my lovely wife chooses.

On that subject: SWMBO has joined the forum! I think she signed up as "Meems", but was having some issues getting logged in. I may have to ask for moderator support.

In reply to Hungary Bill:

And tag you in, I shall! I think cabinet day will be when I call in help, if only to reduce the amount of downtime between functioning kitchens. Also countertop day, since concrete slabs weigh lots.

We're ordering cabinets and flooring this week, so I've got lots to do. I'll put down flooring before cabinets, but after I get most of my drywall done.

In reply to Mezzanine:

I'm surprised no luthiers jumped at the chance to buy that mahogany!

If you had enough Mahogany, I would cut some thin planks (1/2") to face the header with and leave it exposed and use the "T" and thru bolt method to join the post and the header.

In reply to petegossett & Hal:

Yeah, I never got any bites when I posted it. Luthier might have been a good keyword to use!

Hal, not sure I have enough material to veneer the headers, but that is a great idea!

Cabinet Shopping

Yesterday was a big day in our cabinet selection process. Picking the cabinets we'll be looking at and using for years to come is a big decision, and a big investment. I've been pretty apprehensive about making the right choice, and I think we've got it nailed down now.

I posted some quotes from Ikea and Canyon Creek earlier - I think we're going to be using a combination of both to get the look we want.

Choosing doors at Ikea

Buying cabinets without seeing them in person is not the way to go. We chose a number of styles we really liked online and then went to see them in person only to find out we didn't like them in person. For example, when we went to Ikea and looked at their offerings, the only doors we liked happened to be their most expensive line (Ringhult) seen here:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

The dark gray shown above looked terrible online, but in person it is much lighter and reflects light nicely. This is a terrible photo, but we really liked this style:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

We wanted to do something that would look somewhat modern, and these horizontal upper cabinets really stood out to us as a custom option that really appealed. The uppers are white high gloss Ringhult.

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Choosing doors at Canyon Creek

We liked the custom sizes and better space utilization of the Canyon Creek much more, so we looked at getting the same white or grey high gloss from them...only to find out it was cost prohibitive. We'd seen a single door sample of a textured laminate in a grey color called Driftwood. I was nervous about placing our order without seeing an example kitchen first...

So yesterday my wife and I drove North for 1.5 hours to get to the Canyon Creek showroom to see what our consolation choice looked like in person. The Driftwood doors shown as the upper cabinets here:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

We're thinking about using these as all our lower cabinets, as well as a tall pantry pull-out to the right of the fridge and the box over the fridge. We would then get IKEA white cabinets for the rest of the upper boxes. The island is a wild card right now. We might make it the IKEA white too, to tie the island to the upper cabinets.

It was fun to be able to see some of the cabinets we have specified. Here is the pull out pantry cabinet we'll have (shown here in the wrong color and style of door):

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

A pull out garbage can:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Squint your eyes really hard and you can visualize the white overhead and the driftwood lower cabinets:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

Cabinet shopping makes you a little crazy.

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

I may have scored a second hand dishwasher with a panel front, so as soon as I have that in hand and can get dimensions, I will place our cabinet order. I'm a bit scared.

My only serious suggestion is if this is a "finish the kitchen for resale later" kind of build. If it is, do not go with anything wild like the driftwood... It'll turn off too many buyers. Something plain may be boring but gives you the widest range of buyers. White kitchens are in right now, but white wood painted with trim paint. Not so sure on the high gloss ikea cabs. I'm also a huge traditionalist so I prefer wood grain in my kitchen...

note: not an interior designer.

edit: this pic you posted is the style that's "in" for the next decade or so.

Are you doubling the post together? If so you could make your own bracket that would tie the upper beams together and have a tongue that the support beam slides over.

Wish I knew how to set up a cad or drafting type software as I could send a picture of it. I've seen what I'm trying to explain done in a few building I've worked on. They wanted to have the wood exposed but not see any of the brackets to hold it together.

Also do you get down to the Shelton site. Most of my wife's family live down and around that area. I have a rental house in downtown Shelton. So I do get down there from time to time.

Well nice had to come back and add my .02 on the cabinets. I'm with rattoi blah blah sorry forgot how it was spelled. Try to keep it more on the traditional side if you are even remotely thinking of selling down the road.

We used Ikea cabinets in a Craftman style house we bought in West Seattle. They actually fit right in with the built in wall shelves. Plus they actually work very well with all the little baskets and pull out shelves you can install in them.

On cost the doors are the one area that I would splurge and pay the extra cost for. They take the most beating out of anything other than the floor. So you want to get the best finish you can so that they look good ten years from now.

Just be careful with mixing different style looks in the style of house you have. It's not easy to do and look like it goes together.

brad131a4 wrote: Are you doubling the post together? If so you could make your own bracket that would tie the upper beams together and have a tongue that the support beam slides over. Wish I knew how to set up a cad or drafting type software as I could send a picture of it. I've seen what I'm trying to explain done in a few building I've worked on. They wanted to have the wood exposed but not see any of the brackets to hold it together. Also do you get down to the Shelton site. Most of my wife's family live down and around that area. I have a rental house in downtown Shelton. So I do get down there from time to time.

What you describe with the post is likely what will be happening - I don't mind seeing the bracket on the wood, I just don't want to see it on the header as I'd like to get all that encased in sheet rock.

The Shelton mills were sold separately and went to another company - that company closed the mills down in order to raze it all for a new mill in a few years. I used to go down there regularly though! The town isn't doing well with the closure of the mills, which is really too bad. It was a cute town.

In reply to Mad_Ratel:

Neither of us like traditional wood cabinets at all... and not just because we're trying for a modern look. We're not too worried about what the kitchen style does for resale as we aren't planning on moving anytime soon. Even still, we could put in the ugliest cabinets on the market and it would STILL make this place worth more than the old kitchen will. By the time we're done with this work and some other remodels on the entry and living room of the house, there is no question that it will be in the modern/midcentury-modern style...And that will definitely attract a different sort of buyer.

Well then go for the gold and get what you want. As I do like the choice of cabinet style and colors you have chosen.

This is your face after you cut a check for $5k+ on (most) of your kitchen cabinets:

Untitled by craig richmond, on Flickr

That happened this morning as I left for the airport. My coworker pointed out that I was more apprehensive about this than I was buying a car sight unseen on the internet...I had to explain that cars come and go - your kitchen is something you're stuck with, and you can't just sell it on Craigslist.