My First Project Car - 90's Nissan 240sx or 90's Miata (or other suggestions)?

Hello! As you all could probably guess I'm new to the forum. Anyways, I feel its time I embark on my first project car. (none of what I'm about to say is set in stone I tend to ramble and "talk" a lot when writing so just bear with me). I'm not the most knowledgable in this realm, I always loved cars and how they work, etc., but my family couldn't care less about this stuff, and I never had the means of getting my hands on some clunker I could mess around with to learn. I mean, the most I've done mechanically is just some bolt-ons to my previous cars but nothing serious at all. So I was hoping to get some advice from some of you guys. I've thought endlessly about what project I can start and I think i've narrowed it down to chosing between the miata or the 240sx (I'm open to anything though). With the miata I would just build the engine (1.8L) for a forced induction setup (either supercharger or turbo idk), maybe swap out the 5 speed for a 6 speed (although I'm not sure if it would do anything from what I've heard), turbo it, switch the head to a '99 head (I hear they are better with compression? I'm not sure), roll cage, springs, etc, the whole nine yards without swaping the engine. The 240 would be a much more involved project I think, because so many people do engine swaps with that car it would be a very tempting and daunting first project. I realize I don't have to swap the engine, but I love the sound of the jz's, but I also know people say its a ton of work and may be ill suited for a first project. idk. What do you guys think? The 240 is a gorgeous car in my opinion and I wouldn't mind taking the extra time to try something more advanced, and miata would turn out to be a very fun car (I'm not really concerned about the homophobic array of insults that could come with the miata, if its fun to me its fun). What should a very beginner project be? I plan on driving both cars just to get a feel for them btw.

Thank you for anyone who can help me!

-Aaron

Hey Aaron, welcome to the madhouse. You should post some kind of hello/intro over here.

I'm a little biased here because my first car was a 240sx and I had no idea what in the hell I was doing as far as fixing/maintaining/updating things went. but that was an awesome car and I wish I had kept it around and dealt with it. If you look for a 240, look for something that's bone stock and has been maintained. It'll give you a much better starting point. Lotta people here drink the Miata kool-aid too, though. What duty will this project car see? Daily driving temporarily (or permanently), Autocross, just a fun cruiser?

You've got good plans, but keep researching what the facts and especially costs are for what you would want to get done with whichever car you get.

Again, my vote is for the 240sx though Incredible aftermarket, they feel good, and they just look good too. Plus you get a real roof (need to have item for me).

Hey Aaron,

You can't go wrong with either one, but I suggest you get used to the car before you decide what to do. I think you'll really like the 240 with 155 hp, for example. The Miata does not need boost to be fun. Also, brakes and suspension mods are usually (almost always) better bang for the buck, especially when you're first starting out.

Swapping a jz motor into a 240sx would be epic, but it would also be many moneys, very hard and it would be bad for the tossability and handling of your car. Doing all those mods to your Miata would be similar, lots of money for not much gain.

If you really want more power, a junkyard turbo on the factory engines will get you into more than enough trouble.

Having driven a couple examples of both, I'd take the Miata if I was going to do a balls out track warrior and I'd take the 240 if I wanted a fun car that I could also use daily. Stock for stock, I prefer the Nissan.

In reply to classicJackets:

The car won't be daily driven, that I know for sure. I would love to autocross it but mainly it would be a fun cruiser. What would you say a fair price for a clean, well maintained 240sx (1990-96?) would be? I've seen only one clean looking one (very clean, i was surprised) on craigslist over the past month and a half and the seller was asking $3900(USD). I was already planning on going for the maintained ones just because of the lower chance of rust in the frame (and I don't want to mess too much with the integrity of the car which means I'd wind up paying a professional to do it $$$$). And I agree with you on the roof, which is why I'd probably get a hard top if I wound up going with the miata along with a roll cage. Thank you for your response!!

In reply to DaewooOfDeath:

I agree with your logic, and you're probably right in saying I'd like the 240 with 155hp; however, this is a project car. So the main objective here is for me to learn, which means I'd want to be doing something to the engine/transmission. I know I don't have to boost the miata (or the 240) in order to have fun, but I would love to learn how forced induction systems work as well (so really I can't imagine not boosting either car).

I'm not power crazy, i'm not looking for 700+whp in a car. I wouldn't want a junkyard car either though, my goal isn't just power I would love to make whatever car I get visually appealing (to me) as well. I would like the 240 to be between 400-450whp and the miata to be about 250. I don't want to mess with the handling of the car (or tossability? just another word for handling?) because cornering and curvy roads (not too many where I am sadly) are just so much fun. Are there any swaps to the 240 what I could achieve my goal whp and not lose too much even weight distribution?

Like you said, I shouldn't decide what I'm doing before I have the car and get a feel for it but I do like planning and just getting familiar with all of my options.

Thank you for your response!

So, my name is also Aaron and I have owned a '91 240SX. Great first car to work on. Lots of room in the engine bay, parts are plentiful and cheap. Getting one that isn't ragged out or way overpriced(IMO) these days is going to be the challenge though.

I never did anything to engine in mine except for oil changes. I did do a 5 lug swap, bigger Q45 brakes and stainless lines. I didn't really think what that would do to my autocross classing though so I was relegated to XP where I was woefully outclassed. I still had fun though, and the car was really easy to control in a slide.

In reply to aaronbleop:

400 hp is a lot in a 240SX. As in, that's probably as fast as a new ZO6.

For that power you'd either have a timebomb KA24 with a turbo, a slightly less timebomb SR20DET or a V8 swap, which would probably be the cheapest, best option at that point.

If you can deal with 300 hp, then you could have a pretty reliable KA24 turbo or a rock solid SR20DET. As for junkyard turbos, they can be pretty.

That's a Holset turbo off of a Cummins. DSM guys love Holsets.

In reply to DaewooOfDeath:

I have three salvage/junkyards within a 50 mile radius of where I live. Wouldn't a junkyard car be a lot more work? Don't people strip the interior and take whatever it is they need from these cars? Also just sitting there for however long, wouldn't it almost definitely have a rust problem? I'll definitely check the junkyards out soon if you claim there are diamonds in the rough to be found but what would I be looking for while I'm there? In my head I'm imagining completely stripped cars and crushed cars etc. But I'm not sure exactly what is at these places of course.

He is referring to buying parts at a junk yard. Unless you are buying a 2J or something unavailable in the US, many parts can be had at a junk yard.

I prefer pick the part types I have here where you can pull the parts yourself and check them out. Especially when learning it is nice that if you break something, no big deal, drop the part where is and move on.

Many junkyards here are hesitant to sell full shells. It takes a lot of talking and assuring you are not buying the car to try and put it back on the road. The ones here only have cars that have already had their title "junked" with the DMV.

I owned a 240SX that I had swapped an SR in it about 10 or 12 years ago. The best mods were the Ohlins coilovers setup, the LSD, and the solid rear subframe mounts. It was a freat platform to learn on. 300 HP in a fully gutted 240SX was MORE than enough.

The only bad now is the drift tax on everything. Though it seems to be subsiding a bit recebtly with everyone in the top running V8 powered anythings, but that is a whole different topic.

Definitely faster than a Z06 as stated above. The car was pretty dang formidable on track. I used to give Porsches hell at the local PCA auto-x events all the time.

Anyone who says a modified old car is faster than a new Z06 probably hasn't tangled with one. They're FAST. My track Miata is probably pretty close, and it's a lot more of a car than anything imagined here.

Obviously, I'm biased towards the Miata. No drift tax and there's a lot of really good vendors out there who know what they're doing. It'll feel smaller, lighter and more toss able - and I suspect it's a lot quicker in an autocross environment. Plus there's the whole convertible thing if that's a factor. Homophobic comments don't happen in person, only on Internet forums and, well, idiots are idiots.

But most importantly - which do you WANT to build? Because that's what's going to provide your motivation.

Who said anything about new Z06es, save for having a bajillion HP and being extremely fast I don't know anything about them. I'm only referring to a few model years ago. The car I am referring is long since recycled into hopefully something it enjoys living as.

Hardtop, sunroof or convertible?

2-seater or 4-ish person?

Where do you live and how many months of the year are you driving this new car?

DD, auto-x on weekends, family capable?

All questions that you need to answer before deciding on which base car?

Next is a budget. How much cash-in-hand to go and buy a car? How much cash or credit card debt down the road to modify said car?

How much work can you do yourself(garage, tools, know-how)?

Ultimate goal for your new toy? Show car, fastest auto-x or light-to-light street racer in town?

I think this is the first build thread that isn't even a build thread. But I do suggest that whatever you get, learn to drive it well stock first EXPECIALLY IF YOU WANT TO AUTOCROSS. Nothing is funnier than a car with the entire performance parts catalog thrown at it that's still slower than a stock car. Driver mod is the best

HunterBenz wrote: Who said anything about new Z06es, save for having a bajillion HP and being extremely fast I don't know anything about them.

DaewooOfDeath wrote: 400 hp is a lot in a 240SX. As in, that's probably as fast as a new ZO6.

Oh, my bad. Yeah, that would be quite the 240SX to beat a new one. From what I hear they are straight monsterous.

I can tell you from experience that they were pretty tough in 2003 as well. Check out C+D's first Superfour Challenge. One run from a stock Z06 demolished the field of tuned fours.

Keith Tanner wrote:

HunterBenz wrote: Who said anything about new Z06es, save for having a bajillion HP and being extremely fast I don't know anything about them.

DaewooOfDeath wrote: 400 hp is a lot in a 240SX. As in, that's probably as fast as a new ZO6.

I should have said "similar power to weight assuming you lightened the 240 some."

aaronbleop wrote: In reply to DaewooOfDeath: I have three salvage/junkyards within a 50 mile radius of where I live. Wouldn't a junkyard car be a lot more work? Don't people strip the interior and take whatever it is they need from these cars? Also just sitting there for however long, wouldn't it almost definitely have a rust problem? I'll definitely check the junkyards out soon if you claim there are diamonds in the rough to be found but what would I be looking for while I'm there? In my head I'm imagining completely stripped cars and crushed cars etc. But I'm not sure exactly what is at these places of course.

Don't buy a car from the junkyard, buy parts from the junkyard.

If you really want a turbo, for example, junkyard deisel trucks are a good source of turbos, intercoolers, tubing and oil coolers.

This is MUCH cheaper than buying out of a catelog and will be better for learning as well.

Dissenting opinion: buying a properly engineered kit from someone with a couple of decades of experience can save you money. I've seen it many times. Forums are not necessarily full of good information and are notorious for understating difficulties and glossing over the hard parts. We've had a lot of customers admit they should have just bought a good kit in the first place.

Agreed, you may not learn as much the hard way, but learning the hard way is an expensive education.

Keith,

Are good kits easy enough someone just starting out could do them alone?

One of the reasons I recommended junkyard project is that you can still learn from failure.

A good one, sure. It should go in easily due to accurate construction and should come with enough support for a neophyte to get running and set up well.

First turbo kit I installed was done by three guys who had never done a turbo install, in a small home garage with typical tools. We started on Friday night and were test driving in Sunday. And that's not what I'd consider a good kit by current standards.

Learning from failure is so much work I prefer to learn from people smarter or more experienced than I.

240sx sr20 swap my kids sr20 powered 240 gives my 550hp C4 a good run for its money,that being said the sr20 is no closer to stock than my SB 406 both are fully prepared autocross cars

In reply to lotusseven7:

any

either

florida, a lot of straight roads sadly.

not a DD, maybe on occasion I would use it as my primary car for a day. Auto-x would be cool

budget isn't really a factor yet. This will be a rather slow project, so really I can't answer that properly. Overall, I'd say no more than 6-7k in parts, not including the car.

I'm confident I can learn how to do all of the work, I have a more than averagely equipped garage but no lifts or anything like that. I have a neighbor who would let me occasionally borrow one of his lifts.

Ultimate goal is just a fun car for me. I'd love to take it to a track every few months or some events, but most of its life would consist of enjoyable cruises.

DaewooOfDeath wrote: For that power you'd either have a timebomb KA24 with a turbo, a slightly less timebomb SR20DET or a V8 swap, which would probably be the cheapest, best option at that point.

What do you know about VH45DE swaps?

Keith Tanner wrote: But most importantly - which do you WANT to build? Because that's what's going to provide your motivation.

Thats a tough question, I'm equally excited to do either one. I feel that the 240 would give me more of a project experience, but really I won't know which until I drive both cars.