Possible camp/utility trailer re-build

OK, so a few years ago I needed a small utility trailer for hauling stuff and carrying camping equipment. I posted here about http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/off-topic-discussion/harbor-feight-utility-trailer/20940/page1/ It’s a simple, ostensibly 3’x5’ utility trailer (really 35.5” by 55.5” to the outside of the box). I added a small front with a permanently bolted on tool box and I (over) built a really nice ½” ply ‘lid’ that at 4’x5’ is bigger than the box and with internal structure raises the box another 1 ½” and also acts as a food prep and cooking, washing up surface in camp and a place to tie down the bikes in transit. It’s served well for the last 3 years, here’s a quick pic on its maiden camp trip in 2010. It is a bit small though. Last year we took 4 people in two cars, the C30 with the trailer and gear, plus the Mustang for a week’s camping. This year’s main trip is 2 weeks tent camping in Colorado, but only 3 of us. The plan was to take the C30 with the top box, plus the trailer. Then yesterday driving back from a 4 day camp trip in Northern Michigan with the C30, my wife informs me she plans to take the Mustang to Colorado. Great, the Mustang is tiny inside, plus being a convertible you can’t take the top box. So a new plan is needed. I’m suddenly thinking of rebuilding the box to a full 4x5’ or even 4x6’ and enclosing the wheels like on a pick up. Also raising the sides from 13” to a full 18”or 20”. That would theoretically double the volume. I could then mount a roof rack with the top box and bikes on top.

I’ll do a sketch at lunch time and flesh out my ideas.

Am I nuts? We’ve pulled the trailer as shown above at over 90mph (my wife refuses to accept the physics of bearing speed and lives in her own reality). It pulls perfectly stable, no issues whatsoever.

I’ve seen Tommy’s camp trailer build. I can’t go as high as him as I need to get the bikes and possibly top box on there too.

I think that you could double, or even triple the height of the box with no issues. It will still be in the wake of the tow vehicle if you use an SUV. If you use the Mustang with the top down, be careful about the bikes up high in the air stream. They could pull the trailer around a bit.

You could also make the box a little longer, even add two retractable stabilizers under the back corners for parking duty.

pinchvalve wrote: I think that you could double, or even triple the height of the box with no issues. It will still be in the wake of the tow vehicle if you use an SUV. If you use the Mustang with the top down, be careful about the bikes up high in the air stream. They could pull the trailer around a bit. You could also make the box a little longer, even add two retractable stabilizers under the back corners for parking duty.

The Mustang IS our Sport Utility Vehicle I think I can get at the very minimum a 4'x5' box, possibly a 5'x5' box and pushing it a 6'x4' box as long as I'm carfull to pack the heavey stuff forward. Sketch at lunch time.

I'm rebuilding our 4x8 utility trailer right now, a $299 Tractor Supply special. Nice little unit, but the original wood deck and side I put on it 3 or 4 years back was coming apart from (over)use, and the flimsy stock fenders were falling off.

I'm adding diagonals under the front to brace the tongue beam, and pushing out the width over the wheels, like you mentioned, to make it more like a pickup bed. Actually, when I'm done it will have almost exactly the volume of a regular pickup bed. Capacity is rated at 2000#, but the skinny little 12" wheels are only rated 990 lb each. Luckily the bolt pattern is a common 5 x 4.5, so I'll be fitting some slightly larger wheels with sturdier tires under those new fenders. I also plan to add a better tailgate and some trick LED marker lights. Eventually I may fit a collapsible tonnau cover or something similar.

volvoclearinghouse wrote: Capacity is rated at 2000#, but the skinny little 12" wheels are only rated 990 lb each. Luckily the bolt pattern is a common 5 x 4.5, so I'll be fitting some slightly larger wheels with sturdier tires under those new fenders.

Good point, I was thinking of buying one new wheel and tire as a spare. I might be better off buying 2 higher capacity and slightly larger ones and using one of the old ones as a spare. That way I can stop worrying when SWMBO refuses to listen to loginc on bearing speeds and keeps driving at 90mph!

Isn't a pickup truck bed the best trailer?

OK, here’s what I’m working with. Quick sketch in everyone’s favorite CAD program…Excel… Screen shots as its too big to format. The current trailer has an approx. internal volume of 16 cu.ft.

Here’s the new trailer proposal. The base and top are each made from a single 4x8 sheet of ½ ply. The side I’m not sure if I should stick with ½” or drop down to 3/8” for weight. This has an approx. internal volume of 33 cu.ft. so basically double.

I’m not sure what to do about the tail portion. Do I make it fixed so I can easily attach the lights and license plate or do I A) make it drop down like a pick up box? I could still do the lights on here if I allow the wires to flex. Or B) make a simple lift out panel that slides into 2 vertical slots each side? If I did this I could mount the plate on it, but the lights would have to mounted on flanges on the main ‘tub’

More tongue weight will help make the trailer more stable, but having the ball point close to the front of the trailer will mean the trailer won't be able to swing as much before it contacts the two vehicle, hurting maneuverability.

Here's some pictures of mine, in progress:

Note the welded- in diagonal supports in front. The original trailer did not have these. SInce I'm widening the load-carrying portion, this will provide extra support. Most angle iron is 2"x2"x1/8". Except for the bit I used to make the new fenders, that'a 1-1/4" Much of it was free, from an older trailer a guy I know was scrapping.

I left the one still-attached fender on there to show the larger fenders I'm constructing. And the tire on the ground there is about the size of the replacement tire I'll be fitting. It's from a Volvo 122 (correct bolt pattern, and will be able to have a matching Volvo 122 hubcap) The larger tire diameter will keep bearing speeds down.

Another good source for free angle iron: old bed frames. Plus, a lot of mattress places give out bed frames for free when you purchase a mattress.

No help to you, but what is that toolbox/bed thing that you currently have on it?

mtn wrote: No help to you, but what is that toolbox/bed thing that you currently have on it?

Not sure if your talking to me or Tuna. If it's me and you mean the black plstic one, it's a Stanley waterproof 26" until lile this. I mounted it on a piece of 3/4 ply to the A frame of the traler. It's bolted to the base and the front of the box, spaced out so you can opem the hinged lid. Being waterproof I can lock it and keep tools, straps, the draw bar, trailer lock etc etc

I really don't want to get into modifying the frame or axles. That would be lipstick on a pig. If I go that far I would start from scratch with a custom built frame and add a good axle, hubs etc etc.

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

mtn wrote: No help to you, but what is that toolbox/bed thing that you currently have on it?

Not sure if your talking to me or Tuna. If it's me and you mean the black plstic one, it's a Stanley waterproof 26" until lile this. I mounted it on a piece of 3/4 ply to the A frame of the traler. It's bolted to the base and the front of the box, spaced out so you can opem the hinged lid. Being waterproof I can lock it and keep tools, straps, the draw bar, trailer lock etc etc

Talking to you, but meant the aluminum box that occupies most of the trailer. NEver seen somethign like that on a harbor freight, but it would be about perfect for me.

mtn wrote: Talking to you, but meant the aluminum box that occupies most of the trailer. NEver seen somethign like that on a harbor freight, but it would be about perfect for me.

I walked into H.F. 3 years ago and they were selling the trailer frame and galvanized box for less than $300 complete that's why I jumped on it. The galvanizing is still perfect except a little on the tailgate. Honestly if I were starting again I'd get a bigger trailer frame and just build the box.

Might want to check out expeditionportal.com They have a trailer building section. Granted lots of those are for off roaders building camping trailers, but lots of good ideas.

Here is the one I picked up recently. No build thread yet, because we have only used it once to camp and the rest has been average house hauling duties. I plan on adding rails at some point to haul our bikes with us. Its a 1943 Willys MBT.

Adrian_Thompson wrote: I really don't want to get into modifying the frame or axles. That would be lipstick on a pig. If I go that far I would start from scratch with a custom built frame and add a good axle, hubs etc etc.

Not really lipstick, more of a complete makeover. :-P Anyway, I've gotten much of the material for free, but axles and hubs cost $$$.

I like that Willys trailer. A bit on the small side for what we want, but good looking and useful and rugged. The military sometimes surpluses other trailers, a buddy of mine picked one up, it's a 4x8 but the load-carrying deck is really high- meant for off-roading. But, it does have the folding canvas cover. I think he paid $900 for the setup.

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

mtn wrote: Talking to you, but meant the aluminum box that occupies most of the trailer. NEver seen somethign like that on a harbor freight, but it would be about perfect for me.

I walked into H.F. 3 years ago and they were selling the trailer frame and galvanized box for less than $300 complete that's why I jumped on it. The galvanizing is still perfect except a little on the tailgate. Honestly if I were starting again I'd get a bigger trailer frame and just build the box.

I have that same trailer but I use it for yard/farm work behind the baby tractor. Its heavier duty that any small yard trailer marketed as such. I widh they still sold it because I could use another one. It has been instrumental in hauling tools and debris as we have been clearing pasture. Its the perfect size!

So it looks like I have an old login saved on my home computer... The Willys is mine, and works out good for our family of 3 to get out in the woods. At some point a PO modified the rear to be a tailgate. Surprisingly, they did a good job and it works well.

My only concern with your current setup is how low the trailer tongue is in relation to the to vehicle. I was always told you want it level with the tow vehicle and if possible with the tongue slightly down towards the hitch. Yours appears to be going the opposite way.

Well I discussed it all with SWMBO last night. The cost and time scale of leaving for Colorado in 4 weeks means re-building the trailer, adding a hitch and more importantly electrics to the Mustang, especially as we're swapping it for a new one in about 6 weeks means cooler heads will prevail. We're going to stick with the old plan of the C30, plus top box and trailer as it is now. So this is the shortest lived build thread on the board. It's officially on long term hold. Maybe next winter / Spring once the house painting, new doors etc. etc. and the Saab is finished this will come back to the top and I'll do it, or maybe I'll sell the trailer as is and build a bigger once to start with.

octavious wrote: My only concern with your current setup is how low the trailer tongue is in relation to the to vehicle. I was always told you want it level with the tow vehicle and if possible with the tongue slightly down towards the hitch. Yours appears to be going the opposite way.

That was three cars ago! Yes it was high even with a small drop hitch, although it still pulled fine up to 90+mph. We are currently using my C30 wich has a much lower hitch than either the Mariner or the MKX we used before.

So...while we're talking about building trailers....I have a trailer mod question. I have a pop up camper, 2500lbs or so. I'd like to mount a gear box for chocks and whatnot to the front tongue triangle, similar to your water tight plastic box or Tuna's diamond plate. Is it okay to weld brackets on, or do I risk weakening the frame? Am I better to use self tapping screws?

So, bringing this up from the dead. As I said, I talked SWMBO out of trying to take the Mustang and take the C30 with the existing trailer rather than rebuild it.
We’re back. Almost 4,500 mile round trip, averaged 20.6mpg the whole way according to the on board computer, but when adding up mileage and gas receipts it came out as 21.3 with a best tank of 27.52 (No trailer or bike, but top box still on) and a worst of 18.367 (all up, in the mountains). That gas mileage may not sound great, but we like to get places, so average cruising speed on the freeway is 10 over with all that drag. In the mountains we err, had fun. There was one point moving from SW Colorado to the North we were towing the trailer I forgot I was pulling the trailer and realized I was doing 105mph (It was amazing I happened to find a closed road right next to the public road I was on!!!). It’s amazing, so far the cheapie Harbor Freight trailer with itty bitty wheels/tires has probably covered 10k miles over the last 3 ½ years much of it at 80mph. On the way back I had to stop and tighten up one of the wheels bearings. Count this as a big Plus for cheap Chinese crap.

Anyway, I hate to admit it, but a C30 with 3 people plus a dog on a two week tent camping vacation is just too small. I spent time looking covetously at class B motorhomes and tear drop trailers. After looking at the price of new through 5 year old Class B RV’s I really feel a tear drop trailer is in my future, especially once the youngest (12 YO going into 7th grade) no longer wants to vacation with us.

I just bought a 5x10 utility trailer which I plan to build a slide-in camper box for. Sort of a removable teardrop-y monstrosity with (limited) toy hauling capability as well. That build won't happen for a little while though - too much life stuff going on right now.

The plan is a homemade pod with some sort of folding, yet comfy sleeping surface, so I can also hold an ATV inside for transport. Drive out the ATV, sweep up some and deploy the bed and any counter top/shelf arrangement I can put in there. Lighting, ventilation and appearance will be the top priorities so I won't feel like I'm sleeping in a shipping crate

That sounds interesting. Do you have a sketch or pics of a similar idea?

Adrian_Thompson wrote: That sounds interesting. Do you have a sketch or pics of a similar idea?

No sketches of any sort yet, just in the day dream phase. :)

If you go to the teardrops and tiny travel trailers forum, they have some pre-made plans. Mine would be like a cross between a "simple" and a "rimple". Curved front, but a "van" back - likely with double doors to make loading and unloading easier. This will mean that if I do a galley of some sort, it will have to be on the front or the side, near the front of the trailer.

I want an electrical hook-up too for a/c at the very least.

So, a plywood with foam core box with a rounded profile at the front, windows and a "fantastic fan" for ventilation and natural light. Has to be tall enough to get an atv inside without decapitating myself. And I do want it nicely trimmed out inside and out so a real live woman will actually be ok to sleep in there on occasion - needs to be CUTE.