R63 AMG The Unicorn of my Destruction

In reply to m4ff3w:

Did you ever get yours running again?

mndsm wrote: In reply to m4ff3w: Did you ever get yours running again?

Neg. Ended up moving and couldn't take it with, it was still in pieces. She got scrapped. I'll have another someday, but will be EFI.

Still need to sell the 2.8l heads.

m4ff3w wrote:

mndsm wrote: In reply to m4ff3w: Did you ever get yours running again?

Neg. Ended up moving and couldn't take it with, it was still in pieces. She got scrapped. I'll have another someday, but will be EFI. Still need to sell the 2.8l heads.

Since Mr Deuce is taking a breather and the topic of conversation has turned to Italian paper-weighs, I will just drop this into the melee:

http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/173204/1985-maserati-biturbo-1uzfe-transplant?page=2

8 months later

That's basically amazing. It somehow seems like cheating to repower a biturbo though.

In reply to mazdeuce:

I've always wanted to put a twin turbo rotary in one so that people aren't sure whether I've made it more reliable or not.

I almost bought a Bi-Turbo as my first car. No joke. Then I realized the nearest Maserati specialist was a 1000 miles away and I didn't know E36 M3 about them so I bailed.

What I really wanted was a Shamal.

mazdeuce wrote: That's basically amazing. It somehow seems like cheating to repower a biturbo though.

Agreed.

Other than valve adjustments I really like the engine, at least in EFI form.

Ok, so I saw this thread when it was first posted up but I just now got caught up on the bolt issue and must first say, mazdeuce, you are a good man. The process of going through the local dealership and MBNA before tearing things apart makes total sense. Being upset about both the specific failure and their decision to let you know decisively that they could help you but wouldn't also makes total sense.

The coolest thing to me, though, is that you're continuing to make the most of your life situation and coming upon some cool philosophical discoveries. I had a stay at home parent who objectively spent a lot more time complaining about the things she "had to do" than she spent actually doing anything and a working parent who, when he could, DID STUFF. The idea that you can figure out virtually anything and that big goals can be broken down into manageable smaller ones is massively important for kids, IMHO. Hopefully they recognize the lesson and appreciate you for it.

In the meantime, the popcorn is out and I think your relationship with your vehicle will be better at the end than it ever was. Who cares about the bolts that used to be in the engine, the cable ties are ingenious! There's a metaphor for life somewhere in there, but, in the meantime, rock on buddy.

NOHOME wrote:

m4ff3w wrote:

mndsm wrote: In reply to m4ff3w: Did you ever get yours running again?

Neg. Ended up moving and couldn't take it with, it was still in pieces. She got scrapped. I'll have another someday, but will be EFI. Still need to sell the 2.8l heads.

Since Mr Deuce is taking a breather and the topic of conversation has turned to Italian paper-weighs, I will just drop this into the melee: http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/173204/1985-maserati-biturbo-1uzfe-transplant?page=2 8 months later

You see this guys other builds?

MattW wrote: What I really wanted was a Shamal.

Wasn't that the genie movie with Sinbad? There was an old Italian near me when I was a kid that had a red Biturbo and it seemed to run fine every day. I would love to go back and ask him what his secret was.

chandlerGTi wrote:

NOHOME wrote:

m4ff3w wrote:

mndsm wrote: In reply to m4ff3w: Did you ever get yours running again?

Neg. Ended up moving and couldn't take it with, it was still in pieces. She got scrapped. I'll have another someday, but will be EFI. Still need to sell the 2.8l heads.

Since Mr Deuce is taking a breather and the topic of conversation has turned to Italian paper-weighs, I will just drop this into the melee: http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/173204/1985-maserati-biturbo-1uzfe-transplant?page=2 8 months later

You see this guys other builds?

He is quite prolific, is he not? I am glad he does not post here because I would be ashamed of my project pace. And note that he does not drive any of the projects before selling them.

NOHOME wrote:

chandlerGTi wrote:

NOHOME wrote:

m4ff3w wrote:

mndsm wrote: In reply to m4ff3w: Did you ever get yours running again?

Neg. Ended up moving and couldn't take it with, it was still in pieces. She got scrapped. I'll have another someday, but will be EFI. Still need to sell the 2.8l heads.

Since Mr Deuce is taking a breather and the topic of conversation has turned to Italian paper-weighs, I will just drop this into the melee: http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/173204/1985-maserati-biturbo-1uzfe-transplant?page=2 8 months later

You see this guys other builds?

He is quite prolific, is he not? I am glad he does not post here because I would be ashamed of my project pace. And note that he does not drive any of the projects before selling them.

That's the secret, if you drive it you fall in love with it.

Then you hoon it and break it.

Now it's a project again.... rinse & repeat.

Wow, can't wait to see more progress. Thanks for taking up my entire morning reading this thread! Now maybe I can get something else done today... maybe

In reply to white_fly:

Thank you for typing that out. I enjoy the time and mental energy balance between raising kids and working on projects.

In reply to Nomad:

I'm glad you enjoy reading about this nonsense. As much as anything, I'm a story teller. I was raised by story tellers. Cars just happen to be the medium through which stories are being created right now. The interactive nature of GRM makes story telling more like sitting around a campfire at the end of the day than traditional writing. It's a pleasure.

To everyone else, has anyone taken a biturbo motor and swapped it INTO something? At least you'd get rid of the rest of the Italian problems.

mazdeuce wrote: To everyone else, has anyone taken a biturbo motor and swapped it INTO something? At least you'd get rid of the rest of the Italian problems.

I'd love to find a Merak with a busted engine and drop a EFI 2.8 Bitrouble engine into it.

Using the Bi-turbo engine in something else is a interesting idea, I bet there are low mileage engines out there, since the cars typically are not driven much. OF course there are many other engines that would easily make more power, but that isn't always really the goal. The only real negative issue with the engine is doing a valve adjustment. That involves multiple issues. They put the shims under the lifters... So you take measurements, then take everything apart, and if a lifter or two falls out while taking it apart, there could be some mystery about those measurements you took. But we have not gotten to the fun part. One lifter operates two intake valves, the top of those two shims must be at the same height, this complicates things a little. You must measure the old shims and order new ones, there are no markings or anything, then measure all the new ones. Because you won't really know what they sent, good idea to order a couple slightly oversize which can be sanded down. Now if you really have to know, you recheck the lash after putting it all back together. Do one head completely before starting the other. Now if they had put the shim on top of the lifter like a Fiat. Sure the shim under the lifter is lighter but it's not a high RPM engine anyhow. Changing the clutch is another adventure, but with some luck I won't have to do that again. You can't remove or install the trans with the clutch assembly bolted to the flywheel. But you will forget when you attempt to put the trans back in and it won't fit. After the trans shaft is in the little hole in the flywheel, you then slide the clutch assembly forward and bolt it on. Work slowly, nobody said this would be easy... You just assume everything is going to be more difficult than it should be.

I don't think a high end German car would be any more difficult to fix, I often wonder why I got rid of that Porsche 928.  That would be a great engine to put in anything.

OK - so first things first. I am new to this site and new to this thread. I came across this thread searching for any new R63s that may have popped up for sale. My story begins about a year ago. On January 26, 2016, I bought a used R63 from a dealer in Palm Beach, FL. I live up in MD. I saw the car pop up online and immediately pinged my wife. We have a 2002 RX300, which was having a transmission replaced. In the interim, we had bought a 2015 Pathfinder, which I ultimately had repurchased under the MD lemon law, after looking at a used R350 (which I really liked).

When I saw the R63, which we had noted was a unicorn, I knew we had to move fast. And I didn't have the time to go down to FL to lay eyes on the vehicle, which then showed just over 94k on the odo. When I bought the car, financed through USAA, they offered me a warranty, which I thought wise to add on. The warranty added 2 years and 24k miles of coverage to the vehicle and cost just under 4k. That's right - a 2yr, 24kmi, no deductible warranty on a 10 y/o AMG - I figured that was a no-brainer. To date, that warranty has provided me with nearly $25k worth of repairs. New air-shocks, motor and transmission mounts, bushings, radiator, tail lift struts, steering angle sensor, and various other odds and ends. This car is amazing and I share your sentiments, mazdeuce, it's an absolute pleasure to drive.

All of this being background, I'm well aware of the risk of the head bolt failure on this motor. In fact, it was the subject of class action litigation (NJ) that, for some reason, was later dropped. I'm guessing settlement with the named class representative. So my question is - is there anything I can do to see if my engine is at risk? I've reached out to the previous dealer that had done all of the work on the vehicle - perhaps they have the full service records.

I understand deeply how you must feel, mazdeuce - I'd be pissed, too. MB knows full well that this isn't about a warranty issue but about a manufacturing defect which should have just been corrected at the outset. While I don't envy you having to do this work, I gotta admit that I've enjoyed the photos.

Wishing you a happy, healthy, and PRODUCTIVE New YearHere's to 2017!!!

Dan

Watch for coolant loss like a hawk. Catastrophic failure is usually preceeded by a gradual loss of coolant as it starts to seep into the cylinders. If you ever get a low coolant warning and you can't see exactly where the coolant is dripping, it's probably time to pull the engine. That's the word any way. If the motor needs to come all the way out for anything else you might consider having the head bolts replaced. Parts cost is minimal (the bolts themselves are only $200 for all 20) and then gaskets. Labor is the big thing (as I'm sure you know by now) and a significant part of that labor is the pulling and refitting of the engine as well as all of the checks that need to be done if a bolt actually goes.
I'm glad to hear from someone else who has one of these lovely beasts. I think you're really going to have to love them to put up with fixing them.

Now only 198 other R63 owners to find.

I see a little Mazdaduece Enterprise here fixing AMG engines in The Grosh.

Vacation is over and back to work.
I'm not in the mood for this. I feel like making stuff. Cabinets. Learning the lathe. Cleaning the yard. I'm feeling creative and dismantling an engine is not creative. It needs to get done so I'm setting a timer for two hours and doing at least that much every day.
Belt routing for future reference. Laying things out on the floor in the order I take them off so I can reassemble in the same order. I don't agree with sequence in the manual for everything. Foam insulators from the top of the engine. Passenger side oil/vent pipe.
Belt.
Cruise control module.
Main coolant hose and thermostat housing. Need to replace the housing because I broke off a plastic nipple trying to turn the motor over earlier. I'm NOT happy about that.
Tensioner, held open with an Allen key.
Oil filter housing, special attention to the one short bolt which is at the far right.
At this point I removed the power steering pump and laid it off to the side so I don't have to remove the lines. There is a wire zip tied to the top that I have to ship off. I put a tag there to note that.

Pulled the rest of the crank case recirculation stuff.
The engine hoist loopy. This needs to be loosened to get the vacuum line for the above between it and the block. Intake manifold came off. Lots of stuff needs to fit just right at the back. Remember to replace the couragated plastic elbow as they're known to break and are basically inaccessible back there.
Also one of the bosses that holds the fuel rail on is broken and stripped. This will be an issue but I'm trying not to stress about it until I determine that this is my biggest problem. Drivers side fuel rail has been off before and I suspect someone overtightened it. These bolts don't need much torque. Took off the end of the head cover which has all of the sensors for the cam. This is what the cams look like sitting with the crank at 40 degrees as specified in the book. Removed the cams. They and the caps look good to me. I'll inspect closer later. And here we are. I'll pull the passenger side cams tomorrow and get the rest off the front of the motor and figure out the Pandora's box that is the timing chains. The heads appear to hold the timing case on but the timing chains hold the heads on......

Are you planning to have the heads milled flat? Why are you disassembling them? Normally, I deliver the heads to the machine shop completely assembled. Then, they surface them so they are true and do a valve job and then they reassemble (adding shims or whatever to get the lash correct.

Cams have to come out to remove the head bolts.

To mazdeuce

I'm feeling a bit woozy...How you holding up?

Too bad you can't call up Guido Nordheim for a few reassembly pointers.