335i equivalent?

Well after getting input from you all on what I should consider for my next DD/fun car I finally compiled my list (about 30 strong) and set out to do some test driving. The first thing I found was a 135i with the automatic (not my first choice) however it did have the paddle shifters. HOLY %^&*! I was stunned! This thing was just wild! The reason I was stunned is that it had similar BHP to the new 3.7L Mustangs, v6 Gen coupes, 350z, etc... yet felt a LOT faster. Well after the test drive I went home and did some research. I think the reason why is that according to everything I read, the almost 300 lb/ft of torque is very low in the power band, like 2k rpms whereas in the other cars the torque was less AND far more towards the top of the rev range (4500ish).

After some more reading, the general consensus was that the 335i was a better car than the 135i and only a tad bit slower and still as tunable and fun. Then reality hit me. This is a BMW, they are expensive to fix. That could be a deal breaker if parts are absurd (I can probably wrench well enough myself). So this brings up 2 questions.

1. Is the cost of repairing/maintaining a BMW really that bad (this being a newer 07/08)?

2. If it is, is there another car that gives me the same sort of performance and modability? (the N54 motors can do 11s with an agressive tune and some cooling upgrades) The 350/370s I looked at, but in the case of mods, bolt ons do very little for them without FI.

3. Damn the torpedoes. If I like it the best, just buy it?

On a side note, just found out the local track is reopening, so now I have even more of a reason to make the right choice.

Re #1. fwiw, I spent $7k in post-warranty repairs on my 95 3 series purchased with 18k on the odo. While under warranty, it was at the dealer ever 2-3 months on average.

Re your side note, an instructor that had a 335i got rid of it as the car just kept going into limp mode on track and he didn't feel it was worthwhile to spend the cash to make it / mod it to be more track worthy.

For that money, i'd get a DD. AND a fun toy.

What was the nature of the repairs/problems?

@92Celica: The parking/storage situation wont allow for 2 cars. That option was explored previously.

e90 issues I'm seeing at an indy shop:

• water pump failure - they're electric and expensive but they're typically good for 100k.
• rear wheel bearings - again, pricey if you don't diy but they usually last at least 100k unless you're a pothole spelunker
• climate control fans - easy to replace
• front radius arm bushings - not really diy friendly since they require a press and adapters unless you just replace the complete arm.
• valve cover gasket leaks on the cars equipped with metal valve covers - caused by aluminum bolts breaking - diy-able for the cost of a gasket and set of bolts.

Things the almighty internet says will go wrong with the n54

• high pressure fuel pump... oh noez!111!!!

I test drove several cars, including the 135i, the Genesis Coupe 3.8 track pack, and the Mustang 5.0. You can see which one I picked.

I didn't want to pay for maintenance on the Bimmer, plus the closest dealer was 60 miles from me. And I like torque.

I wouldnt guess a 5.0 mustang feels torquier than a 135i. The only new 5.0 i've ridden in didnt seem crazy torquey.

But i did like it.

I bought an '07 335i sedan two weeks ago as a DD, it had already had the HPFP replaced which is a common failure point for the earlier N54s. Regarding the oil temps, only some of the 335i's had the factory oil cooler, as I understand all cars equipped with a sports package had them, and later in the production cycle, they became more common. The way to check is in the passenger side fender well, look for vents in the front of the well, these are indicative of a factory installed oil cooler. Aftermarket versions are available, as the oil temp > limp mode is a common problem with the car. I also have '94 RX-7 (10+ years now) and have driven a few thousand miles in my dad's '98 Supra TT, and the 335i reminds me of the Supra in many different ways. It handles similar, the powerband is similar, and the sound is great for a straight six; its like a more modern, four door Supra TT. As far as repairs go, I haven't experienced any yet, but I'm pretty competent with turbocharged cars, there is a solid aftermarket for them, and with the different aftermarket ECU mods available, I should be able to reset codes and maintenance as it comes up. On the whole, its been a great car while I've had it, mine is the 6MT with sports, premium and cold weather packages. I'm planning on purchasing the JB4 from Burger Motorsports along with the intake and USB cable (so I can read/reset codes). Again, I've only had it four a couple weeks, but if you have any specific questions, let me know.

Barring some act of God, the 2011 5.0s are out of my budget (low 20s, and that is pushing it), whereas I can easily find used 07/08 335is in that range. The reason I ask about the costs is because Im done fixing cars that are problematic. The work I want to do is improvements, not because I cant get to work if I dont. I owned a DSM for a while, fun car to drive, but it was a total POS reliability wise. The performance of the 335i is pretty much exactly what I want. Fast to begin with, and insane if tuned, yet classy, the downside is the usual rule of performance cars; Fast, Cheap, Reliable, pick any two.

Buy a CPO warrantied car - 6 years 100k miles from first in service date - and then don't worry about anything for 3-5 years. Just don't put a tune on it.

csbassplayer2003 wrote: Barring some act of God, the 2011 5.0s are out of my budget (low 20s, and that is pushing it), whereas I can easily find used 07/08 335is in that range. The reason I ask about the costs is because Im done fixing cars that are problematic. The work I want to do is improvements, not because I cant get to work if I dont. I owned a DSM for a while, fun car to drive, but it was a total POS reliability wise. The performance of the 335i is pretty much exactly what I want. Fast to begin with, and insane if tuned, yet classy, the downside is the usual rule of performance cars; Fast, Cheap, Reliable, pick any two.

Do you need 4 doors? If not, seriously consider a loaded Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8 Track Pack. In my opinion, it was 9/10ths of the 135i for half the cost. And those Brembo brakes can slow the rotation of the earth!

pigeon wrote: Buy a CPO warrantied car - 6 years 100k miles from first in service date - and then don't worry about anything for 3-5 years. Just don't put a tune on it.

With the cost of repairs that might not be a bad idea. What cars are eligable and what is the price premium?

No I dont need 4 doors. I have test driven the 3.8 Genesis and it is a likable car, but at the moment (until the 2013s come out with supposedly revised engines) the Mustang IMO is better in every category except styling, including price and modability.

Far be it from me to talk you out of a Mustang!

I just had the plugs changed in my 07 335 at the 40k interval and cost $150. My best friend did the work (full time foreign car mechanic) and I'm sure the dealer/shop would have been much more. Been a great car so far bought it with 17k miles(HPFP previously replaced). Has a Cobb tuner/intercooler/downpipes/intake now which really wakes it up. Just noticed the stage 2 tunes are available now from Cobb for the bolt on stuff so Im pretty excited. Haven't had any trouble besides a few hard starts(hopefully plug related). I auto-xed it a bunch with no issues besides slight oil temp increases. Definitely not the funnest car to auto-x( 4 door, 3600+ lbs). I'm quite sure tracking the car would require some oil cooler mods( even though mine has an oil cooler) so It doesn't go into a limp mode. Don't really want to track it anyhow since its my wife's car as well. I haven't drag raced it either but probably will some day to see what it does. Adding an LSD is also readily available and the biggest thing missing in this chassis. Great daily/highway car.

csbassplayer2003 wrote:

pigeon wrote: Buy a CPO warrantied car - 6 years 100k miles from first in service date - and then don't worry about anything for 3-5 years. Just don't put a tune on it.

With the cost of repairs that might not be a bad idea. What cars are eligable and what is the price premium?

Any BMW within the factory warranty is eligible for CPO for sure, and I think that the dealer can CPO anything that's still within the 6 years/100k mile window, though why you'd want to buy one with a CPO warranty after the original warranty period for miles or time I don't know. The price premium tends to run $2-3k, though everything's negotiable - it costs the dealer around $1500 IIRC for the CPO warranty though it's been a while since I looked at that. Only you can decide whether it's worth it - when I bought my 7 (and my wife's Volvo XC90) it was an absolute requirement to me.

pigeon wrote: Any BMW within the factory warranty is eligible for CPO for sure, and I think that the dealer can CPO anything that's still within the 6 years/100k mile window, though why you'd want to buy one with a CPO warranty after the original warranty period for miles or time I don't know. The price premium tends to run $2-3k, though everything's negotiable - it costs the dealer around $1500 IIRC for the CPO warranty though it's been a while since I looked at that. Only you can decide whether it's worth it - when I bought my 7 (and my wife's Volvo XC90) it was an absolute requirement to me.

Not unless it's changed. When I was shopping for cars back in February, the BMW dealer told me CPO cars come with the balance of the factory warranty, and that warranty cannot be extended. Obviously I wasn't too keen on buying a 3-year-old "certified pre-owned" 135i that only had 1 year and 8,000 miles of warranty left.

Well so far my research hasn't turned up much in the way of alternative. The closest I've seen thusfar is the G37c and while it competes with the 335i on most levels, it isn't very mod friendly and still probably expensive to fix even though it is still a Nissan. I love the way it looks though

Sky_Render wrote:

pigeon wrote: Any BMW within the factory warranty is eligible for CPO for sure, and I think that the dealer can CPO anything that's still within the 6 years/100k mile window, though why you'd want to buy one with a CPO warranty after the original warranty period for miles or time I don't know. The price premium tends to run $2-3k, though everything's negotiable - it costs the dealer around $1500 IIRC for the CPO warranty though it's been a while since I looked at that. Only you can decide whether it's worth it - when I bought my 7 (and my wife's Volvo XC90) it was an absolute requirement to me.

Not unless it's changed. When I was shopping for cars back in February, the BMW dealer told me CPO cars come with the balance of the factory warranty, and that warranty cannot be extended. Obviously I wasn't too keen on buying a 3-year-old "certified pre-owned" 135i that only had 1 year and 8,000 miles of warranty left.

Whoever you spoke to was a moron. http://www.bmwusa.com/standard/content/cpo/default2.aspx

Dang. if I would have known that, I might be in an M3 right now.

Now does the vehicle have to be already registered as a CPO or can you find a vehicle that falls within the parameters of CPO and pay money to have it become a CPO car?

BTW reading the brochure says that it adds 2 years/50k miles warranty to the end of the 4yr/50k new car warranty for a total of 6 years/100k miles.

csbassplayer2003 wrote: Now does the vehicle have to be already registered as a CPO or can you find a vehicle that falls within the parameters of CPO and pay money to have it become a CPO car?

Has to be a BMW dealer selling the car; if it's not being sold as a CPO they can add the warranty and you can negotiate that price. You generally can't just but a car private party and have a dealer CPO it to my knowledge but there may be a dealer or two that will sell a CPO warranty over the phone - google should help you there.

So as long as it is a dealer car that falls under the required parameters you could do it as part of the purchasing process. So that isn't a bad option, the only downside is that if you bought an 07/08 that would only cover you until 2013/2014 before you had to start worrying about big repair bills.

In reply to csbassplayer2003:

There are other extended warranty options out there too - personally I'd check on a BMW-specific forum to see what people's experiences are with those various companies. My experience with the BMW CPO was very positive, I was always treated well, given a loaner car, and the $50 deductible per repair was not a big deal. The downside of the CPO is all work will be at the dealer; if you have a trusted indy who you'd rather do the work you are better off with an aftermarket extended warranty.

C5 Z06?

If you don't need a back seat.