Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
Cotton said:z31maniac said:pheller said:I'm actually kind of surpised that we're not seeing more RWD sedans and wagons with big honking engines. Something that is both practical but can still be mean looking, loud, and melt rubber.
My guess, even just based on many in this forum, is how long the commute seems to be for many people and that most still commute 5 days per week. So a rowdy V8 wagon that is more expensive to buy and maintain and gets half the gas mileage of something like a Mazda 6.........I can see how that doesn't make sense to many people.
There are plenty of people on this forum who drive further one-way to work, then I commute all week.
I think I’m one of the few that does the opposite. I have a long commute and want to drive something I enjoy that is fast and I don’t really care too much about the gas mileage. My commute is 36 miles each way and there are plenty of places to stretch the legs of what you’re driving a bit. I currently dd my tuned cl600 at over 500hp and my tuned k1300s at around 190hp. I also drive various things like my 90 square body 4x4 suburban and w140 s500 coupe, but none of them get decent gas mileage except bthe bike. My preference is just to pay for the fuel and enjoy my commute. It definitely doesn’t make sense to most people, but it keeps the commute interesting for me, which is something I have not found possible in an appliance car.
Based on some of the vehicles in your collection, I'm guessing you can easily afford to fuel those beasts with minimal impact on your finances. That probably isn't the case for a more average person with modest means, so they might actually have to choose between boring, responsible appliances or fun, impractical daily drivers. When it hurts to pay the fuel bill, most people go with the cheap, reliable appliance. Fun can be an expensive luxury.
Brett_Murphy said:Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
rslifkin said:In reply to Cotton :
I don't have the long commute, but I somewhat share that sentiment. There's a limit to how boring a car I'm willing to accept before it becomes a bad daily driver due to me not wanting to drive it unless I really have to.
that's why I bought my Abarth. fun to drive, makes nice noises, and still gets 34mpg
NickD said:Brett_Murphy said:Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
People generally didn't know it existed until after it was discontinued.
GM loves to come up with interesting ideas and then do everything they can to make them fail. I think the Corvette survived entirely by accident.
In reply to NickD :
You missed my earlier comment about the Chevrolet SS and how it's my perfect car.
Knurled. said:NickD said:Brett_Murphy said:Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
People generally didn't know it existed until after it was discontinued.
GM loves to come up with interesting ideas and then do everything they can to make them fail. I think the Corvette survived entirely by accident.
That is true. Their name for it did not help either. "Camaro SS?" "No, the Chevrolet Just SS." I heard our salesman telling customers it was a Malibu SS or an Impala SS.
STM317 said:Cotton said:z31maniac said:pheller said:I'm actually kind of surpised that we're not seeing more RWD sedans and wagons with big honking engines. Something that is both practical but can still be mean looking, loud, and melt rubber.
My guess, even just based on many in this forum, is how long the commute seems to be for many people and that most still commute 5 days per week. So a rowdy V8 wagon that is more expensive to buy and maintain and gets half the gas mileage of something like a Mazda 6.........I can see how that doesn't make sense to many people.
There are plenty of people on this forum who drive further one-way to work, then I commute all week.
I think I’m one of the few that does the opposite. I have a long commute and want to drive something I enjoy that is fast and I don’t really care too much about the gas mileage. My commute is 36 miles each way and there are plenty of places to stretch the legs of what you’re driving a bit. I currently dd my tuned cl600 at over 500hp and my tuned k1300s at around 190hp. I also drive various things like my 90 square body 4x4 suburban and w140 s500 coupe, but none of them get decent gas mileage except bthe bike. My preference is just to pay for the fuel and enjoy my commute. It definitely doesn’t make sense to most people, but it keeps the commute interesting for me, which is something I have not found possible in an appliance car.
Based on some of the vehicles in your collection, I'm guessing you can easily afford to fuel those beasts with minimal impact on your finances. That probably isn't the case for a more average person with modest means, so they might actually have to choose between boring, responsible appliances or fun, impractical daily drivers. When it hurts to pay the fuel bill, most people go with the cheap, reliable appliance. Fun can be an expensive luxury.
Pretty much what my reply was going to be.
In reply to z31maniac :
Yeah.. I commute 25 miles a day right now, but my previous commute was 95-100miles. Even getting 30mpg.. My focus st had me at the pump every 3 days for a fill because of the 12 gallon tank.
I definitely considered my commute before I bought the focus because those costs add up fast. 30mpg on premium is like 23 mpg on regular... Which is why I still bought the car because I knew I could run it on 87.
STM317 said:Cotton said:z31maniac said:pheller said:I'm actually kind of surpised that we're not seeing more RWD sedans and wagons with big honking engines. Something that is both practical but can still be mean looking, loud, and melt rubber.
My guess, even just based on many in this forum, is how long the commute seems to be for many people and that most still commute 5 days per week. So a rowdy V8 wagon that is more expensive to buy and maintain and gets half the gas mileage of something like a Mazda 6.........I can see how that doesn't make sense to many people.
There are plenty of people on this forum who drive further one-way to work, then I commute all week.
I think I’m one of the few that does the opposite. I have a long commute and want to drive something I enjoy that is fast and I don’t really care too much about the gas mileage. My commute is 36 miles each way and there are plenty of places to stretch the legs of what you’re driving a bit. I currently dd my tuned cl600 at over 500hp and my tuned k1300s at around 190hp. I also drive various things like my 90 square body 4x4 suburban and w140 s500 coupe, but none of them get decent gas mileage except bthe bike. My preference is just to pay for the fuel and enjoy my commute. It definitely doesn’t make sense to most people, but it keeps the commute interesting for me, which is something I have not found possible in an appliance car.
Based on some of the vehicles in your collection, I'm guessing you can easily afford to fuel those beasts with minimal impact on your finances. That probably isn't the case for a more average person with modest means, so they might actually have to choose between boring, responsible appliances or fun, impractical daily drivers. When it hurts to pay the fuel bill, most people go with the cheap, reliable appliance. Fun can be an expensive luxury.
this. I do fairly well financially, but the driving factor in selling my (tuned, fast) WRX was 23mpg commuting running premium. So I lost 100+ hp so I could get 32mpg commuting in a GTI. It's not as much fun, but it's fun enough.
Knurled. said:NickD said:Brett_Murphy said:Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
People generally didn't know it existed until after it was discontinued.
GM loves to come up with interesting ideas and then do everything they can to make them fail. I think the Corvette survived entirely by accident.
And also, overprice them. And make them ugly and unreliable. And then cancel them when they don't sell enough.
The new Vette might be the last! They'll see the sales are lower than the C7 and kill it. Nevermind that all sports car sales are lower.
spacecadet said:In reply to z31maniac :
Yeah.. I commute 25 miles a day right now, but my previous commute was 95-100miles. Even getting 30mpg.. My focus st had me at the pump every 3 days for a fill because of the 12 gallon tank.
I definitely considered my commute before I bought the focus because those costs add up fast. 30mpg on premium is like 23 mpg on regular... Which is why I still bought the car because I knew I could run it on 87.
Exactly. You commute 125 miles per week to my ~30.
If overnight gas was $20 gallon, about the only thing that would change is buying cheap vodka instead of Jameson. 
Meanwhile over at Mopar: Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat Widebody. Yep, ChryCo is building a widebody 707hp sedan.
Any time GM makes something people would actually want they make sure to never advertise it ever so that people know it actually exists.
Chryco is and always has been the company of "berkeley it, let's see what happens" and I love them for it. It will 100% lead to their death but I wouldn't have them any other way.
mad_machine said:rslifkin said:In reply to Cotton :
I don't have the long commute, but I somewhat share that sentiment. There's a limit to how boring a car I'm willing to accept before it becomes a bad daily driver due to me not wanting to drive it unless I really have to.
that's why I bought my Abarth. fun to drive, makes nice noises, and still gets 34mpg
That's why I bought the FR-S. I average 32 mpg.
z31maniac said:STM317 said:Cotton said:z31maniac said:pheller said:I'm actually kind of surpised that we're not seeing more RWD sedans and wagons with big honking engines. Something that is both practical but can still be mean looking, loud, and melt rubber.
My guess, even just based on many in this forum, is how long the commute seems to be for many people and that most still commute 5 days per week. So a rowdy V8 wagon that is more expensive to buy and maintain and gets half the gas mileage of something like a Mazda 6.........I can see how that doesn't make sense to many people.
There are plenty of people on this forum who drive further one-way to work, then I commute all week.
I think I’m one of the few that does the opposite. I have a long commute and want to drive something I enjoy that is fast and I don’t really care too much about the gas mileage. My commute is 36 miles each way and there are plenty of places to stretch the legs of what you’re driving a bit. I currently dd my tuned cl600 at over 500hp and my tuned k1300s at around 190hp. I also drive various things like my 90 square body 4x4 suburban and w140 s500 coupe, but none of them get decent gas mileage except bthe bike. My preference is just to pay for the fuel and enjoy my commute. It definitely doesn’t make sense to most people, but it keeps the commute interesting for me, which is something I have not found possible in an appliance car.
Based on some of the vehicles in your collection, I'm guessing you can easily afford to fuel those beasts with minimal impact on your finances. That probably isn't the case for a more average person with modest means, so they might actually have to choose between boring, responsible appliances or fun, impractical daily drivers. When it hurts to pay the fuel bill, most people go with the cheap, reliable appliance. Fun can be an expensive luxury.
Pretty much what my reply was going to be.
True, but even when things were different I made compromises to drive something “fun”. At one point I had a beater modified 944 turbo, but had a 14” tv on a cardboard box for a stand and a lot of grilled cheeses for dinner. I’ve always been a gearhead and couldn’t stand driving an appliance....I’d rather compromise somewhere else and always have when needed. Now, if I did want or need to get better mileage I’d just go back to commuting on a bike. Even the k1300s gets over 40mpg. My old Yamaha yzf600 got over 50.
NickD said:Brett_Murphy said:Jordan Rimpela said:You know, David will be talking to our friends at Chevy this weekend...
Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
Then raise a stink about why they didn't promote the hell out of it? And why they didn't call it the Chevelle, like they should have.
Wasn’t the Holden factory already doomed when the SS came out? I get the feeling it never had a chance.
Appleseed said:NickD said:Brett_Murphy said:Raise a stink until we get something with a V8 that will hold 4 adults and that ISN'T some kind of truck of SUV.
We had one. Nobody bought them. It was called the Chevrolet SS
Then raise a stink about why they didn't promote the hell out of it? And why they didn't call it the Chevelle, like they should have.
Getting the SS in the US was basically just GM putting the Holden Commodore on the clearance rack until they were allowed to kill it off. It was never supposed to be a long term model here and made little profit. There was no motivation to promote it or sell a bunch as $45k loss leaders.
GM was shuttering Holden because it was too expensive to produce cars in Australia. They weren't selling a ton of Commodores in their home market, and they were contractually obligated to keep the plant open until a certain point. So to keep the plant from sitting idle, and soak up the overflow vehicles, they rebadged them and sent them to the US where they had to price them to be competitive in the market with things like the Charger. So when production costs are higher than your competition, and the sales price is more or less fixed due to market competition that means little/no profit. Then, they had the added expense of rebadging them, certifying them for the US and shipping them halfway around the world. As a company, why would you want to sell a bunch of low profit items when you could be selling things that make you a bunch more money? It's way better for the bottom line to promote the hell out of more profitable things like Silverados, Equinoxen(?) and the occasional Camaros.
Cotton said:True, but even when things were different I made compromises to drive something “fun”. At one point I had a beater modified 944 turbo, but had a 14” tv on a cardboard box for a stand and a lot of grilled cheeses for dinner. I’ve always been a gearhead and couldn’t stand driving an appliance....I’d rather compromise somewhere else and always have when needed. Now, if I did want or need to get better mileage I’d just go back to commuting on a bike. Even the k1300s gets over 40mpg. My old Yamaha yzf600 got over 50.
I'm with you. I've done the same thing basically since 1-2 years out of college. The most boring car I've owned since then (I had sportbike my last 1.5 years of college and first 1.5 out), was my Nissan Frontier Pro-4X. But that was a compromise with the person to whom I was married at the time. Buy a truck for house/camping stuff, and you can have another project car.
Love how he goes on and on about steering feel, but calls the PP2 more fun to drive. No, non-communicative steering feel is not fun...
And I don’t know what Ford dealer Javelin works for, but he should pay attention to what car they talk about cooking diffs in the video.
STM317 said:Getting the SS in the US was basically just GM putting the Holden Commodore on the clearance rack until they were allowed to kill it off.
Shipping the tooling from there to here wouldn't have killed them, though. It was already crash certified at that point, and could've been re-examined and possibly sold at a more competitive price point.
As was pointed out, they could've called it a Monte Carlo or a Chevelle and capitalized on decades of brand recognition, too. Instead, they just brought them over, didn't really tell anybody about them, charged an arm and a leg and then threw up their hands and went, "Waily, waily, nobody likes this thing!" because they never wanted it to succeed.
In reply to Brett_Murphy :
but you have to have a plant with capacity *and* capability to receive those tools and start banging out cars. which means you have to have suppliers on board to provide parts to that plant that is now on the other side of the globe. etc etc.
as noted earlier, they were producing the SS to meet a contract obligation.
I never liked the Camaro when it came back out in 2009 or whenver. For that matter, I haven't really liked any Camaro since maybe the mid-70s. I won't really be sad to see it go. After 5 years or so when they bring it back (since the 5th gen was influenced by the 69) I wonder if they'll try to make the newer one influenced by maybe the 1970? That could potentially be neat.
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