A car you love that might be eating you alive?

Agreed. The cost of urea tends to get overblown. Yes, it was rather pricey when it first started getting spec'd in cars and trucks, but it came down pretty quickly. You can buy giant vats of it at Sam's Club.

As far as when to bail? That's hard to say and it's really a personal decision. Some of it is practical. Some emotional. Some folks don't like dealing with maintenance and repairs at all. Those folks tend to lease cars. Then there are those of us who will spend a ton of money on tools and parts to DIY repair a car (my TDi for example) and potentially drive it forever. Only you can decide when you've had enough.

Jaynen wrote:

Bobzilla wrote:

Jaynen wrote: I can't really think of many non german 30+ mpg large/luxury sedans. Maybe the ES300H/Avalon Hybrid

When you factor in the extra cost of the diesel and the urea additive, you're talking about the equivalent to a 25mpg large luxury sedan.... which brings you a ton of options. EDIT: look, you are happy with your purchase and I get that. But cost and fuel efficiency is not the reason you bought it.

People always say that but I don't get it. I can buy 2 gallons of urea at walmart for 7 dollars and I haven't paid more for diesel than someone would premium fuel in 6 years of owning diesel vehicles. For that matter I paid 15-20 cents less than regular unleaded for most of the time I have owned this vehicle so far. So every 10,000 miles I spend at max 20 bucks on urea, the stuff at Walmart is certified btw. Regular non Arco gas here is 2.85 Diesel is 2.79 (in California). Now out in Raleigh its like 2.13 for regular and 2.29 for diesel. Premium is 2.65. I don't see how those costs take my 30-37mpg luxury sedan and make it cost equivalent to 25mpg But at least living out in California yes I did buy it for fuel efficiency. And it was a lot more car than a comparable accord at the time I bought it (but the accord would not need this kind of work obviously and thats the rub) I just wish the responses were a little less focused on "german car bad lol" and more actually answering my question as to when do you bail on a vehicle due to its costs. Two of these will pretty much get you 10,000 miles between oil changes. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Supertech-Diesel-Exhaust-Fluid-2.5-Gallons/44457724

It's not the urea, its the extra 50 cents per gallon of legal diesel fuel. when gas is $2/gallon, and diesel is $2.50 that's an extra $6.50 per fill up compared to a gas car, which would be another 3.25 gallons of fuel. that's the equivalent to a 24.66mpg gasoline car.

Here, currently, diesel is 2.29 per gallon, gas is 1.78/gal.

Thats crazy Bob, must be very regional then. Like I posted most of the time for me diesel has been cheaper. Maybe it has to do with the fuel taxes in different states. This is normal diesel 2 price btw not cheating and using "red dye" ag diesel or anything. If diesel was 50 cents more a gallon no way I would own one.

Besides the usual car ADD about how I want another race car/a truck/a racing go kart/autocross machine etc I can't imagine a daily driver that is better/I would enjoy more. I'd love to keep the car and drive to hundreds of thousands of miles IF it doesn't fall apart in very expensive ways continually :P

Bobzilla wrote: It's not the urea, its the extra 50 cents per gallon of legal diesel fuel. when gas is $2/gallon, and diesel is $2.50 that's an extra $6.50 per fill up compared to a gas car, which would be another 3.25 gallons of fuel. that's the equivalent to a 24.66mpg gasoline car. Here, currently, diesel is 2.29 per gallon, gas is 1.78/gal.

I think the standard E350 uses premium fuel only.. which is comparable to Diesel in cost and he would get less MPG on gas. So it's less than a wash. Had he bought the car new, the cost of the engine would have never recouped the costs, but buying used, I am not sure it matters.

I have also noticed that diesels do tend to need less maintenance over the long run than gas and because they are overbuilt, last longer.

mad_machine wrote:

Bobzilla wrote: It's not the urea, its the extra 50 cents per gallon of legal diesel fuel. when gas is $2/gallon, and diesel is $2.50 that's an extra $6.50 per fill up compared to a gas car, which would be another 3.25 gallons of fuel. that's the equivalent to a 24.66mpg gasoline car. Here, currently, diesel is 2.29 per gallon, gas is 1.78/gal.

I think the standard E350 uses premium fuel only.. which is comparable to Diesel in cost and he would get less MPG on gas. So it's less than a wash. Had he bought the car new, the cost of the engine would have never recouped the costs, but buying used, I am not sure it matters. I have also noticed that diesels do tend to need less maintenance over the long run than gas and because they are overbuilt, last longer.

I thought the comment was "no non-german 30+mpg cars". I wouldn't buy a gas merc any day of hte week. Ah hell nah! I ain't got "f you money"/

Well honestly finally escaping from California will likely change my perspective of what things cost a lot. Nothing about Socal is cheap.

Oddly enough, since the gas tax hike, diesel is cheaper than regular at most of the stations near my work in central NJ (gas prices vary a lot in NJ depending on where you are; cheaper in the south, pricier in the north).

Roughly equal to premium in PA.

When I drove the car out from arkansas it was like sub 2 dollars a gallon in the midwest and almost 3 dollars a gallon out west at the time

I honestly can't say that I've gotten your question right. I've let go of cars that probably served their new owners well for years. I've also held onto some too long, sunk a ton into them, and then didn't get anything for them when it came time to sell. I recently bailed on a 2014 because its complexity and reliability based on the forums I frequent scared me away from long-term ownership.

I did learn that selling something in the $1.5k range invites tire-kickers who expect the car to be perfect. I've found the $3-6k range is an ideal place to sell. But I've also learned that the chaos of frequently bailing and buying something else rarely saves money, as any used car will need repair/maintenance work.

Since you obviously love the car, I'd look to hold onto it to recoup some of your recent expenditures by using the car. Maybe look at the used market to see what some of the key decision points will be (i.e. just prior to a major service, before 100k, etc.). I always go into a vehicle with a longer-term plan of how long to keep it, and then adjust as the situation changes.

Nice car+ignore noncritical problem+repeat a couple times= junk car.

Or, put another way, exactly the kind of thing that people let go of for WAAAAY under what a 'good' one costs to a GRM'er like myself who fixes everything important at $0/hr labor and ends up with a car that's 90% as good as a dealer-maintained one for 30% of the cost. But i do catch your drift as i alluded to in my first sentence.