ABS: Is there a Grassroots way to disconnect?

Folks,

So I was driving my '99 F150 in the big snow storm yesterday, and it didn't want to stop on snow/ice. (Brakes are in good condition and tires are near new.)

The ABS was chattering away but the damn thing wouldn't stop. I learned how to winter drive beaucoup years ago in the wilds of N. Michigan, and I know I coulda got it stopped with pedal modulation.

Is there a grassroots way to put the ABS on a toggle switch?

TIA,

Rog Smith

Yes. I would just run a switch after the fuse to the ABS module. You can put another fuse before or after the switch if you'd like to protect the module further, I'm not an electrician. Make sure it can handle the load.

Good luck getting it to stop faster than the ABS can. Can you pump 24 times per second?

ABS is worse on snow than non-abs, because the snow will pile up in front of the tires, and it usually takes more slip than the abs will allow to slow down on snow

then theres also the issue like on the rsx-s where its got 3 channel, 4 sensor ABS. guess which end only gets one channel? wanna guess what happens when you're trail braking through the cones and lift a wheel? yep, the rear brakes turn off and you start plowing

Strizzo wrote: ABS is worse on snow than non-abs, because the snow will pile up in front of the tires, and it usually takes more slip than the abs will allow to slow down on snow then theres also the issue like on the rsx-s where its got 3 channel, 4 sensor ABS. guess which end only gets one channel? wanna guess what happens when you're trail braking through the cones and lift a wheel? yep, the rear brakes turn off and you start plowing

Strizzo's right. Next winter (or depending where you are, today) take a shovel outside and push it in the snow. You'll get a couple of feet and suddenly the resistance will build up so fast you won't be able to move any further. ABS = teh suxorz in the snow for stopping short.

From another Michigander who learned to drive in the back woods without ABS.....

throw the fuse away and forget it. abs has caused me more panic than its worth

Worse thing I ever drove was a Ford van that had ABS on the rear only. Supposedly done to prevent spinout. Great, so the fronts lock up and you can't steer.

The proper GRM way to handle this is sell the new fangled ABS equip truck and to buy an older cheaper truck that never came with ABS in the first place or maybe two.

If there isn't a fuse just for abs unplugging one of the wheel speed sensors will disable the system. You'll have a big yellow abs light in your face, though.

skruffy wrote: If there isn't a fuse just for abs unplugging one of the wheel speed sensors will disable the system. You'll have a big yellow abs light in your face, though.

you will with the fuse too. ask me how i know.

is your 99 rear wheel only with drums in the back or the 4w/4 wheel disc? if its like my 98 (might not be as there was a "refreshing" in 99) and rear- only, the fuse for the abs is the same one for the brake light switch. so disable abs, and also disable brake lights. the 4w ABS trucks had a separate fuse (or at least one with something less important than brake lights with it) for the ABS module. check your owners manual for the function and a map of your fuse boxes.

@iceracer: my 98 was a rear-only truck, totally berkleying worthless. if you hit an expansion joint and the back tires skip for a second, it doesn't pump the brakes, just basically lets go. so you're coming to a stop and "BUMP" then it feels like the brakes just quit, not a reassuring feeling.

i can also tell you that it only takes about three 60-0 stops to fade the stock brakes....

jstein77 wrote: Good luck getting it to stop faster than the ABS can. Can you pump 24 times per second?

The purpose of ABS is not to stop quicker, but for maintaining control. My Civic on all seasons in 4" of powder stops 40 feet shorter from 60 with the ABS off.

yes, I discovered the fun of that in my saab this winter in one of our rare storms.. I think I will be including a cut off switch this summer. Wonder if I should make it so it resets everytime the car restarts?

What the heck would I know about driving in snow? I've lived in Florida for the past 29 years. I should have kept my mouth shut - sorry!

jstein77 wrote: Good luck getting it to stop faster than the ABS can. Can you pump 24 times per second?

It's not about pumping. It's about holding it at threshold.

ValuePack wrote:

jstein77 wrote: Good luck getting it to stop faster than the ABS can. Can you pump 24 times per second?

The purpose of ABS is not to stop quicker, but for maintaining control.

Now all we have to do is remind the idiots to turn the steering wheel. The little Latina that hit me never even considered heading over to the shoulder, until it was too late. Now I got this:

Had to pay for it m'self...she was on Allstate, and they insisted on totaling it. I didn't have lawyers big enough to explain just why:

1.) A2s are collectable cars, even though they're not antiques yet, and.. 2.) This is my car, and I don't want anything else.

ValuePack wrote: My Civic on all seasons in 4" of powder stops 40 feet shorter from 60 with the ABS off.

Two thumbs up.

jstein77 wrote: What the heck would I know about driving in snow? I've lived in Florida for the past 29 years. I should have kept my mouth shut - sorry!

Nah, you're just looking at it from an engineer's standpoint.

A lot of these things are good for "civilians", but only when they know how to use them properly. The girl that hit me did so on a bright sunny day. The road was dry, but she was on the `phone and just didn't realize the light had just turned green, and everyone in front of her had been stopped for the red just a couple o' seconds before. I'm thankful I didn't have ABS...if I hadn't been able to threshold brake after the impact, she would have knocked me into the truck in front of me, and I would have had to pay to have both ends of the car unbent.

On my car, I believe brake bias is controlled through the same system as ABS. That plan would make even more sense on a pick-up, due to larger changes in load.

With the ABS relay removed, I basically have no rear brakes.

YMMV, I am not a engineer, I just play one on TV.

friedgreencorrado wrote: Had to pay for it m'self...she was on Allstate, and they insisted on totaling it. I didn't have lawyers big enough to explain just why: 1.) A2s are collectable cars, even though they're not antiques yet, and.. 2.) This is my car, and I don't want anything else.

You can deal through your own insurance company, then they fight the other company for the money. Also if they total it, and you buy it back for $50-100 then it should not get a salvage title.

One of my friends just had to go through his own company (State Farm) on a claim. The other persons insurance (Progressive) would not budge above $4000 for his '02 Accord EX coupe with 85k on it. They claimed other similar cars in his area were at $5000 (LX coupes with 2x the mileage) and that he could talk them down $1000. After a couple weeks he called his own company who cut him a check the same day for $7800 and filed a lawsuit against Progressive, because they had towed the car from Iowa to Kansas City without permission and before my friend even had a chance to get his stuff out of the car.

As for disableing ABS, a switch on the fuse ckt should be quick and easy, if the fuse is used for other things, tap into the power wire for the ABS module. The system should run on the mechanical defaults, and have fully functional brakes.

bludroptop, what kind of car, I can check out how the ABS system works on it.

xci_ed6 wrote:

friedgreencorrado wrote: Had to pay for it m'self...she was on Allstate, and they insisted on totaling it. I didn't have lawyers big enough to explain just why: 1.) A2s are collectable cars, even though they're not antiques yet, and.. 2.) This is my car, and I don't want anything else.

You can deal through your own insurance company, then they fight the other company for the money. Also if they total it, and you buy it back for $50-100 then it should not get a salvage title.

Well, I don't have full coverage. Only way I can keep three on the street, and still pay the child support. It's a done deal now, but for the future (Atlanta's like stage rally...it's not if, it's when) I'm curious about the buyback..isn't it always a salvage title, even if I buy it myself?

friedgreencorrado wrote:

xci_ed6 wrote:

friedgreencorrado wrote: Had to pay for it m'self...she was on Allstate, and they insisted on totaling it. I didn't have lawyers big enough to explain just why: 1.) A2s are collectable cars, even though they're not antiques yet, and.. 2.) This is my car, and I don't want anything else.

You can deal through your own insurance company, then they fight the other company for the money. Also if they total it, and you buy it back for $50-100 then it should not get a salvage title.

Well, I don't have full coverage. Only way I can keep three on the street, and still pay the child support. It's a done deal now, but for the future (Atlanta's like stage rally...it's not if, it's when) I'm curious about the buyback..isn't it always a salvage title, even if I buy it myself?

Not my style but when the insurance company is jerking you around I have heard that the words "my neck hurts" tends to get them off their ass. Especially if you were rear ended.

The horrible 80's - 90's Audi ABS system has a button on the dash for this purpose, what a smart design. Apparently lawyers made this feature go away after the early 90's. For me it got annoying to hit that button every time you start the car, so the ABS relay now lives in the garage. The ABS light got annoying so a piece of black electrical tape fixed that, it is an electrical problem after all.

Folks,

Thanks for all the great info.

The truck is a 99 4x4 F150.

Can anyone direct me to a website that would have the wiring diagram for this vehicle?

BTW: I took the Bridgestone winter driving class last winter using Camry's and 4-Runners. Lotsa fun. The instructors call ABS: "Allows Braking and Steering" and then show all of us how it increases stopping distance over pedal modulation. The rest of the class is run with the ABS OFF. If anyone is in Steamboat during the winter: The class is worth every penny.

Thanks again,

Rog

99 f150 4wd 5.4 w/ 4wabs