Anyone try taking a Wrangler around corners?

I've seen XJs get thrown into autocross, but I'm curious about its 4WD BoF brother.

With pretty wide tracks and the engine almost behind the front axle, does that say potential? Just curious

I imagine a TJ given similar treatment as infamous XJ-R or Team Petty Cash's LeMons XJ would probably do ok. The TJ is heavier but not by a lot if I remember right. A leaf sprung YJ would probably be a trickier starting point. And I assume you weren't thinking JK.

Of course the nuclear option of Corvette frame swap is on the table as well.

Yeah, was thinking that the TJ or YJ would be better options since the JK seems more heavy

Would a YJ be difficult to convert to coilovers?

I mean, there's this one, but there's not a whole lot of Jeep left anymore

I like the idea of turning an early Wrangler into a rallycross car.  I'd ditch the solid axles in favor of something built around Subaru struts and Mazda running gear, just because it's easy to find limited slips for the 7" and Mazda used the same spline/axle/diff stuff across a huge range of vehicles, both front and rear wheel drive, so there should be a Lego-like ability.  Subaru struts will bolt to Mazda uprights with a little hole relocation.

The whole idea is to get the thing as low as a car, without sacrificing suspension travel, and also killing a bunch of unsprung weight.  Probably would want to use 62cm tires as well (like 185/65-15).

Oh, I'd also ditch the Jeep engine in favor of a newer 2.4l.

You can see why I never actually will DO this... but it's fun to think about.

Aren't most of the XJ's that have been converted the RWD brothers? I think that is a big one.

bmw88rider said:

Aren't most of the XJ's that have been converted the RWD brothers? I think that is a big one.

Id still love to see an XJ modified into an Archer Brothers Comanche style road race build. I know there was one or two done but i cant find photos.

In reply to bmw88rider :

Here's the thing though. Unlike most 2wd pickups and SUVs, the 2wd XJ was a huge afterthought. Mostly meant for mail duty then somebody figured out they could sell them in the low snow parts of the country. So the 2wd XJs literally just have a beam axle that uses the exact same pickup points as the 4wd axle. Of course most raced prepped have some negative camber built into the axle by adding a bend to the center. Can't really pull that off if you have a diff and axle shafts to worry about.

Also I remember that yellow flat fender was purely a rule exploit. The rules said the wheelbase had to match the body and the body had to vaguely look like what you said the car was. So he found the closest stock wheelbase to the minimum for the class. 

Daylan C said:

In reply to bmw88rider :

Also I remember that yellow flat fender was purely a rule exploit. The rules said the wheelbase had to match the body and the body had to vaguely look like what you said the car was. So he found the closest stock wheelbase to the minimum for the class. 

Yeah, it's an E/Mod (or maybe D/Mod car) which frequently tend to be silhouette cars. Look at loosecannon's MGB as well. I just thought it was funny and kind of relevant.

I do have a friend building a 1998 Grand Cherokee 5.9 Limited for autocross use in E/Street Prepared. That's the one-year only ZJ with the 5.9 Magnum and AWD. SCCA said it was legal as long as it hit height-by-width requirements. He found that swapping from an SUV-sized tire to a car-sized tire got a lot of the height drop that he needed. Then he found that a certain year diesel F-350 front coil spring is the same seat diameter as the ZJ spring, so he bought two, sliced them in half and had much stiffer springs for the front and rear to minimize body roll and get a significant drop.

I've toyed with this idea in my head before, too. It seems to me that while possible to do a YJ, the TJ is probably the earliest you'd want to do. From what I've read, upgraded shocks (like Fox), bigger sways, and car-type tires give you something that at least handles a little better than a skyscraper in a hurricane. There used to be a forum called "street jeeps" or something which was dedicated to doing non-brodozer builds. I think its defunct now.  

TJ suspension is pretty similar to what I've got in my ZJ (same starting point as the one NickD mentioned).  And the front is the same as an XJ too.  So it's definitely very possible to make the suspension work from a performance perspective.  The biggest issue for autocross is the height vs width thing (which is probably easier to solve with a Wrangler).  On my ZJ, I still don't meet the rule with tires within a 1/2" of stock diameter, track widened by 1.75" up front, 2.25" in the rear and the roof rack stripped.  It's not all that far off though, so it wouldn't be hard to get there (but pushing the tires out further would risk fender interference).  

If I had time and money I'd have a TJ built to turn. Lowered as far as the beam axle allows, 25ish diameter tires, stiff springs and good shocks. I don't think it would be the fastest thing around a corner, but better than stock. And hell, it would weigh just 200lbs more than a similar year 2nd gen Impreza 2.5 and have 25 more hp.

2wd XJ front beam axle should be a direct swap into a TJ. Ditch the TJ transfer case and trans for the 2wd XJ stuff as well and have a longer rear drive shaft made. Depending on how much its lowered you would need modify the track bar mount on the frame and control arm mounts on the axles to keep the suspension geometry happy. 

Keeping the 4wd axle might be doable but it its going to be more work to correct the front driveshaft angle. Camber can still be changed using offset ball joints.  

For a while I wanted to do a YJ body on a TJ frame with the renegade body kit. Later TJ's came with the dodge 2.4L so I wanted to add some turbo parts from an SRT4.

I planned to do this thing for years. The desire eventually faded (and that was before i flipped a cj-7!), but i still think it's cool.  I've turned fairly hard in a Wrangler before and it's highly disconcerting, but i think if i did it enough to be comfortable with what's actually dangerous (in terms of lifting inside tires) i'd start having a lot of fun. The short wheelbase gives it some natural immediacy once the wheel is yanked. 

If it were purely a street jeep i'd strongly consider the XJ 2wd axle swap to get the easy camber. You can do it with ball joints too but that doesn't get you the huge weight loss. And Wranglers are already pretty light once you take the doors/top/tailgate off. Low 3000s iirc. 

I don't think the 4wd would help on pavement so I'd definitely do the XJ 2wd axle swap. There may have been 2wd TJs used as mail jeeps aswell so there is that to consider.

I I was gonna do it...

Take the roadkill jeep rod (early jeep, you can still get them cheap)

But make the suspension actually designed worth a crap. Chevy v8 into a straight cut 4 speed with a quick-change rear...  

I passed a red JK Unlimited the other day that was lowered with chrome 18s and a cammed v8 swap. Snapped my neck for sure.

I am currently driving a 2wd 4runner as a rental car.  Florida special..   I figure they are out there and woudl make good rally cross vehicles...

My TJ will do this on a sharp turn while applying throttle.  Not saying it can't be fixed, but there's something about the suspension dynamics of the short wheel base, with a rear locker, that makes lifting a front wheel a common thing.  There's plenty of videos and photos of folks that have flopped them on the side just driving in a circle in a parking lot.

Or just buy a Mini Moke and start with a teenie tiny runabout with go-kart handling, but looks like a Jeep.

Plenty of Corvette swaps.  

I'm partial to the Corveep Jeepster.

 

KyAllroad (Jeremy) said:

Or just buy a Mini Moke and start with a teenie tiny runabout with go-kart handling, but looks like a Jeep.

... then stick a Honda B-Series in it.

In reply to bigdaddylee82 :

My 78 CJ Renegade with locker would routinely drive on two wheels.  I couldn't figure out what that strange settling of the suspension was until a friend told me it was on two wheels.  I slowed slightly after that.