BMW, you are dead to me. DEAD! I say...

I, in no uncertain terms, rage with unmitigated HATE, in every possibly conceivable way, at any vehicle that doesnt operate with a true, 3 pedaled, h pattern, traditional gearbox. As someone saddled with a DD utilizing a WOEFULLY uninspiring 4 sp+OD mated to a really great motor, I can speak from a platform of unadulterated authority when I proclaim it SHOULD BE A CAPITAL CRIME for any car manufacturer to NOT offer a REAL manual transmission on any automobile - sedan, coupe, roadster, truck, chicken, whatever - posessing an internal combustion engine, and the necessary accoutrements for transporting a human being of earthly decent (non-earthly humans need not apply).

An SR20 is a terrible thing to waste, and thats the simple NA 4 Banger in my slightly overweight DD sedan. Our Terrain possesses 300+ HP...and while the 6 speed slushie its bolted to isnt too bad, and manuamatic in the thing could possibly be worse...both cars still blow donkey balls.

Beemer? I wouldnt own a new one, ever

I hear THIS comment all the time. "OMGWTFBBQ! SO AND SO ISN'T OFFERING A MANUAL TRANSMISSION! I couldn't afford one new, but I would buy one used if they offered a row-your-own gearbox!"

Almost inevitably, the person(s) making this comment would never buy the car new in the first place and are perfectly content to go back to rowing their own gears in their clapped-out '95 Miata.

BMW made a smart business decision. The manual transmission, my fellow gear-loving friends, is nearly dead. The vast bulk of car shoppers don't want to row their own gears and utilize a third pedal. And BMW sure can't afford to design a car specifically for the 10-15-year-old used vehicle market, can they?

I suppose you cant build cars for the used market...but as long as there are turbo Regals and Cruzes, and V8 Caddies available with a manual, I guess I know which dealerships Id head to if the purchase were solely up to me (damnit marriage ). I wont set foot onto a BMW lot now. So, I suppose there may be merit in their decision, but it certainly closes the door on a segment of buyers.

In reply to Sky_Render:

You've nailed it.

I am the lucky owner of a 2004 Acura TL with a 6 speed manual that the enthusiast clammored for and then refused to buy new. Would I pay $40K for such a car? No, but I'd pay $10K. Doesn't help Acura any.

Oh, and calling a Bimmer a Beemer is nails on a chalkboard.

Sorry for calling them Beemers. I will begin to refer to them as german turds from now on...thank you for pointing out my error

i though it was pronounced douchemobile.

I am sure the SMG/DSG type boxes are very good but I will never buy one for myself. I always go back to that US Top Gear when they brought cars to Trump and that Lambo was bucking and crap in traffic. I spend most of my time during the week in traffic and having a car acting like that would drive me nuts. Besides that, all of the clutches in the cars I have had have lasted well over 100K so the extra expence of fluid changes are not worth the hassle for me.

Then again I will probably never buy a new car so I am not helping with the disappearance of the stick at all.

In reply to Sky_Render:

The thing is, if I wanted to, I could afford one new. But BMW keeps continuing down a path of building cars I don't want.

Tim Baxter wrote: i though it was pronounced douchemobile.

I think thats the colloquial form of german-turd

Sky_Render wrote: The manual transmission, my fellow gear-loving friends, is nearly dead. The vast bulk of car shoppers don't want to row their own gears and utilize a third pedal.

Sorry bubba, but you're wrong there. Take rates of manuals in 2012 is double what it was in 2011 and Ford has had to drastically increase production of it's manuals to meet demand. People enjoy driving a stick, and those people are buying new cars. I will be one of them depending on what Mazda comes out with in the next 2-3 years (hoping for Sky-D manual Mazda5 or Mazda6 wagon).

I really think a Cruze Eco is in my future - turbo and 6 speed manual thankyouverymuch ...if theyre still available new in about 3 years

Steve Chryssos wrote: I guess BMW just isn't an enthusiast brand anymore.

Have you looked at the "lineup" on their website lately? There's only 5 M-cars, the M3 that's out-of-production, the M5 that has to play pre-recorded engine noise through the radio (and it's M6 sister), and the two twilight-zone M SUV's. The regular cars? They are dominated by "Gran Turismo" bodystyles (stilt-legged 4-door hatchbacks, hello AMC Eagle!), SUV's, AWD Audi-wannabees, and Hybrids. Hardly any manual transmissions anywhere, no M-Coupe, no 1M, no Z4M, etc, etc. BMW jumped the shark a long, long time ago. Why do you think Audi is doing so well? (S and RS versions of nearly everything, manual transmissions galore, sport trims, actual wagons, and a supercar!)

Javelin wrote:

Sky_Render wrote: The manual transmission, my fellow gear-loving friends, is nearly dead. The vast bulk of car shoppers don't want to row their own gears and utilize a third pedal.

Sorry bubba, but you're wrong there. Take rates of manuals in 2012 is double what it was in 2011 and Ford has had to drastically increase production of it's manuals to meet *demand*. People *enjoy* driving a stick, and those people are buying new cars. I will be one of them depending on what Mazda comes out with in the next 2-3 years (hoping for Sky-D manual Mazda5 or Mazda6 wagon).

Where did you get this info from? I would argue that is because Ford is one of the few manufacturers that still offers a manual transmission. So the 1% of car buyers who insist on a manual go with Ford.

Example: My, that is a LOVELY M3. Can I get it in a manual transmission? No? I'm buying a Mustang 5.0, then.

Sky_Render wrote: Where did you get this info from? I would argue that is because Ford is one of the few manufacturers that still offers a manual transmission. So the 1% of car buyers who insist on a manual go with Ford.

http://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-edmunds-manual-transmission-20120731,0,5444149.story

Cars with manual transmissions are making a modest comeback, but with tens of millions of drivers lacking the ability to operate a stick shift, analysts don’t expect a big jump.

Auto Information company Edmunds.com says that vehicles equipped with manual transmissions accounted for 7% of autos sales so far this year. That compares to a 3.9% share of sales in all of 2011.

If the trend holds, the manual transmission share of auto sales will be the highest since 2006.

“A combination of factors – from the growing age of vehicle trade-ins bringing more manual drivers back to market, to a greater proportion of smaller cars on the road – is creating a small spike for stick shifts,” said Ivan Drury, an Edmunds.com analyst. “But even though manual cars are on the rise now, they’re on track to be virtually extinct in the next 15 to 20 years.”

Automakers are offering fewer vehicles that have a manual transmission as an option. Edmunds.com found that 64% of all 2012 model year vehicles are available only with automatic transmission. Ten years ago the number was a much smaller 48%.

Technology and pricing trends have ended some of the traditional advantages that manual transmissions had over automatics.

At one time, manual transmissions always achieved better fuel economy, but with the advent of six- and eight-speed automatic transmissions, that’s no longer a sure bet. Edmunds points out that the automatic version of the Ford Focus has better fuel economy than its manual sibling.

Similarly, a car with a manual transmission once was always less expensive than the same model in an automatic. Several General Motors vehicles, including the popular Chevrolet Cruze and the Cadillac CTS, now cost the same for both versions, according to Edmunds.com.

In reply to Sky_Render:

We had a thread on it a few months ago, a bumch of reports came out on Autoblog, Edmunds, etc showing the sales numbers. The take rate is abysmal overall (like 7% IIRC?), but when you looked at just cars that had a manual option it was huge, like 33%. The articles stated that Ford was selling double the number of stick Focii they expected. Wasn't just Ford, either. Take rate was up at GM, Audi, and others. This is all pre-Frisbee, too.

stuart in mn wrote: Automakers are offering fewer vehicles that have a manual transmission as an option. Edmunds.com found that 64% of all 2012 model year vehicles are available only with automatic transmission. Ten years ago the number was a much smaller 48%.

I'm actually surprised that percentage isn't higher.

In reply to Ian F:

That number is all light vehicles, so pickups are included.

Ian F wrote: In reply to Chris_V: I've had a bad experience with every automatic I've ever owned.

And I haven't. I've built automatics for racing and for street use and never had a problem. My BMW was still just fine at 185k. My tow rig uses a very nice autobox, and is still strong at 195k miles. My Range Rover had a fine automatic.

Maybe you guys out to not be so closed minded and try REAL cars with automatics rather than basic econoboxes. Like musclecars with shift-kitted autoboxes that can bark the tires in every gear and last for hundreds of thousands of miles.

I love and prefer a good manual trans, and every car I've bought new has had one, specifically. And any small engine car I'll ever own will have one. But there are a LOT of good autoboxes out there, too, in cars like my E38 and my old Pontiac Grans Le Mans:

and none of them would have been made any better with a manual trans. OTOH, my MINI Cooper would have been less fun with an automatic (I've driven the new Cooper with an automatic and it hunted for gears constantly). My Mustang could go either way without a problem. I chose the 5 speed manual to be different.

i'm kinda surprised nobody's mentioned that bmw manuals aren't all that great, either.

Well, the one in my E30 is notchy sweetness. Can't speak to the newer ones.

irish44j wrote: it's not a matter of "holding on to old technology." Driving a car with drum brakes doesn't make it more enjoyable. Driving a car with 3 pedals makes driving more enjoyable, no matter what the car is.

Well, that there is a solid "it depends". Sometimes, a manual is a serious hassle.

Funny story. The guy I work for has a capital-C Chevelle. It's currently getting a very high quality body restoration done (all metal, no filler, micrometer-even panel gaps everywhere, etc). Engine is going to be something north of 600ci, I get to do the EFI on it (oh, the PLANS I have...!) and he wanted to put one of those new 1200ft-lb rated 6-speeds in it.

We happen to have a customer who we'd done a nice big-block for his Road Runner. 11:1 511ci Mopar, 5-speed manual, 3.73 gears, the works. I really don't like driving it because there's no way to drive it gently. If you try to drive it normally then the engine falls to idle before you can crowbar the trans into the next gear, and rev-matching is difficult because it revs too quickly. You might as well call yourself Lurch. I bet it's sweet on a dragstrip, but on the street I always wind up chirping the tires from engine braking on every UPshift. But I figure, maybe this is just a "me" problem.

Anyway, we were talking about EFI options, and manual transmission and clutch options, and he happened to need to take the Mopar for a road test. He's gone for maybe ten minutes, and after he comes back, we start talking about 6L80s for his Chevelle. The trick part is, we're going to be putting a paddle shift mechanism on the vintage "staple" shifter, since just about every aftermarket trans controller will do paddle shifting.

Also having low maintenance costs and long component life are high on my list when it comes to transmission choice.

Oddly enough, MY reason for wanting an automatic in my personal car is because of the high maintenance costs and short component life associated with a manual transmission. The one in the car now, for example, makes mildly alarming bearing noises, grinds heavily on a 1-2 shift, cannot be downshifted into 2nd without a hefty over-rev-matched double clutch, and cannot be upshifted into 3rd over 5000rpm. And this is trans #2 for the year, I think my record was five one year.

Tim Baxter wrote: see if you can figure out how to adjust the dash light brightness without referring to the owner's manual. Or even after consulting the manual, can you remember the steps without having the manual open in front of you.

Go to the main iDrive menu, hit settings, scroll to vehicle settings, click lighting, adjust various interior light levels. Right off the top of my head.

That said, my cars have these complicated devices called "rheostats" that adjust dash light brightness. I vastly prefer them.