Crash Fatality in Honda "Kart"

JohnLClark said:

In reply to Cooter :

Exactly, I fear the exocet will be forced out of being able to make street legal kits.  

 

 

I don't think that will happen but they may have to change how they are titled and licensed.  I would much rather be in a crash in an Exocet than a 34 Ford,32 Ford, or even Model A or Lotus 7.  These vehicles are unlikely to be outlawed/banned.  Kits may need to marketed and have appearance similar to classic car and then be titled in that manner.  With side panels and fixed rear fenders the Exocet already looks similar to a Lotus 7 so marketing may change but there is always a way to work with or around a law.  Also Austarlian and UK laws can be much more restrictive and Exocets and similar cars are allowed there.

JohnLClark said:

In reply to Cooter :

Exactly, I fear the exocet will be forced out of being able to make street legal kits.  

 

 

I love the Exocet and want to build a K24 powered one dearly. 

Would I drive one on the street? Absolutely not (the occasional C&C) I felt uncomfortable driving my '90 Miata track rat on the street given the height of new cars. 

Some of you sound like old ladies. In a world that is increasingly risk averse, exo cars are all about DIY fun.  So how about a little context here? We've got one case of a fatality due to a significant extent to abysmal workmanship. That's one lousy death out of what,  22,000 every year?  And even with the terrible workmanship, it's probably safer than a motorcycle. The only thing especially bothersome here (all due respect to the drivers family notwithstanding) is that some grandstanding politicians might decide to take a stand on the issue. 

Kreb said:

Some of you sound like old ladies. In a world that is increasingly risk averse, exo cars are all about DIY fun.  So how about a little context here? We've got one case of a fatality due to a significant extent to abysmal workmanship. That's one lousy death out of what,  22,000 every year?  And even with the terrible workmanship, it's probably safer than a motorcycle. The only thing especially bothersome here (all due respect to the drivers family notwithstanding) is that some grandstanding politicians might decide to take a stand on the issue. 

 Do you have your M endorsement and used to commute in sub-freezing temps on it? 

I do and did. Everyone has a different risk tolerance. With rise of distracted driving and the risks for everyone, sorry I don't want to take that risk. 

Do you own an Exocet? Do you drive it to work daily? Or are you grandstanding like a bro while complaining the political pulpit will do the same?

Aaaannnnnnnddddd the thread just went to crap. Thanks. Leave politics out folks. Was a nice discussion until that showed up. 

In reply to Kreb :

Actually on the motorcycle thing I would imagine being thrown from a bike with the proper gear on is more safe than having something like that "quality" build in the op collapse on you. I would assume him being chucked from it is because he wasn't even belted in.


I'll openly admit my 26 year old truck is a deathtrap but I don't particularly care, and you still wouldn't see me climb into something like that once I got a look at the welds on the cage.

Motorcycles are safer than cars.

GRM exclusive.

With a properly built caged anything like that there are still safety concerns.  IMO, if there's any risk of you hitting the cage in a crash (especially with your head), that means it really needs to be driven in a helmet and harness, even on the street. 

Take a look again at the driver's compartment. Inside of it or not, there isn't any happy ending to that story. I ride ATGATT.  Even with all of my riding gear on I would rather be thrown from my bike than caught in (or thrown through) that pile of tubing. 

But back to my original point.  These things (and rail and tub buggies) have already been banned in Texas. What do you expect the Easy Button will be concerning these on the street?

Same as bikes and normal cars I suppose, if it can pass inspection there's no reason to keep it off the streets. The article even said it wasn't supposed to be street driven so I can't imagine a process to fix that aside from letting someone at the inspection station go to town on E36 M3ty welds with a sledgehammer, which I would be all for.

We all decide our own risk tolerance.  As long as we don't increase someone else's risk, that's OK.  None of you are complaining that Farah did that in an open face helmet and no arm restraints or neck restraint.  8-p

I fear other states following Texas's lead, myself. Especially with a few more accidents like this. It has all the makings of a win/win in the eyes of the general public. One photo would be all that is needed to convince the non-enthusiast that anything resembling one of these has no place on the street. And it is pretty easy to enforce, as well. It's not like checking bumper height or tread depth; you aren't going to blend in when your vehicle looks like a skeleton.  

I think it's going to be really tough to judge the quality of workmanship on something like this, and honestly- is that what we want law enforcement working on? I see trucks down here in south florida that are nearly 4 ft off of the ground, how is that safe? What about cars driving around with obvious home repairs after an accident? Who's going to check up on a car after it's been in an accident to make sure THOSE welds are ok? It's a slippery slope.  I suppose, something like this should have to go to the dmv to be certified just like a salvage title.  

z31maniac said:

Kreb said:

Some of you sound like old ladies. In a world that is increasingly risk averse, exo cars are all about DIY fun.  So how about a little context here? We've got one case of a fatality due to a significant extent to abysmal workmanship. That's one lousy death out of what,  22,000 every year?  And even with the terrible workmanship, it's probably safer than a motorcycle. The only thing especially bothersome here (all due respect to the drivers family notwithstanding) is that some grandstanding politicians might decide to take a stand on the issue. 

 Do you have your M endorsement and used to commute in sub-freezing temps on it? 

I do and did. Everyone has a different risk tolerance. With rise of distracted driving and the risks for everyone, sorry I don't want to take that risk. 

Do you own an Exocet? Do you drive it to work daily? Or are you grandstanding like a bro while complaining the political pulpit will do the same?

I've put in thousands of miles of enthusiastic + track time in a couple of Lotus 7 replicas with no added side impact protection. You would be hard pressed to find a more dangerous vehicle to go really fast in, so no, I'm not a wannabe grandstanding from his parents basement, if that's what you're visualizing. I didn't call out anyone individually, but the fact that you took my post so personally would suggest that it speaks to you, however negatively. 

Grizz said:

In reply to Kreb :

I'll openly admit my 26 year old truck is a deathtrap but I don't particularly care, and you still wouldn't see me climb into something like that once I got a look at the welds on the cage.

I agree. I know any real crash with my 78 with a modern vehicle signs my death certificate. I’ve seen what these look like afterwards and I have no gals sense of security about all the steel I’m surrounded in. I also ride a motorcycle that likes to remind me of my mortality in a daily basis. But some things even I wouldn’t do. 

Also who the hell let Farrah on track in a windowless thing in an open face and no arm restraints?

Kreb said:

z31maniac said:

Kreb said:

Some of you sound like old ladies. In a world that is increasingly risk averse, exo cars are all about DIY fun.  So how about a little context here? We've got one case of a fatality due to a significant extent to abysmal workmanship. That's one lousy death out of what,  22,000 every year?  And even with the terrible workmanship, it's probably safer than a motorcycle. The only thing especially bothersome here (all due respect to the drivers family notwithstanding) is that some grandstanding politicians might decide to take a stand on the issue. 

 Do you have your M endorsement and used to commute in sub-freezing temps on it? 

I do and did. Everyone has a different risk tolerance. With rise of distracted driving and the risks for everyone, sorry I don't want to take that risk. 

Do you own an Exocet? Do you drive it to work daily? Or are you grandstanding like a bro while complaining the political pulpit will do the same?

I've put in thousands of miles of enthusiastic + track time in a couple of Lotus 7 replicas with no added side impact protection. You would be hard pressed to find a more dangerous vehicle to go really fast in, so no, I'm not a wannabe grandstanding from his parents basement, if that's what you're visualizing. I didn't call out anyone individually, but the fact that you took my post so personally would suggest that it speaks to you, however negatively. 

I took issue with the "old ladies" comment. Many on this board are family men, they have a wife, children, elderly parents, etc. Don't denigrate them for not wanting to take unnecessary risks. 

If Johnny Law is faced with a situation of:

A. Having to certify/inspect welds

B. Outlawing on the basis of potential danger

they'll take B every time...

In reply to stroker :

Actually, here in Aus there is a pretty well organised program where significant modifications need to be signed off by an engineer. It’s a PITA for anyone who knows what they are doing, but it keeps this kind of crap off the road.  I’ve come to accept it as a better compromise than banning modified cars.

Bob the REAL oil guy. said:

Also who the hell let Farrah on track in a windowless thing in an open face and no arm restraints?

#GRIDLIFE

I don't mean to denigrate anyone's beliefs, quite the opposite. The man died living large in a car of his own construction and that's not all bad. I've got a family and a business too, and they live with the fact that I occasionally do crazy stuff, just as my mother and I had to deal with my fathers motorcycle racing habit. Wherever someone's risk threshold lies is fine with me. 

Nathan JansenvanDoorn said:

In reply to stroker :

 

Actually, here in Aus there is a pretty well organised program where significant modifications need to be signed off by an engineer. It’s a PITA for anyone who knows what they are doing, but it keeps this kind of crap off the road.  I’ve come to accept it as a better compromise than banning modified cars.

 

This is exactly what we need in this country. Many of us marvel at the amazing and WELL BUILT cars in Australia. There’s a reason the build quality is always so good! MCM does a great job of educating me of car laws. 

Kreb said:

I don't mean to denigrate anyone's beliefs, quite the opposite. The man died living large in a car of his own construction and that's not all bad. I've got a family and a business too, and they live with the fact that I occasionally do crazy stuff, just as my mother and I had to deal with my fathers motorcycle racing habit. Wherever someone's risk threshold lies is fine with me. 

The problem is that we say we take full responsibility. We say we want our freedom to build what we want. BUT, when something bad happens, some people suddenly switch sides and claim it's everyone else's fault. Also, if we do ourselves in driving our crazy car, will our family be as understanding ("he went out happy"), or will they sue the other driver, the event organizer, or the kit manufacturer?

You're right. But I don't trust our government to come up with something as sensible as the Australian approach. Much easier to just ban stuff, so my hope is that unique vehicles can just continue flying under the radar for the most part.   

In reply to stroker :

In Michigan and Ohio Johnny Law already is doing that.  I think the whole 'The sky is falling..." mentality is being overblown.  Yes there was a fatal crash involving a type of Exo car but to think it will have a serious impact on vehicle laws, registration, and kits is giving politicians too much credit.  There is no Civics lives matter activist groups keeping this issue in the public eye or demanding action.  This will be dead and forgotten outside the local area and those closely associated in less than a week or until the next media darling issue pops up.