Tk8398
Tk8398 Reader
9/27/19 11:52 p.m.

I pulled the engine out of my Subaru to fix some of the oil leaks, and one of them was the cam seal and o-ring, so I had to take the timing belt off.  Now, no matter what I tried I can't get the timing belt back on, if I line all the marks up and try to put the timing belt on it ends up two teeth off.  I have done this several times before with no problem that I can remember, but I have apparently lost the ability to do it.  I think I have probably ruined this engine by knocking the cam pulley off center and banging the valves into the pistons while fighting with the timing belt, I can get another long block for $200 from a wrecked car with 87k miles,. but I feel like I have exhausted all the skill I will ever have and can't get it back together, so I am not sure I shouldn't just give up and get rid of it.  Am I missing something obvious?  Or are they just extremely hard to do.  It feels like the timing belt is too short, but it was working before so that doesn't make sense.

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
9/28/19 7:01 a.m.

Unlikely you've smacked valves into pistons.  

You are leaving slack on the wrong end of the belt.  Make sure the belt stays snug on the crank, then the first cam, then across to the other cam, then onto the tensioner.  You may need more than two hands if you are fighting it.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner MegaDork
9/28/19 8:05 a.m.

Are you putting the belt on backwards? Have you compressed and pinned the tensioner (I think that’s an EJ22 thing)?

Aspen
Aspen HalfDork
9/28/19 12:00 p.m.

Tensioner, you need to compress it very very slowly and put a pin in it.

Some  ej22s are non interference, later ones are.

Tk8398
Tk8398 Reader
9/28/19 2:58 p.m.

I did compress the tensioner, I actually can't even get the belt on with the tensioner and both smooth idlers removed.  I was trying to put it on with the arrows pointing clockwise, and there are 43 teeth between the passenger side cam mark and the crank mark in that direction. This is a later one so its definitely an interference engine, so I am 99% sure it would at least need a couple of valves to run again.  I put the engine in the car about 20k miles ago with a new timing belt kit, and when I took it apart all of the idler bearings were noisy and there was quite a bit of wear on the outside surface of the timing belt, I don't recall it being this hard to install though.  

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner MegaDork
9/29/19 12:01 a.m.

You'd have to be pretty enthusiastic to bend a valve while turning the engine over by hand. I'd get that belt on and do a compression test.

100% sure you have the right routing?

Tk8398
Tk8398 Reader
9/29/19 12:31 p.m.

There is really only one way the belt can go on, and I did look at the service manual and multiple pictures to make sure I was doing it right.  The reason I think the valves are bent is that the passenger side cam doesn't have tension on it when the timing mark is lined up, but the drivers side one is balanced between being pushed one way or the other by the valve springs, and if you putt on the timing belt a little too hard it will forcibly snap in one direction or the other and there isn't any way to lock it firmly other than just using something wedged through the holes in the pulley that doesn't work very well.  If I can't figure it out I will probably just get another long block and reseal everything and take it to a shop to have the timing belt put on and not try to do it by myself again.  Idk why I can't seem to do it, I have done it a number of times and I don't remember having any problems and as far as I can tell I'm doing the same thing, I will be 36 in link a month and a half but that shouldn't be too old to work on cars anymore lol.

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy MegaDork
9/29/19 1:29 p.m.

In reply to Tk8398 :

Thats exactly how it should feel.  Also, most Subs are not timed at TDC, so there's no piston to hit.  Get a friend to hold E36 M3 in place while you thread the belt.

mikeatrpi
mikeatrpi HalfDork
9/29/19 1:37 p.m.

Its probably not correct but my last subaru belt i installed one of the idlers last.  Its tight even before you pull the pin

Tk8398
Tk8398 Reader
9/29/19 3:37 p.m.

I finally figured out how to do it, or at least one way that works.  First put it on the drivers side cam pulley and hold the belt and pulley in place, then put it in place along the bottom and around to the passenger side cam, then turn the crank back a couple teeth until all the marks line up.  Then, turn the drivers side pulley and crank toward each other to pull the belt tight and install the tensioner, then do the same with the crank and passenger side cam pulley but the opposite way to loosen the belt on the bottom and put the last idler in. 

dansxr2
dansxr2 Dork
9/29/19 8:29 p.m.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :  or use zipties through the cam gears.

 

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