Holy body Rolly!

Just for fun, here's a pic of my Miata (the blue one) this past Sunday at a track day at Waterford Hills in Michigan. My car is basically stock, and still street driven. However, I do have an Addco sway bar (whichever one they gave me) on the front, AGX 8-way's and Kuhmo V710's, and I put Hawk Blue/Black pads on for the day. I knew I had body roll, but I didn't think it was this bad, when compared to a Spec Miata (the orange car in front of me).

Now I'm really wanting a Spec Miata suspension. Eventually, it will be a Spec Miata-when times get better...

350 lb/in front springs, Koni sports, RB hollow bar and poly bushings=

700 lb/in front springs, Koni 2812, RB hollow bar and delrin bushings=

In reply to Kramer:

I've got a full SM package sitting in my garage, PM me to discuss...

psh, body roll...

When he said body roll I thought he meant this type:

Up to a point body roll isn't a huge evil. Have you ever riden in a Spec Miata? I'm not thinking you'd like that on the street

You should see a stock NC!

This is an interesting setup. Dual springs: 650/300 front and 425/300 rear. So you get some initial roll, then it digs in. I think it's faster than a Spec Miata with an equivalent driver, but most Spec drivers are faster than I am!

Tell us about the dual springs. I ran eibach spring tenders with value for a long time on a Z but I haven't seen them available anywhere recently.

H&R race springs - 850f/280r (w/ bilstein shocks)

These are actually both active springs, they're not just tenders. The 300 lb springs are still active at normal ride height. I put them on as an experiment to see how they'd work. For the Targa, I think they'd be great. There's a soft edge to impacts and of course the car gets full suspension travel because the springs will extend the shock fully - and those shocks have a fair bit of extension available. The downside is that they are initially soft, so you get a bit of roll before the car settles. Seemed to work pretty well at Laguna and would probably work even better on a rough track, but Janel prefers the faster reflexes of the 750 lb front, 450 lb rear setup I ran before.

We have a couple of cars here that use a 112 lb helper spring. They're just barely compressed at rest, so they're not active on compression and the car runs on the primary springs most of the time. But a 112 lb spring is still strong enough to extend a shock, so we get more extension. Using the weak 5 to 20 lb "helpers" that some people use isn't going to work, they're just not strong enough to extend the shock so they only look cool when the car is on jackstands.

Eibach helpers are still available, Ground Control lists them. I'm going to try a set with a 150 lb rate so they're not as active under compression.

That is nothing. Check out the video of the 2009 UAH Moonbuggy below. Disclaimer I had nothing to do with the design of that suspension.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFc3DALBTDM

This is what tired old rubber cones for springs, no sway bars and really sticky tires gets you.

Where's that pic of the Greenbrier autocrossing?

Here it is.

I see your body roll, and raise you jacking effect and wheel tuck:

here is my lean....opps wrong pic.

Yep, that amount of body roll on a Miata with those mods looks about right. My last Miata, with Konis, ST front sway bar, and V700s looked about like that.

I've driven a Miata with Spec suspension for a fun run at an autocross. It was... better suited for the track than for autocross, I think. It was a while ago and I can't quite remember why I felt that way, so I won't try to BS a technical explanation. I'm not so sure I'd want to live with a Spec suspension on the street. I've had a couple of cars with street performance springs (Eibach Pro-Kit, etc.) that I enjoyed the performance, but wished for the stock ride quality. So if you can, test drive a Miata with a Spec suspension and see if it's something you can live with on the street.

Oh, and here's some body roll:

That's our body roll. The dog piss stance and an open diff RWD car don't mix. The Miata looks like a dream. Of course, it wasn't so bad at the end...

What's body roll?

Keith how do you have 2 springs active?

With the +value tender springs I got a the softness to take the edge off and to give better grip on a rough surface and in the rain and when it compressed (leaned enough) I got into the stronger spring to limit travel. Basically I got to run with a soft spring on the street and then used the more aggressive springs when I drove the car in anger. Really the best of 2 worlds. I was worried that there would be a jolt as the main spring activated but found it was a very gentle transition.

I really liked that and contacted GC about something like that for my S2000 but after innumerable phone calls and weeks later I was told they don't carry the tender springs in +values anymore.

I was autocrossing a panther before it was cool! I think this car even had front and rear sway bars at the time.

This car was fun to watch. Huge body roll, and 4wd.

Koni Yellows, Neuspeed SofSports (sitting on the lower perches of the Konis) and Suspension Techniques Speedtech 22mm rear sway/lower tie

Soft springs, but not much lean per se. Car is actually very neutral at the limit, too.

is that an autocross, or a rallycross?

Don't the regs specifically prohibit mixed surface events?

Auto-x club (read: "small") on a de-commissioned airstrip on a military base. It's pretty grassy outside of the racing surface.

96DXCivic wrote: That is nothing. Check out the video of the 2009 UAH Moonbuggy below. Disclaimer I had nothing to do with the design of that suspension. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFc3DALBTDM

I was im class with the tall guy in this video the next day. he was on crutches from rolling the buggy over and being clipped into the pedals. But they did take first place in design and and presentation competition. turns out top speed handling wasn't one of the judgment criteria (apparently)