Are engine swaps with a greater number of cylinders then originally produced allowed or not?
Are engine swaps with a greater number of cylinders then originally produced allowed or not?
I don't think so. I had short dreams of a v8 1800, but realized it would end up in e-mod. What are thinking of building?
Dragging out my old Ranger and putting in a 302 I have.
2.3 turbo power FTW!
Don't have a 2.3 or a turbo.
I don't see the Ranger listed as being eligible for CP in Appendix A of the 2012 rulebook:
Ford & Mercury
Maverick & Comet (6-cyl & 8cyl) (1970-77) Mustang (6-cyl & 8-cyl) (1964-69) Mustang (6-cyl & 8-cyl) (1969-73) Mustang II (6-cyl & 8-cyl) (1974-78) Mustang (6-cyl & 8-cyl) (1979-93) Mustang Turbo & SVO (4-cyl) (1979-93) Mustang (w/o IRS) (1994-04) Mustang (2005-09) Thunderbird (V6 & TurboCoupe) (1983-88) Thunderbird (V6 & SuperCoupe) (1989-97)
Next problem:
"US-produced 4-cyl, 6-cyl, and 8-cyl engines manufactured by a particular corporation may be interchanged with ones of similar configuration from the same corporation..."
"Similar configuration is defined as having the same number and arrangement (e.g., V, Straight, Flat, etc.) of cylinders and camshafts (e.g. Dual Overhead)."
About the turbo 2.3: you can't add FI to any vehicle that didn't leave the factory with it. The Corvair Turbo, Mustang SVO, Turbocoupe, Supercoupe, Capri Turbo, Trans Am Turbo, and XR4Ti are the only FI vehicles I see eligible.
They already allow the Dakota and S10/S15... That was the next step was a rules submission request to have it added.
But the same idea applies to S10's. Can I stuff an LS/SB in between the fenders? I know a V8 was offered for the Dakota, so I can put in a SBM, Hemi, BBM or BBHemi, if I want to......
S10s are limited to V6 engines, no V8 swaps. Dakotas can have V8s as they came from the factory with that option.
From the rules:
S10, S15, & Sonoma (6-cyl) (1982-93) S10 & Sonoma (6-cyl) (1994-04).
Dakota 2WD (1987-96) Dakota 2WD (1997-2004).
Rangers could run in local regions but would need to be classified first before they would be eligible for Nationals, National Tour, and divisionals. They would most likely be V6 as well, maybe 4 cyl depending on how they get classified.
Will wrote: About the turbo 2.3: you can't add FI to any vehicle that didn't leave the factory with it. The Corvair Turbo, Mustang SVO, Turbocoupe, Supercoupe, Capri Turbo, Trans Am Turbo, and XR4Ti are the only FI vehicles I see eligible.
There are already CP cars running with FI that didn't come with it. It is legal to swap a late model EFI engine into a older Mustang, Camaros etc... There is a proposal out to allow the new Coyote and 4.6 OHC engines into earlier cars. Right now they are not the same configuration as the original engines in the older cars (they were 2 valve OHV ) Induction is pretty open, just has to fit under the hood. Forced Induction is restricted though to models you listed.
81cpcamaro wrote:Will wrote: About the turbo 2.3: you can't add FI to any vehicle that didn't leave the factory with it. The Corvair Turbo, Mustang SVO, Turbocoupe, Supercoupe, Capri Turbo, Trans Am Turbo, and XR4Ti are the only FI vehicles I see eligible.There are already CP cars running with FI that didn't come with it. It is legal to swap a late model EFI engine into a older Mustang, Camaros etc... Induction is pretty open, just has to fit under the hood. Forced Induction is restricted though to models you listed.
I meant it in the sense of forced induction.
Will wrote:81cpcamaro wrote:I meant it in the sense of forced induction.Will wrote: About the turbo 2.3: you can't add FI to any vehicle that didn't leave the factory with it. The Corvair Turbo, Mustang SVO, Turbocoupe, Supercoupe, Capri Turbo, Trans Am Turbo, and XR4Ti are the only FI vehicles I see eligible.There are already CP cars running with FI that didn't come with it. It is legal to swap a late model EFI engine into a older Mustang, Camaros etc... Induction is pretty open, just has to fit under the hood. Forced Induction is restricted though to models you listed.
As yes, I see that now. Sorry, I saw FI and though Fuel Injection.
Geez... No wonder this category suffers. Rules that make about as much sense as tits on a boar hog.
Ranger50 wrote: Geez... No wonder this category suffers. Rules that make about as much sense as tits on a boar hog.
Welcome to the SCCA! 
On the bright side, once you get it classified, your minimum weight with a V6 will be 2400# and there are plenty of natrually asperated GM V6s making 400+ HP. Just look for old NASCAR Grand National parts. 
cpdave wrote: On the bright side, once you get it classified, your minimum weight with a V6 will be 2400# and there are plenty of natrually asperated GM V6s making 400+ HP. Just look for old NASCAR Grand National parts.
Refer back to tits on boar hog comment or lipstick on a pig. Lightest I have seen a Ranger is 2600#.
The rulebook just needs adjustment. If you are going to allow v8's and they have a weight or any other combo, what chassis it is in really matter?
One of the recent Fasttracks proposed a fairly major change to the CP engine rules. July, or June at the earliest. That might solve your problem. If not, feel free to write a letter to the SEB and see if you can generate some interest.
I've been thinking about a CP engine build using a Chevy 5.3 aluminum block with a 4.8 crank, and bored out a bit to make 5.0 liters. That would earn a 300 pound weight break over engines >5.1 liters.
Ranger50 wrote: Geez... No wonder this category suffers. Rules that make about as much sense as tits on a boar hog.
Suffers? C-Prepared has one of the highest attendance numbers at Nationals and IIRC, the most out of all the Prepared classes.
The rules make sense to me. I don't understand your confusion.
Ranger50 wrote:cpdave wrote: On the bright side, once you get it classified, your minimum weight with a V6 will be 2400# and there are plenty of natrually asperated GM V6s making 400+ HP. Just look for old NASCAR Grand National parts.Refer back to tits on boar hog comment or lipstick on a pig. Lightest I have seen a Ranger is 2600#. The rulebook just needs adjustment. If you are going to allow v8's and they have a weight or any other combo, what chassis it is in really matter?
You can always run the Ranger in XP or EM with a V8. CP is not a all-out class, some of the rules are there to keep it separated from the Modified classes. Otherwise Prepared would become just like Modified. At first I thought a lot of the rules were odd, but after being in CP for 6+ years, they do make sense. Well, most do, there are a couple odd ones that make you wonder what someone did for that rule to come about.
Will wrote: I've been thinking about a CP engine build using a Chevy 5.3 aluminum block with a 4.8 crank, and bored out a bit to make 5.0 liters. That would earn a 300 pound weight break over engines >5.1 liters.
I thought of something similar, if I were ever to go down the CP path of insanity. Considering my current skillset, I'd have to team up with someone with lots of engineering/fabricating chops if I ever did.
The crappy thing is that a 4.8 crank in a 5.7l ls1 block is something like 5.15 liters displacement. I think the intention was specifically to prevent that combination and only allow old 302 Fords and 305 Chevys (and, "unfortunately" your idea) to have the weight break.
You have to choose between ~400-450hp and 2700lbs and perhaps up to 7-800hp and 3000lbs. These are my uneducated guesses...
81cpcamaro wrote: S10s are limited to V6 engines, no V8 swaps. S10, S15, & Sonoma (6-cyl) (1982-93) S10 & Sonoma (6-cyl) (1994-04).
hmmm....supah-charger torques booster 3.8 v6??? EFI to boot.
In reply to 81cpcamaro:
I don't want to run an all out class, which your other listed classes are. The rules of CP make sense up until you are stuck with like-kind engine options for your given chassis.
I wonder where/how the Typhoon and Cyclone fall under the CP rules...
Ian F wrote:Ranger50 wrote: Geez... No wonder this category suffers. Rules that make about as much sense as tits on a boar hog.Suffers? C-Prepared has one of the highest attendance numbers at Nationals and IIRC, the most out of all the Prepared classes. The rules make sense to me. I don't understand your confusion.
No, not CP specifically, but all AX classes. I have a few mods to my Dakota that kick me out of Stock, but after that I have to jump into CP. Why can't there be weight provisions for certain mods?
Ranger50, couldn't your Dakota run in ESP? or were the mods too much for that class? The Prepared rules are a stand alone set and aren't built off the Stock and Street Prepared rules (comes from way back when there was only Stock, Prepared and Modified classes). So there isn't always a logical progression from stock or SP. After SP usually SM is the next step.
Ian, the Typhoon/Syclone are not in CP due to the AWD part. I'm not sure what prepared class they fall into, probably XP?
4cylndrfury, only certain cars can have Boost, see the list Will posted. So I don't think you can boost a V6 in an S10.
Ranger50 wrote: I have a few mods to my Dakota that kick me out of Stock, but after that I have to jump into CP. Why can't there be weight provisions for certain mods?
There can be weight provisions if you lobby for them with the club. There is a process for that; use it, make your case in a logical and non-passionate manner and see if you influence the rules makers.
It may or may not make for changes because what you propose might also have an adverse effect on existing rules and their application to all the other competitors.
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