Is there a Ferrari that's not insanely difficult to maintain?

I too would like to own an F car one day. It's one on my long list of cars to own. That said, per the other Ferrari/Craigslist thread, I searched my local CL for fun and this car came up. If the quoted maintenance numbers are accurate, there may NOT be an F car in my future.

1987 Ferrari 328GTS (Gran Turismo Spider)
22000 miles
· Build date: December of 1986
· 16" Alloy Wheels
· 5 Speed Manual Transmission
· 3.2l V8
· Rear Mid-Engine Rear Wheel Drive
· Tan Leather Interior
· Ferrari Red
· Power windows
· Power locks
· Sony Cassette / AM FM Stereo
· "Targa" style removable top
· Aluminum Radiator Upgrade
· Custom built A/C System -- Complete
· Red Carpet
· All Previous Service Records
· All Due Services complete

New parts and service Including but not limited to:
A/C Retrofit
All new parts including:
Rotary style Compressor
New Barrier hoses
Condenser
Receiver/Dryer
Custom All aluminum radiator
$5000 Spent

Major 30k engine out service done at 22k
Hill engineering bearing update
all new seals/belts/hoses, etc.
degreed cams
adjust valves
Plugs/wires
fuel accumulator
fuel hoses
flush all fluids and replace filters
$16500 spent

http://smithmotorworks.com/item--1987-Ferrari-328-GTS---1987_ferrari_328GTS.html

• Extensive Service records since new.

1987 Ferrari 328 GTS - $42.5k

93EXCivic wrote:

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

93EXCivic wrote: IMHO I don't know why you would bother with a Mondial. There are a lot better cars that can be bought for less or the same money and don't have Ferrari parts cost.

There is always a better car for less money, remember the answer is either Miata, E36 M3, Jeep XJ or P71. Once we get past that and accept people don't always want the 'best' car, almost any car makes sense, unless it says Camry on the trunk of course.

Ok granted. But for the same price you could have a 911, Maserati Merak, Bentley Turbo R. Just cause it has a Prancing Horse doesn't make it worth bothering with.

You couldn't be more wrong. I've owned a number of Ferraris over the years(308 GT4, 308 QV, 308 GTB, 250 GTE, Mondial cab, Daytona, 550 Maranello,etc) and currently am running a 330 GTC. All of them were great fun and didn't require any excessive maintainence. I've had most of them on a track(Auto-X and roadcourses) and they worked very well. I daily drove a few of the 308s and one of the 250s for years without issue. On the carb cars, once they were dialed in they required very little other than to drive them. Fluid changes and services can be handled by the DIYers, although the mid-engined cars are a PITA. Genuine parts are expensive, however, as some have noted, there is some interchangibility. Fchat is a great resource. PPIs are a must, as are service records. Pay a bit extra for a good example unless you are getting a great deal and plan on doing all the work yourself and don't mind scrounging parts. Keep in mind that some parts are unavoidably expensive(like a frozen/cracked head on a 308) and interior stuff is very pricey. F-cars are special for a reason-do it!

dyintorace wrote: I too would like to own an F car one day. It's one on my long list of cars to own. That said, per the other Ferrari/Craigslist thread, I searched my local CL for fun and this car came up. If the quoted maintenance numbers are accurate, there may NOT be an F car in my future. 1987 Ferrari 328GTS (Gran Turismo Spider) 22000 miles · Build date: December of 1986 · 16" Alloy Wheels · 5 Speed Manual Transmission · 3.2l V8 · Rear Mid-Engine Rear Wheel Drive · Tan Leather Interior · Ferrari Red · Power windows · Power locks · Sony Cassette / AM FM Stereo · "Targa" style removable top · Aluminum Radiator Upgrade · Custom built A/C System -- Complete · Red Carpet · All Previous Service Records · All Due Services complete New parts and service Including but not limited to: A/C Retrofit All new parts including: Rotary style Compressor New Barrier hoses Condenser Receiver/Dryer Custom All aluminum radiator $5000 Spent Major 30k engine out service done at 22k Hill engineering bearing update all new seals/belts/hoses, etc. degreed cams adjust valves Plugs/wires fuel accumulator fuel hoses flush all fluids and replace filters $16500 spent http://smithmotorworks.com/item--1987-Ferrari-328-GTS---1987_ferrari_328GTS.html + Extensive Service records since new. 1987 Ferrari 328 GTS - $42.5k

I don't doubt that pricing-just understand that if you drive an F-car into a dealer or specialist, you WILL be paying full retail for labor and gennie parts. The 328 is a very reliable car and mine went years with minimal expense. Much of the service work can be done by the owner and better parts pricing can be obtained with some effort. I buy most of my parts from a couple independents and there hasn't been any big mystery to install them.

Ian F wrote:

93EXCivic wrote: Ok granted. But for the same price you could have a 911, Maserati Merak, Bentley Turbo R. Just cause it has a Prancing Horse doesn't make it worth bothering with.

To you, that may be so. But to most people, a car with a prancing horse on it is on an entirely different level than pretty much any other make. One of our friends has a 308 and I got a short ride in it a couple of years ago. At least from the passenger seat, it made my GT6 feel roomy... It also has basically zero storage space. He had to sacrifice the spare tire in order to carry enough luggage for him and his wife for the 4 day visit - and they had to pack very light. He mentioned selling it and looking for maybe a 360. When we left in the morning, he had to let it warm up for a good 10-15 minutes before he could drive it anywhere.

Don't get me wrong I would love a 308 but the Mondial seems to have all the disadvantages of a 308 without the looks and interior that seems to be straight out of a Fiat. Plus it was slow even for the time.

In reply to dyintorace:

Looking at the work done and parts - it wouldn't cost a GRMer/DIYer anything near those numbers - the radiator/ac upgrade could be done under $500. The big service with new cams might set you back 3000 - although I don't think new cams would have been necessary items - making it more like a $1000 job.

Check this out for some pricing I found:

http://www.ferraripartsexchange.com/3082Valveservicekit.htm

For the 30K mile service on a carbed 308 the parts are $977.13

http://www.ricambiamerica.com/index.php?cPath=40

I've had similar experiences with the porsche thus far - to hear some people talk, it can cost fthousands to do any significant task. I bought the car needing a front wiring harness and abs controller. The dealer parts cost would've been over $5000, and a local dealer would ask another couple thousand in labour. $325 on ebay, and I have the necessary parts. Two weekends, and it's done.

I've seen similar things happening with the 308's - some DIYers are remarkably resourceful and can own the cars on a not totally unreasonable budget. A good 308 has embarrassing appeal to me.

For comparison - the timing belt kit for a 32v porsche 928 is about $700. I would also bet that you could find cheaper alternatives to the $300 in hoses in the f-car service kit.

mblommel wrote: Check this out for some pricing I found: http://www.ferraripartsexchange.com/3082Valveservicekit.htm For the 30K mile service on a carbed 308 the parts are $977.13

No, not cheap, but looking at the individual parts costs, it really isn't that bad. Granted, they aren't showing a new distributor cap and I've heard those can be silly money. Still... As long as you know what you're getting yourself into I see that more as an encouragement rather than discouragement.

oldtin wrote: I would also bet that you could find cheaper alternatives to the $300 in hoses in the f-car service kit.

How do you see $300? I'm coming up with about $160, which isn't out of the ordinary if you've priced some obscure molded hoses recently.

The 30K service for the Wife's Highlander is about $790.

Honestly, why are you complaining? It isn't as if 30K would exactly creep up on you, its called planning ahead.

What is windshield cost and availability like for some of these cars? Its pretty unusual for most Italian car windshields to be under $800 if they are even still made, and I have seen some (Lamborghini espada for example), for well over $5k.

mblommel wrote: Check this out for some pricing I found: http://www.ferraripartsexchange.com/3082Valveservicekit.htm For the 30K mile service on a carbed 308 the parts are $977.13 http://www.ricambiamerica.com/index.php?cPath=40

Really doesn't sound that bad to me. I've seen pricing like that for plenty of mainstream cars.

Travis_K wrote: What is windshield cost and availability like for some of these cars? Its pretty unusual for most Italian car windshields to be under $800 if they are even still made, and I have seen some (Lamborghini espada for example), for well over $5k.

Don't break it. Unless you are sourcing crapcans like Toyotas, vintage windshields for exotics and less popular cars can be pricey. The windshield for my 69 CHP Polara was more expensive than the screen for my 308.

Ian F wrote: How do you see $300? I'm coming up with about $160, which isn't out of the ordinary if you've priced some obscure molded hoses recently.

you're right more like 160 - was just taking a quick glance. Point is you could do it for a little less - and even at that price, it's not off in left field and not really more than some modern appliancy things.

I couldn't resist:

http://www.gomiata.com/60kmimapa.html

The 60K one is like $280.

Seriously though, I had a friend who is no stranger to "affordable" exotic cars. He owned a 308GTBi. Beautiful car, but he said every time something needed repair it was always $1000 even with him DIY'ing it. He also said the driving dynamics weren't much to write home about. I think he described it as "an Italian C3 Corvette". I've always wanted a 308GTB just because I think they were one of the top 10 most beautiful cars ever made. Maybe I still will one day, but from what I've seen even the "affordable" F-cars require a good dose of discretionary income.

mblommel wrote: I couldn't resist: http://www.gomiata.com/60kmimapa.html The 60K one is like $280.

Sure, but Miatas are renowned for their inexpensive operating costs. The opposite end of the spectrum is the Mclaren F1 which is something like $5/mile just for scheduled maintenance.

$1000 for a 30,000 miles maint is not that bad. $1000 every month sucks though, it all depends on how often it needs repaired.

$1000/year in maintenance parts sounds almost feasible... I drive a bit over 30K/yr... assuming I'd have a back-up car for snow days...

Evil wheels turning...

forzav12 wrote:

Travis_K wrote: What is windshield cost and availability like for some of these cars? Its pretty unusual for most Italian car windshields to be under $800 if they are even still made, and I have seen some (Lamborghini espada for example), for well over $5k.

Don't break it. Unless you are sourcing crapcans like Toyotas, vintage windshields for exotics and less popular cars can be pricey. The windshield for my 69 CHP Polara was more expensive than the screen for my 308.

Yeah, I know they wouldn't be cheap, I ended up paying $750 or so to replace the windshield in my Milano. Where I live "dont break the windshield" means dont drive on the freeway, so that's kinda why i wondered.

Travis_K wrote:

forzav12 wrote:

Travis_K wrote: What is windshield cost and availability like for some of these cars? Its pretty unusual for most Italian car windshields to be under $800 if they are even still made, and I have seen some (Lamborghini espada for example), for well over $5k.

Don't break it. Unless you are sourcing crapcans like Toyotas, vintage windshields for exotics and less popular cars can be pricey. The windshield for my 69 CHP Polara was more expensive than the screen for my 308.

Yeah, I know they wouldn't be cheap, I ended up paying $750 or so to replace the windshield in my Milano. Where I live "dont break the windshield" means dont drive on the freeway, so that's kinda why i wondered.

Loved the Milano we owned! Just picked up a GTV-forgot how much fun Alfas are to drive.

It all depends on how badly you want one. Just as with any exotic car, if you buy one that's already up to date on maintenance, it won't be that bad, but if you choose poorly, it's going to cost. While I've never had one, I've known people that have, and they don't have to be that bad. Some of their prices are similar to the Alfa's I've owned, and others are stratospheric. If you maintain one though, you may not need the ones of stratospheric nature.

That said, there are good and bad Ferrari's for those on a budget. Like was said before, the 400's, or any of the 12cyl cars really, are going to cost more if you pick one that needs work or needs delayed maintenance.

The driving positions are also not to everyone's liking, so you definitely need to test drive or test sit one before you pull the trigger. They're a lot closer to an Alfa Spider than an X1/9 in that regard.

Neither the 400's or a Mondial holds any interest at all for me, but a 308GTB or a 308GT4 does. I really like the Dino's more than the Pininfarina 308's, but then I'm strange like that. I have driven a 400, and it wasn't all that to me. It was nothing like the 308 that I've also driven. It felt alive with a ton of feedback, but the 400 was just ok. My G35 at the time was better in every catagory, and a lot more enjoyable to drive to boot. Now it didn't sound as good...and it was an incredible sound....

So, long story short, I think if you bought a good one, it'd be probably cheaper than buying a Porsche with needs (done that). But it's the same old story, if it's one you want and you like it, who cares what we say!

I bought a 400 off eBay in 2002, kept it a couple months and sold it on eBay for a little more than I paid. It was a pile but I drove it about 2000 miles while I had it. The sound is awesome when it is attached to your foot but the driving experience was not spectacular. There was a yellow 308gt4 for sale at the time for a couple grand more than I paid which I wish I would have bought. I might still have that one.

Lots of good responses so far. My 308 is a '79, so the last year for Webers. My car also was converted to Electromotive ignition, so no issues with the dual distributors. So, for me, a major service is less than 1K in parts.

I love the huge varied types of car guys we have here on GRM

What about the 355? Those are starting to get cheaper and that was my favorite car as a kid.

OK, maybe, just MAYBE, I'll add a 308 to the old bucket list. I suppose if I found one with up-to-date maintenance and did my usual keep-it-for-a-year thing, I could probably avoid any huge cash outlays.

For me, it has to be the 308. Magnum PI, Christie Brinkley, and posters in my room in the early 80s mean it's the ultimate for me.