On the evening of May 31, not long before Toyota's big reveal of the GR Corolla Morizo, GR86 Cup car and GR86 Special Edition, Lexus debuted the RX 500h F Sport Performance.
Powered by a 2.4-liter hybrid powertrain, total output comes to&nb…
On the evening of May 31, not long before Toyota's big reveal of the GR Corolla Morizo, GR86 Cup car and GR86 Special Edition, Lexus debuted the RX 500h F Sport Performance.
Powered by a 2.4-liter hybrid powertrain, total output comes to&nb…
So, do you think that crossovers can make for trackable cars?
Yes.
And, I'd expect nothing less from the company that's raced a C-HR at the Nurburgring N24 in the past...
Hideous. Huge. Pig. Can a pig run? Yeah, very fast. Is it still a pig? Yeah, very much.
crossovers aren't SUVs. They are lifted cars. So can a crossover handle well? Yep. Just like a car can be made to handle well. Cx3, crosstrek, ch-r, just lifted versions of another car already in the line up.
I think we need to get that new Lexus to the FIRM....
Stelvio Quadrifoglio and the Grand Cherokee Trackhawk says "Hi!" :-)
just because you can doesn't mean I want to.
A crossover is an SUV without the off-road pre-tenses. They should be easy to get in/out of, comfortable to soak up miles on the road, and isolate me from the stresses of the outside world when i'm in it (quiet, good HVAC, comfortable, roomy).
A track toy is a race car that I can drive on the street without a helmet. It should be firm, fast, and light weight.
In the same way you can mix a great dane and chihuahua to create something called a Chi-Dane-Dane (I googled it, i don't recommend following my footsteps) you shouldn't mix an SUV and a track car.
A few years back, BMW introduced its X5 M at COTA. We got in some track time.
Later in the day, I went for a ride with Bill Auberlen. He didn't just hop the curbs, he pretty much ignored them. Lot of ground clearance, he smiled.
In reply to ClearWaterMS :
I googled it.
David S. Wallens said:In reply to ClearWaterMS :
I googled it.
sorry for the lost brain cells...
I applaud the efforts of taking CUVs (lifted cars) and lowering them.
Does that then just make them...cars?
In reply to John Welsh :
It's a boot designed for running.
Why not just make a sneaker?
It's a boot designed for running.
They should put that drivetrain in the Sienna and make a GR Sienna.
John Welsh said:I applaud the efforts of taking CUVs (lifted cars) and lowering them.
Does that then just make them...cars?
It is closest we are going to get to wagons in the US.
Tall cars, but yeah I guess.
I have daydreamed about what it would be like to lower an RDX or Macan and race one of those.....
I found this picture:
It looks like it's only a few inches taller than the TLX, and the maybe the driver doesn't even sit any higher. Obviously less than ideal, but it's not like you're driving an Expedition on the track....
In reply to BA5 :
MDX, and not an RDX... but, I think relevant to the discussion
further in the annals of pigs-n-lorries and race cars...
I feel like the idea that a single occupant going as fast as possible being the quintessential definition of a 'race car' losses something considering the history of racing... and the frequent import of transporting some items a 'goodly distance' in 'as short a time as possible'.
As the supply of traditional sedans, coupes, and hatchbacks gets more limited, I suspect that tracking crossovers will become more popular.
93EXCivic said:They should put that drivetrain in the Sienna and make a GR Sienna.
Note: I've suggested this to various Toyota reps today - even citing the Dodge Caravan R/T. They didn't seem to show their cards about their feelings about it. They did acknowledge that their Sienna does well. Millennials like me would eat up a sporty minivan.
I mean, they've got some history doing that already... they just didn't offer it to the public...
still got the t-shirt from that too 
Honda does the same thing with the Odyssey:
If Honda really went for it and released a 'Type R' Odyssey I'd be all over that. Even an 'Si' version would be pretty awesome. I'm a BIG fan of the Odyssey. It's so close already, they just need to turn it up a notch or two.
RaabTheSaab said:As the supply of traditional sedans, coupes, and hatchbacks gets more limited, I suspect that tracking crossovers will become more popular.
Does that mean I was a cutting edge, tend setter, 6 years ago? Ha.
Seeing minivans on track fills my heart with joy.
A dream swap of mine would be a Transit Connect with a FoST or FoRS drivetrain swap. Who needs a support vehicle when you are the support vehicle? Roll out the toolbox, tire cart, and tent and then get to work on the track.
With that being said I've always been about keeping cars dedicated to certain use. I.e., track only, tow only, daily only, with caveats that a few things can be combined occasionally. I think crossovers are very good daily vehicles and can be very utilitarian, but track vehicle they are not. Their height attributes to a higher CoG and lowering it to make it "track spec" takes away a lot of the utilitarianism (loading height for children in car seats, the elderly/elderly adjacent, heavy items in the rear cargo area, ride height for comfy road tripping/daily driving) that I'd attribute to a CUV. Vehicles such as the Model Y Performance or Ioniq/EV6 may bridge that gap due to the lower CoG due to battery placement and weight, but that is currently the exception, not the norm.
With that being said, I'd 100% buy an Odyssey Type R if it came with a DCT.
John Welsh said:I applaud the efforts of taking CUVs (lifted cars) and lowering them.
Does that then just make them...cars?
Not really. Most of the time when they raise them they do it by making the chassis taller, not by lifting the suspension. When they lower them, they lower the suspension.
So the final product even more berkeleyed up suspension geometry than either iteration and a lack of travel.
Either way, this isn't low. Its 68" high and has a 64" track. To me if it doesn't meet Solo Rollover regulations than I wouldn't call it "trackable"
John Welsh said:I applaud the efforts of taking CUVs (lifted cars) and lowering them.
Does that then just make them...cars?
Americans (and, by extension, much of the world) won't buy station wagons because... reasons, I guess.
Take a station wagon and raise it 3" and they will stand in line for the privilege of overpaying you for it.
David S. Wallens said:In reply to John Welsh :
It's a boot designed for running.
Why not just make a sneaker?
It's a boot designed for running.
THIS. ^^^^^
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